Syriza at the Helm

[PAOKSWEDEN]

Do you guys think that the army will consider a coup against the government if the turks start coming all over the Greek islands?

[gyros]

The best part is the army has no food to feed its soldiers but they are feeding Mohammad and Ahmad who would blow them up if they had access to explosives.  Nobody could have predicted such a bad government and its only getting worse.  This guy thinks he's a revolutionary.  Even the Castro brothers are seeing the writing on the wall.

Edited March 21, 2016 by gyros

[Klaous]

football is suffering because of the sociopolitical ideology and landscape....

 

 fix the politics then football will fall into line..

 

I heard BBC radio Hard Talk interview with a Syriza minister ...

 

Then I saw a CNBC interview with Kyriakos Mitsotakis.

 

if anyone gets a chance to listen to these two interviews...it is clear that Syriza are not fit to govern.....NEVER will be..professional radical agitators...

 

Mitsotakis has ideas, a clear vision...a modern Western statesman....

 

enough of the no tie, cheap leather jackets.......this is not a 1980 College debating class...this is meant to be a modern European country..

What do you expect from Mitsotakis? That he ends the corruption his own family benefited from for many years?

There are only a few politicians in Greece who have the competence to change something of significance in Greece without having a corrupt lobby behind them.

Yannis Boutaris would be a rare example for a competent and independent Greek politician. But people like him won't get elected for a special reason.

Instead we have to deal with corrupt and incompetent family dynasties like Papandreou or Karamanlis.

[Bananas]

What do you expect from Mitsotakis? That he ends the corruption his own family benefited from for many years?

There are only a few politicians in Greece who have the competence to change something of significance in Greece without having a corrupt lobby behind them.

Yannis Boutaris would be a rare example for a competent and independent Greek politician. But people like him won't get elected for a special reason.

Instead we have to deal with corrupt and incompetent family dynasties like Papandreou or Karamanlis.

 

Spot on regarding the dynasties.  This probably more than anything else has held back Greece from the 70's onwards.  Every country has families that have power, but the degree to which these families have power in Greece is ridiculous.  The sad thing is, in their own schizophrenic way, they probably believe they have done a good job.  Between these families, SYRIZA and Golden Dawn, I don't see any light at the end of the tunnel.  All of them are self entitled.  All of them are incompetent.

[RED SHERIFF]

Isn't Boutaris another commie?

[RED SHERIFF]

What do you expect from Mitsotakis? That he ends the corruption his own family benefited from for many years?

There are only a few politicians in Greece who have the competence to change something of significance in Greece without having a corrupt lobby behind them.

Yannis Boutaris would be a rare example for a competent and independent Greek politician. But people like him won't get elected for a special reason.

Instead we have to deal with corrupt and incompetent family dynasties like Papandreou or Karamanlis.

 

 

Greece has very few people capable of running the country...because the system does not allow for excellence..

 

we create cult figures in people like Xiros and N17.....

 

Kyriakos deserves a chance...he articulates well...he is young and educated and connected in the right European circles . He can't be held accountable for his father.....

 

the choice is between him or Tsipras....or other loser agitators?  take your pick..

 

Greece needs a modern statesman..

[PAOKSWEDEN]

Thanks to Syriza, Ert is now broadcasting news in arabic. Seriously WTF, we've now officially gone into the role of playing Sweden. Disappointed.

 

[gyros]

Haha!  Syriza doesn't care about Greeks.  They want open borders and every Paki, Syrian, and Afghani leaving in Greece with Mosques going up all around.  Only in Greece can these band of idiots be elected.

[RED SHERIFF]

Kiato?

[RED SHERIFF]

doxa  the commie from holland

[Bananas]

 

Kyriakos deserves a chance...he articulates well...he is young and educated and connected in the right European circles . He can't be held accountable for his father.....

 

the choice is between him or Tsipras....or other loser agitators?  take your pick..

 

You're right.  He shouldn't be held accountable for what his father has done.  I would choose Kyriakos (I'm also on a first name basis with him) if and when he renounces the old ways of graft and nepotism in Greece.  Yeah right, not going to happen.  The only difference in Greece between left/right, PASOK/ND, Tsipras/Mitsotakis is who is performing the corruption.  It's always been that way in Greece.  Nothing new under the sun.  I don't care for left, I don't care for right, I don't care for Tsipras and I don't care for Mitsotakis or any other "political" groups in Greece.  To me, they are all for the tip.

 

I'd like to know why you think electing any new leader (even a fair and competent one) will now make any difference to the people of Greece.  It may make a difference to the elite, or to the multi nationals looking to capitalise on easy opportunities, but to the average person it won't make a difference who is elected.  And that is because ... drum roll ... Greece can't scratch its left nut without asking permission from Germany.

 

So I just find this hatred towards Tsipras (and yes it does come across the way) surprising.  Yeah sure, he's a stooge, but I wouldn't call him ... evil.  I don't think he's there planning the destruction of Greece or the average person.  He's just caught up in a situation that is beyond him.  Besides, who really could do anything to really help Greece now anyway ?  Oh yeah, Kyriakos will come to the rescue.  I find it difficult to believe Kyriakos understands the needs or plight of the average Greek citizen, or has ever spent a waking moment ever thinking about them.

 

I will say this though.  It will be a miracle if he isn't the next Greek Prime Minister.  I mean, the kid deserves it.  His father and connections had nothing to do with him being in the position he's in.  It's ... normal to have generation and after generation of family members in parliament in a modern functioning democracy.  And this is what we want ...

[RED SHERIFF]

for someone that started the post with  'I don't care for left, I don't care for right'..

 

You then continued to write something that sounds straight out of the 'Hellenic rock throwing fraternity'..

 

Are you sure you don't listen to cassette tapes of Papariga late at night?

[Bananas]

for someone that started the post with  'I don't care for left, I don't care for right'..

 

You then continued to write something that sounds straight out of the 'Hellenic rock throwing fraternity'..

 

Are you sure you don't listen to cassette tapes of Papariga late at night?

 

Mr. Sheriff, please try reading the content of my post.  My argument is that nepotism is the main reason for Greece's situation.

 

I don't understand the rock thrower part.  Is the definition of a rock thrower someone that doesn't agree fully with your views ?  If that is the case, then yes I'm a rock thrower.

 

Like I have said many times (apparently to no effect) I don't have a particular liking for any political party in Greece.  But apparently in your eyes I am an extreme left wing rock thrower ?  Is that (again) just because I don't agree with your views ?  Maybe it's you that is extreme.

 

If Papariga is against nepotism, then yes, I agree with her on that point.  As to the rest of the communist ideologies, they are generally delusional.

 

Maybe it's time to grow up a little.  This is the SYRIZA topic.  It's not the "Only people that hate SYRIZA can post" thread, or the "Everyone who doesn't agree with me, is a leftist commie (check for reds under your bed and kiss the photo of the King)" thread.

[RED SHERIFF]

Mr.Banana

 

there is far more deeper issues to Greece's issues than nepotism.....

 

it's very simplistic and easy to blame nepotism.....

 

I'd say that many who are looking for a default and grexit...are looking for a way back to the old days.....including nepotism at it suits ..

 

 rock thrower is the way Tsipra and the far left have been conducting their campaign for a long time...

 

It is the Syriza thread....and syriza are an extreme lefty commie party....with delusional ideas as you say.....and for that they need to criticized.....

 

If anyone needs to grow up....it is the greek society and media who believe in these mythical enemies and wacky conspiracies...

[Brklyngrk]

SYRIZA is a product of unsustainable spending and broken promises made by PASOK and ND over the last 50 years.  When things were good, no one cared.  When things got bad, everyone suddenly noticed. Pasok got the first crack to fix the problem and couldn't, ND got a shot and was working towards it but ran out of time. The Greek people were tired of seeing the politically connected get jobs, become rich, all on the backs of the everyday Greek. The media kept showing the corruption and no one was getting prosecuted.  SYRIZA promised to overhaul the system and completely change the country.  The problem lies here.  The system does and can work if you have the proper management team. SYRIZA does not and it showed fairly quickly.  They quickly escalated an already bad problem and made significantly worse.  We need competent, smart people to take on these complex issues that Greece is going through.  Tsipras and co are not those people.  A good leader unites his people, they don't blame everyone for their issues.  I do have major hopes for Kyriakos.  His CV is impeccable.  He comes across as very knowledgeable and articulate. I am not saying he will solve all our problems, but he does seem to have a fundamental understanding of what the issues are and that is the first step in problem solving.

[RED SHERIFF]

I agree with a lot of what you say....

 

However I would add that the public in general need to understand the role of government and what government can provide.

A modern progressive government needs a healthy landscape to prosper....and not get bogged down with 'expectations' driven by self interest...

 

I think Greek politicians pander and grandstand to archaic non workable public opinion...

[RED SHERIFF]

was there any doubt..

 

they are a spin off from kke..  nothing more nothing less..

 

only possible reforms in greece will happen when they go..

I am not expecting one job or a change in a positive direction as long they are in power..

[RED SHERIFF]

Nothing modern or European about this thinking...

they have somehow confused hard core 1970s left ideology with pragmatism and reality..

[Bananas]

Don't worry kids.  I would say it's almost certain Kyriakos will win the next election and he'll fix ... everything.  The economy will grow at double digit pace, Turkish planes will be shot out of the sky, all the illegal immigrants will be removed and the debt to the EU will be repaid.  And he'll even throw in (as a bonus) that he'll put an end to nepotism (the irony).

Boy, I thought the U.S. had it bad having to pick between a baboon and a witch, but it's not really that much better in Greece.

[RED SHERIFF]

so...would you prefer Che Tsipara or Kyriakos as PM?

[Bananas]

2 hours ago, RED SHERIFF said:

so...would you prefer Che Tsipara or Kyriakos as PM?

This is indeed a tricky one.  Tsipras, I don't care for his ideology as it has not much to do with what he does in practise ... which is not much.  It's not like SYRIZA has turned all personal assets into the property of the state.  I would say a vote for Tsipras is a vote for not doing much at all.  A vote for inertia.  Which I suppose matches what he did during his university years.

A vote for Kyriakos is a vote for the old guard.  He may be bright, he may have good intentions, but I can't fathom how he could've got to where he is without having to pay back favours.  Which means more of the same.  Which means more of the clan in official positions.  Which means more people who aren't really qualified to be where they are.  Which means more nepotism.  Which means a lack of meritocracy.

It's like asking me what would I prefer.  A punch to the head or a kick to the stomach.  Honestly, if I had to vote in the next minute, I don't know who I'd vote for.

Is voting in Greece compulsory ?

Edited October 26, 2016 by Bananas

[Bananas]

@ThrylosG7

Ha ha, I was thinking more like if you ask 10 Greeks you'll get 11 opinions!

But the way things are now I don't think it matters anymore.  Regardless of who gets voted in they don't have much room to move economically.  I suppose (and I'm thinking as I'm typing) Kyriakos is the better choice as he'll be treated more favourably by the EU "elite".  They are far more likely to be sympathetic to him than towards Tsipras.  So there is that.  It would appear a vote for ND is the more practical approach to just get s%$#! done!  I mean, no one should really care about left wing or right wing with the way things are in Greece.  They should just care about how to improve the woeful economy.  About maybe providing some glimmer of hope to the next generation of young Greeks.

But then again, I was speaking to an acquaintance recently and he said to me "What crisis ?  The bouzoukia were full".  I'm sure we've all heard this at some point.  When I hear things like that it harms my will to live.

 

[athinaios]

Greek society is in crisis on a fundamental level, not just the financial sector. I agree, no matter who's in charge, if the country can't feed itself, and buy stuff it needs (like heating oil), there isn't much choice other than accepting the terms of lenders. I'm not saying the latter haven't put the knife to the bone, exhausting Greece and fueling fascism.

But, there's no reason the Greek gov can't modernize the public sector, fight corruption, etc. But, I also think the people have to rethink their attitude, starting by treating each other better, including respecting the environment and the land they occupy.

If you think that all ills are foreign-borne, then look at they institutions or organizations controlled 100% by Greeks, like EPO, the soccer league, etc...

[athinaios]

What I meant is that when there is a serious crisis in a country, extreme groups (fascists, anarchists) surface and gain followers. I don't think Xrysi Aygi would be as strong if Greece wasn't in such a bad mess.

In the 1930s, in the US during the Great Depression there were fascist and communist ..movements, because of the near collapse of the economic system.

When law and order and civic responsibility break down, and when people feel desperate, anarchism (like, I don't give a crap about anything) is fueled, but also at the same time fascist/ultra-nationalist parties gain power. You said it, in a way...  When you have foreign powers threatening or abusing the country (even if it's through economic means), and when you have an influx of immigrants who want a piece of your meager bread, it's expected to have ultra-nationlist/fascist parties gain.

[RED SHERIFF]

17 hours ago, ThrylosG7 said:

@RED SHERIFF What happened to Andonis Georgiadis - Ive heard him speak and he seems quite intelligent and charismatic to a certain degree..far more than other Greek politicians who inspire nothing . Do you or anyone know much about him ?? I thought he was on track to lead ND - did Kyriakos come from nowhere??

I think Georgiadis was not polished enough...

 

I think Kyriakos sounds well rounded, well educated....

We need to not let our bias of the family name turn us off..

Greece needs jobs, and vision...

If Kyriakos can deliver then that is good..

 

the structural reforms Greece needs can only be implemented with some like Kyriakos...well connected, well educated etc..

Greeks are living in dream land if they think the answer lies in some mythical new wave of politics that will  sweep the world and see capitalism fall .

They are a bizarre bunch who to me are looking for answers/solutions in places they don't exist..

 

1) reform education...make teachers more accountable

2)reform public service

3) make public servants accountable - give senior managers KPIs

4) cut red tape for business

5) smash closed professions

6) limit Union power to strike

7) allow foreign investment

8) fast track the legal system

9) restore proper law and order.