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17 hours ago, Alphonse said:

Good player Fountas who looks to have developed well in Austria.

Good points about JVS looking to put his stamp on authority with this group but keep thinking of how important Manolas could have been playing Italy & then Dzeko... he would know them so much better than anyone else. 

Fountas should be given a chance. I was actually a fan of his when he was at AEK. He was their best performer for them back in the day. Now he is scoring nearly every week. Would’ve taken him or Bouzoukis over Bakasetas. 

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The situation is messy.  Yes, we have our best 3 CB's out but the ultimate question is, who runs the team ?  JVS has let everyone know who he thinks it should be. Siovas had a HUGE brain fart mom

Yes Fetfa should play in Europe, but let's be realistic we have 3 guys on our team that don't even play for a club team and because Fetfa isn't playing in Europe all off a sudden he doesn't get called

Tsimikas is out with injury he suffered during the match with Aris, Koutris will replace him. 

Dzeko is missing match vs Greece and against Finland, big blow for Bosnias hopes to qualify. It's ashame we couldn't hang on for the draw at Finland and then I think Greece would have put Liechtenstein away leaving us in the running for qualification. 

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  • 2 weeks later...

Ethniki are capable of toppling Italy next time..could well look this way in 2020 ;

                                                               Vlahodimos

Bakakis/Retsos     Hatzidiakos/Manolas       Siovas/Sokratis       Stafylidis (C)

                                             Kourbelis                        Galanopoulos

         Limnios                                        Fortounis (VC)                            Donis

                                                        Pavlidis

 

Koulouris  Vrousai/Darmishaj  Fetfatzidis

Bakasetas Mantalos  Zeka  Androutsos  

Barkas  Dioudis  

This is after current attitude adjustments which are re-moulding some players.            

Edited by ausgreek
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I don’t know if we should include Manolas and Sokratis again. So far the replacements are proving themselves and we look decent. I know they play at bigger clubs but I would rather younger more hungry players who can develop. Hatzidiakos is an example. 

We need to find a replacement for Bakakis at RB. Retsos should be a candidate. But I would like someone who is more athletic with pace and good with the ball. Giannis Masouras fits the description. Kitsiou should be looked at. Lyratzis from Volos is another (I haven’t seen him play). 

I don’t think Stafylidis should be captain down the line. I don’t mind him but we need someone more stable and more consistent as a captain. Maybe Mantalos or Kourbelis should be the captain. Fortounis is great but don’t know if he is a real captain. 

Limnios and Donis are similar player. Loads of pace and great dribblers. Maybe we should have 1 start and either Fetfatzidis or Masouras on the other side. 

Wouldn’t mind having Galanopoulos and Kourbelis again. Hopefully something builds even more between the 2. Pavlidis, Limnios, Hatzidiakos and Galanopoulos impressed so they must be in considered for starting spots. Also we have Pelkas. Hopefully JVS can get something out of him. Pelkas has pace, energy, technique and the ability to score amazing goals. His pressing is one of the best for all Greeks. He just needs someone to instruct him and to express his strengths. 

We have 4 decent options at CAM. We have 4 decent options on the wing. We need more depth at RB and CM. Also Vasiliadis from Paderborn is being considered for a call up. 

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Seb Vasiliadis - Greek & German, or even Giannis Bouzoukis good value these young players. Pelkas is an enigma, I do wonder where JVS would play him, he is an AM or winger but Ethniki are well stocked all of a sudden. Although, it should Not be all of a sudden, its more that other coaches didn't try different options through fear of failure, in the Mykonos fc era.

Fortounis coming back soon hopefully, and firing for mine would mean Mantalos has no starting position and so not as captain cause Limnios, Donis, Fetfa and Masouras should be ahead of him for the wing spots. I wonder how Lamprou is fairing as well these days..

Staf was played as a left CB during the team's attacking raids (3 at the back) against Bos/Hertz, a different tactic. He is a safe and reliable LB with experience and a massive striker of a ball for goal from a distance. Has also ticks the boxes leading the team atm.

Sok and Manol should be in the mix as they now know JVS would have their balls if they pull a tantrum, although, Triantafylopoulos, Lampropoulos, Retsos along with Hatzi and Siovas are definite assets as CB options.  

A  more agile new RB option I agree would be ideal to have along with Bakakis, such as Stel Kitsiou or Lefteris Lyratzis. Either would be worth a run for sure under this current regime.

 

 

 

Edited by ausgreek
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I think we have better options at LB such  as Koutris and Tsimikas. I do like Stafylidis but he isn’t very reliable defensively. I don’t know where to put him because I like him as a player. He should have a spot somewhere but it seems that the bench is where he needs to be for now unfortunately. If Stafylidis was more solid defensively I would start him without a doubt and maybe even put him captain. But he isn’t. His shooting and speed is very good so again I don’t know exactly where he should play. Technically he is ok nothing special. Passing is decent aswell. We’ve got better CBs and better wingers to play. 

Could he play CDM? I don’t think so because Kourbelis and Galanopoulos had great showings. Zeca and Bouchalakis should be the back ups. Vasiliadis is a CM/CDM. Haven’t seen him play but apparently he is good. Want to see him play.

It does seem we are already stacked for wide options and CAM. I just think Pelkas if used correctly can be advantageous to us. Technically good, fast great energy on his day he can destroy teams, as seen in the past against Panathinaikos and Benfica. All of sudden these last few years he has more grit about his game and aggressiveness. CAM seems the best position for him but Fortounis is more talented and Bouzoukis seems to have more potential. 

Mantalos shouldn’t be ignored in my opinion. A great player that is slightly underrated. If he was faster physically he would be playing in England or something. He has all the attributes to succeed. Unfortunately injuries have stunted his development. Same can be said about Pelkas.

Sokratis and Manolas can stay aside for now. I don’t want to stop any momentum going forward. JVS has said that they won’t be called up until next year. So the remaining 2 games we will see more new call ups apparently. We will be getting headaches, but for the right reasons as we will have a plethora of options. 

 

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If Staf loses out to say, Tsimikas at LB, Fortounis or Kourbelis must be captain options. Having Fortounis, Vrousai and a firing Bakasetas (about time), then Mantalos would be on the fringe of the squad I would think.

That Pelkas is more of a utility player that plays anywhere in the front half of the team? He is also on the fringe with this squad. The players that have been given a chance and performed of late have caused alot of competition for spots which is excellent.

Deano, if your suggestion Vasiliadis, or even Bouzoukis gets a run then Bouchalakis should miss out, I don't think he offers anything special.

Edited by ausgreek
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Vasiliadis could take Bouchalakis spot. If given the chance he could impress and Bouchalakis would be put on the bench permanently. I like Vrousai, I think he has something to offer. His speed is something to think about. I believe with Bakasetas he only performs at CAM. He is of no use anywhere else. Vrousai is more of a winger i think. 

Bouzoukis will get his chances soon. Reminded me a bit of Ninis. He has that special something. Bouzoukis is more aggressive though. Has great vision and ball control. He is actually more or less like Mantalos but with more potential. Hopefully he stays injury free.

Speaking of utility players, Androutsos is one to keep an eye on. Can play anywhere in the midfield. More suited as a box to box. Hopefully he can get a good run of form. 

I believe Mantalos gives us this sort of spark. When he plays centrally he can be even more dangerous. Surprisingly Bakasetas did well especially against Bosnia. I don’t think he is a definite starter. Especially when Fortounis comes back. 

Mantalos i believe is a better captain than Kourbelis. Both can be leaders. Kourbelis can be vice captain and Mantalos captain. I just think Mantalos is a better example and more of a team player. Has great chemistry with everyone in the team.

Edited by Dean97
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All being available, the front half of the team perhaps like this:

Starters:

          Limnios         Pavlidis .      Fetfa

Kourbelis        Fortounis          Galanopoulos

Front half subs:

          Koulouris .  Donis 

Bakasetas      Mantalos/Vrousai/Bouzoukis      Masouras

Vasiliadis/Androutsos   Zeka 

''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''   

If Mantalos became captain. he gets in as a winger, Limnios or Fetfa sit on the bench. Now there are too many wingers so, Masouras or Donis may well miss out. Donis can play as striker too so, Bakasetas or Vrousai misses out if Masouras stays. 

Given this would be part of a 23 player squad. Can't pick too many cause they also add CB's, fullbacks, goalkeepers.

Would you change anyone around Deano?

 

            

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14 hours ago, Dean97 said:

 

Limnios and Donis are similar player. Loads of pace and great dribblers. Maybe we should have 1 start and either Fetfatzidis or Masouras on the other side. 

 

 Limnios is anything but a dribbler. He is a hard worker who is extremely disciplined. In terms of dribbling all he can do is cut right, any defender worth his salt will work him out within a few mins of playing him. Donis has more natural talent in comparison. Does that mean Limnios doesn't have a spot on the team? No, as we've seen coaches favour hard workers, he has pace and can be dangerous on the counter. But I don't really want him playing against teams that have a packed defense he generally struggles when there is no room.

He is also capable of putting a good ball into the box which if he is given the space to do can be dangerous

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We find people suggest players and captains and so on but they don't all fit into the squad design, a certain amount of players for every position and getting the balance right. Now we know what the coaching staff juggle every time these games come around.

For instance, playing Mantalos at LW, all of a sudden you have Donis, Masouras and Limnios, 3 LW's on the shelf. In many cases though, injuries usually prevent some of these problems as some players are not often available anyway. They forgot Donis's shirt size cause he hasn't played in so long apparently.

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8 hours ago, ausgreek said:

All being available, the front half of the team perhaps like this:

Starters:

          Limnios         Pavlidis .      Fetfa

Kourbelis        Fortounis          Galanopoulos

Front half subs:

          Koulouris .  Donis 

Bakasetas      Mantalos/Vrousai/Bouzoukis      Masouras

Vasiliadis/Androutsos   Zeka 

''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''   

If Mantalos became captain. he gets in as a winger, Limnios or Fetfa sit on the bench. Now there are too many wingers so, Masouras or Donis may well miss out. Donis can play as striker too so, Bakasetas or Vrousai misses out if Masouras stays. 

Given this would be part of a 23 player squad. Can't pick too many cause they also add CB's, fullbacks, goalkeepers.

Would you change anyone around Deano?

 

            

I would do the same but I wouldn’t put Bakasetas on the wing because of his pace. He is more suited in the middle, specifically CAM. I agree we can’t have all those players in team. I would definitely keep Mantalos and Donis. Limnios is the future and I lean towards more to playing future prospects as they are goodnand have something to prove for example Galanopoulos. We should at least have 3 wingers in the team. Masouras, Donis and Limnios. Fetfatzidis can be CAM and wing.  

No more than 2 strikers as Donis makes up for striker and wing. 2 CAMs such as Mantalos and Fortounis. Although I would definitely try Mantalos as a CM which would then free up the CAM spot for either Bakasetas or Vrousai. But Fetfatzidis is a good cover for CAM so Bakasetas and Vrousai wouldn’t be needed that much.

My squad would like this..

Vlachodimos 

G.Masouras Hatzidiakos Manolas Koutris

Kourbelis Vasiliadis/Androutsos

Fetfa Mantalos Limnios

Pavlidis

Androutsos, Masouras are my personal choices as I believe that have talent and when given the opportunity they will deliver. Realistically Galanopoulos would start as he has game time and also a decent player. 

Maybe Fetfatzidis should come off the bench as he can be impactful. Donis and Masouras are decent back ups. Manolas should be there as he is still sort of young and in his prime. Also playing Champions League. His speed is a big factor. 

Down the road I would like to see what Lamprou and Chatzigiovannis can offer. Also would’ve liked to see Manthatis but his career has been going down unfortunately especially after leaving Olympiakos. 

Like Douvikas and Manos but that’s too far fetched at the moment calling these players as one is young and isn’t playing but has potential and the other is a bit inconsistent.

Just thinking out load but Pavlidis is our best at the moment and Mantalos should be the captain and CAM. 

 

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4 hours ago, ausgreek said:

Deano, its a big call but when Fortounis comes back you have him on the bench as Mantalos is captain? Also, Masouras at RB..maybe he can excel there..hmmm.

Tough call for sure. I don’t think Fortounis goes straight in the starting 11. He’s just had a big injury. I just think Mantalos after the Bosnia game made me a believer. 

He has quality about him and has great chemistry with anyone as I said before. That’s why the past coaches have always played him. Fortounis is excellent on his day, again it’s a tough call but Mantalos is more of a good example. Humble, works hard and great on the ball. Fortounis is the same but I see more leadership qualities in Mantalos. Who would’ve thought the same way he did when he assisted Pavlidis? Very smart move he made there. Also Bakasetas did well to let it go. 

Stafylidis isn’t the best footballer and that’s why he shouldn’t be captain, but still very useful to have. Maybe not in a defensive way but more attacking and his long shots are dangerously good. I just think we have better LBs and CBs. I was all for Stafylidis to play but I’ve realised defensively he isn’t solid enough. When he attacks different story. Thunderbolt of a shot that hit the post against Bosnia.

Masouras the right back is talented enough to start. Also Natsos should get a look in.

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As far as RBs go, Masouras has appeared in 2 games so far this year for a grand total of 90 min....I think he was injured but there's no way he will be able to get into playing form for a while, so scratch that. Keep him in mind for the future, sure, but unless he gets playing time he won't be called up. Bakakis gets a lot of hate on this forum but he really hasn't done anything wrong the last 2 matches and runs non stop all game long. Much of the Bosnian attack was down his flank and he did well to keep them at bay....not to say that he's a sure fire starter but finding a suitable replacement right now is easier said than done....and replacing him with someone who doesn't merit the opportunity just because we don't like him is irresponsible. Let someone take his spot by playing well at club level first, then earning it at practice with hard work.

LB is a different story as we're stacked with viable options there: Tsimikas, Koutris, Giannopoulos, Lykogiannis and of course Stafylidis. Again Staf has done well the last 2 games and brings a lot to the table including a sweet left foot which is scarce at the NT. Except for Lykogiannis (who probably won't get called up anyhow) all the rest are defensive liabilities. Prior to Tsimikas recent run of good form, Oly had been going back and forth between Tsimikas and Koutris because of this. I like all 4 players and I think letting them hash it out and earning the start during practices as stated by the Schipmeister is fine by me.

The key is to have the DMs and wingers cover for them when the LBs/RBs attack and as shown in the last 2 games, the team will look good. Defensive play is a team responsibility.

I think that Schippy is more focused on building a team around a proper system rather than depending on individual assets and that's the way it should be, because this is what modern football is, and we don't have the individual talent to do otherwise.

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JVS seems to have changed the culture and mentality of this team in the few months he has been in charge. JVS said everyone thinks of Greece as a defensive first side but he wants to play more attack oriented system going forward as we saw vs Bosnia. There is still a lot of work to be done but one could only imagine how far ahead Greece would be had he had been hired from the beginning of the Euro qualifies. 

Greece have lots of promising young players going forward and I'm not sure if Sokratis or Manolas will see a call up especially if we get good results the next few games in November. 

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3 hours ago, Ellada2004 said:

JVS seems to have changed the culture and mentality of this team in the few months he has been in charge. JVS said everyone thinks of Greece as a defensive first side but he wants to play more attack oriented system going forward as we saw vs Bosnia. There is still a lot of work to be done but one could only imagine how far ahead Greece would be had he had been hired from the beginning of the Euro qualifies. 

Greece have lots of promising young players going forward and I'm not sure if Sokratis or Manolas will see a call up especially if we get good results the next few games in November. 

Great post. Schip has also said the more possession we have the more chances we will create. This is true and this is what he wants to team to play, possession. Against quality sides there is going to be more emphasis on defence ofcourse. 

He believes this team can play a aggressive and attacking style. I like the way he thinks too because he has said we can’t just play defensively we got to get the ball and move it forward. He doesn’t like playing it safe against equal to less teams. He thinks we are capable of playing good football and I agree. 

I don’t think Manolas and Sokratis will be needed if we continue in the right path. Better off playing players who are going to be the future now so they can get used to international football and get valuable experience early. Hatzidiakos did very well these past 2 games. He should start again. Same goes for Limnios. Schip wants to give other players chances which is good as he isn’t limiting the selections. 

 

I am a fan of Stafylidis like most and I would like to see him have a spot somewhere but Tsimikas and Koutris are better in defence. They have more pace and make dangerous forward runs to. Stafylidis has pros and cons. We need to use him correctly. I don’t think he should be the number 1 LB. maybe off the bench he could be used as an impact and if we revert to a 3-5-2 formation he either play as the 3rd cb or LWB where he can just focus on putting crosses or getting into dangerous positions. Also we should use his biggest strength in my opinion which is his shooting.

Edited by Dean97
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8 hours ago, AchillesHeel said:

As far as RBs go, Masouras has appeared in 2 games so far this year for a grand total of 90 min....I think he was injured but there's no way he will be able to get into playing form for a while, so scratch that. Keep him in mind for the future, sure, but unless he gets playing time he won't be called up. Bakakis gets a lot of hate on this forum but he really hasn't done anything wrong the last 2 matches and runs non stop all game long. Much of the Bosnian attack was down his flank and he did well to keep them at bay....not to say that he's a sure fire starter but finding a suitable replacement right now is easier said than done....and replacing him with someone who doesn't merit the opportunity just because we don't like him is irresponsible. Let someone take his spot by playing well at club level first, then earning it at practice with hard work.

LB is a different story as we're stacked with viable options there: Tsimikas, Koutris, Giannopoulos, Lykogiannis and of course Stafylidis. Again Staf has done well the last 2 games and brings a lot to the table including a sweet left foot which is scarce at the NT. Except for Lykogiannis (who probably won't get called up anyhow) all the rest are defensive liabilities. Prior to Tsimikas recent run of good form, Oly had been going back and forth between Tsimikas and Koutris because of this. I like all 4 players and I think letting them hash it out and earning the start during practices as stated by the Schipmeister is fine by me.

The key is to have the DMs and wingers cover for them when the LBs/RBs attack and as shown in the last 2 games, the team will look good. Defensive play is a team responsibility.

I think that Schippy is more focused on building a team around a proper system rather than depending on individual assets and that's the way it should be, because this is what modern football is, and we don't have the individual talent to do otherwise.

Stafylidis and Bakakis were at fault for the 2nd goal against Bosnia. Bakakis didn’t do enough to close the cross down and Stafylidis was caught out of position because his pressed and ran to forward to close down earlier. They need to do better there. 

I will give Bakakis credit for his energy and forward runs but that is where it stops. In the ball he is a liability. Gets nervous most of the time when he has the ball and he usually fumbles it either passing it to an opposing player or can’t control the ball and loses possession. Down the road Masouras should be considered. Also we have Natsos who has been in good form. 

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If we continue to improve under JVS I think I would keep Socrates, Manolas, off the time for a while as I don't want these guys coming in and disturbing the culture of the team and all the hard work JVS has done. Even though they are great players there attitudes might be a cancer in the dressing room. Its much easier to get young guys and a new team to buy into a system sometimes then veterans who play for big clubs and big coaches that might have egos. We have guys that can fill there roles who offer good pace. I personally would finish this entire qualification without them and only bring them back in a friendly leading up to the Nations leagues and see if it improves the team if not I say leave them off and move forward with a new core of players and new mentality..

Edited by J1078
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23 hours ago, Dean97 said:

Great post. Schip has also said the more possession we have the more chances we will create. This is true and this is what he wants to team to play, possession. Against quality sides there is going to be more emphasis on defence ofcourse. 

He believes this team can play a aggressive and attacking style. I like the way he thinks too because he has said we can’t just play defensively we got to get the ball and move it forward. He doesn’t like playing it safe against equal to less teams. He thinks we are capable of playing good football and I agree. 

I don’t think Manolas and Sokratis will be needed if we continue in the right path. Better off playing players who are going to be the future now so they can get used to international football and get valuable experience early. Hatzidiakos did very well these past 2 games. He should start again. Same goes for Limnios. Schip wants to give other players chances which is good as he isn’t limiting the selections. 

 

I am a fan of Stafylidis like most and I would like to see him have a spot somewhere but Tsimikas and Koutris are better in defence. They have more pace and make dangerous forward runs to. Stafylidis has pros and cons. We need to use him correctly. I don’t think he should be the number 1 LB. maybe off the bench he could be used as an impact and if we revert to a 3-5-2 formation he either play as the 3rd cb or LWB where he can just focus on putting crosses or getting into dangerous positions. Also we should use his biggest strength in my opinion which is his shooting.

We have lots of options in the back. A solid and consistent #9 is what we lack. Hopefully Pavlidis can continue to develop. I'm not to sure if Koulouris is NT material, he is a good club player but he seems to lack confidence with the Ethniki. He should have finished his chance vs Italy it was a huge turning point in the match. I doubt Mitroglou in that position would have missed. I don't mind seeing Koulouris get a few more chances though and will see from there. 

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7 hours ago, J1078 said:

If we continue to improve under JVS I think I would keep Socrates, Manolas, off the time for a while as I don't want these guys coming in and disturbing the culture of the team and all the hard work JVS has done. Even though they are great players there attitudes might be a cancer in the dressing room. Its much easier to get young guys and a new team to buy into a system sometimes then veterans who play for big clubs and big coaches that might have egos. We have guys that can fill there roles who offer good pace. I personally would finish this entire qualification without them and only bring them back in a friendly leading up to the Nations leagues and see if it improves the team if not I say leave them off and move forward with a new core of players and new mentality..

Ya they are great players. I have Italian friends who can't believe they were left of the NT vs Italy. I'm sure that pissed then off especially Manolas who plays in Serie A. I love the passion Sokratis shows on the field but unfortunately there is a disconnect. Manolas is a fabulous defender but he has been termed a "tricky" character. 

If the coach sees that they have changed there tune than I wouldn't mind having them called up for Nations league but ATM we have good options at the back. 

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We all know we have a lot of options at the back but at the moment this is how I see it. 

Mavropanos and Retsos haven’t been playing for a while and Mavropanos is injury prone. Kyriakos Papadopoulos is a solid option but is very injury prone and isn’t playing right now. Players like Lampropoulos, Kolovetsios and Triantafylopoulos are not really good enough compare to Manolas and Sokratis.

Now I’m all for having Manolas and Sokratis sit out, as the team seems to have a good rhythm going and I don’t any disturbance. The CBs that are the most reliable now are Hatzidiakos, Siovas, Risvanis(who is underrated and should be given a chance) and Kourbelis who can also play there. You have them and Sokratis and Manolas to choose from. The rest need to prove themselves more or play at a higher level. 

If you have Manolas and Sokratis in the team then common sense tells you to start them. If you don’t have them then you have to rely on players I mentioned and the one that are not playing at a higher level.

JVS continuously says he wants to try new players that are young and players that haven’t been given a shot. He’s also said playing in the Greek league doesn’t make a difference in terms of selection. He’s also said Greece are capable of playing aggressive and attacking style of football. Which is true. He is not freezing out anyone and welcoming all options. This is a smart decision. 

I would rather have Manolas or Sokratis instead of Lampropoulos or Triantafylopoulos. But if Mavropanos and Retsos start playing and are in form then they should be considered the next that take over from Manolas and Sokratis. If we want to prepare for the World Cup in 2022 than we shouldn’t be playing players that are 30 and over. That’s the way I think it should be. 

Sokratis will be 34 and Manolas will be 32 by then. Sokratis has stated that if we don’t make the Euros then he will retire, as he wants the new generation to prove themselves. These were his words. 

JVS wants to give players like Pelkas, Bouchalakis, Masouras and Mantalos the leading roles as they are in there mid 20s and by the time the World Cup comes around they will be in their primes. He also wants the youth to be in the team like Limnios, Hatzidiakos and Pavlidis in the mix. 

A rebuild is about playing the youth and building the team from there. Not playing 30 year olds and over which is made me think why Zeca and Siovas were picked. They are still decent options to have. 

As far as strikers go Pavlidis should be the starter with Koulouris and Donis behind him. I would prefer Donis out wide where his pace would be more useful as he wouldn’t have a CB marking him so tightly and would have more space on the wing where he can do damage. As we have seen JVS is capable of making some of our average players like Bakasetas play there best game. He has made every single play at their best which is incredible. I hope this momentum continues and wins in our next matches.

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Good stuff. In regards to Sokratis i heard him say he would retire after this euro but I don't see him walking away just yet. I think he will want to go out on better terms and not the way everything has gone down recently. He is still very useful and I watched him today with Arsenal his defending was solid and he scored a goal and another that was taken away by VAR. If he is committed and wants to be a team player for the Ethniki than I think JVS should not rule out using him. He is getting up there in years but the key is to have him help us qualify for the WCUP and then will see if he can help us should we make it to Qatar. 

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