Batigol Posted January 18, 2005 Share Posted January 18, 2005 Given the recent sale of Kyriakos to Rangers, it got me thinking about all the players that PAO have let go or sold in the last 2-3 years and it sort of took me by surprise as to how many key and influential players have actually left in the last little bit. While player movements are to be expected, after all, we all love to see the names that pop up on the transfer markets in the summer and January, I was taken aback by the following names, and I looked to see who they were replaced with. Needless to say, with a few exceptions, it hasn't been pretty. Karagounis Nikopolidis Fyssas Seitaridis Lymberopoulos Kyriakos Chalkias Basinas (it's just a matter of time I believe) Epalle :LOL: (I know, who really cares!!) Warzycha (I know he retired but I believe he had a positive influence on the team) Kollka In my books, many if not all of the players would always be in the starting line-up for a football club (Epalle EXCLUDED!) Have I missed anyone? I've just found it very weird that PAO's management have sold or given away these just for next to nothing. Any thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evergreen Posted January 18, 2005 Share Posted January 18, 2005 Well, here's the situation on each one: 1) Karagounis: His contract was expiring and PAO offered him 1 year before it's expiry the same amount they offered Basinas 270mil drx. He rejected it, became a free agent and signed at Inter with almost double. Verdict: Impossible to hold onto him since he was offered more money from a bigger club. Missed or not missed: Missed We had to wait another 6 months for Gonzalez to come since Sanmartean that was bought instead of Karagounis is injury prone. 2) Liberopoulos: was inconsstant in his carrer and only really played well and scored heavily when his contract was expiring. He was disliked by Zajec as holding cliques and having too much power in the dressing room. Verdict: Contract expired and new contract was not offered. Missed or not missed: Not missed Papadopoulos took his place and has been fantastic. 3) Fyssas: Benfica made offered him a contract for more money he made at PAO, whilst it's unclear if PAO would have offered him a new contract. Verdict: never showed any intentions of resigning him since they wanted t play Munch in his position. Missed or not missed: Not missed Munch was the best forrign player last year with many excellent games. 4)Seitaridis: Had 6 months left in his contract. PAO always had the intention to sell him since many clubs were interested in him. The EURO helped and Seitaridis was given a lot more money PAO would have been willing to offer Missed or not missed: Missed Vyntra who has taken his position has been very good, but Seitaridis is world class both in defence and attack. 5) Kolka: contract expired and PAO sdid not want to renue him so he left. Did help in his time and PAO only recently just signed wingers in Wooter and Charalampides. Remains to be seen what they can do. Missed or not missed: Missed 6)Vokolos: Was past his best and only natural wasn't renewed when his contract ended. Missed or not missed: Not Missed 7)Michaelsen: was not renewed due to financial differences. Was a consistant performer although an average player. You could depend on him to give you 7/10 ever game. Missed or not missed: missed Maric has never convinced as much as the Big Dane. Wooter and Charalampidis will make up for him. I'm sure. Warzycha: it's only natural for him to retire. He was 39. The Warzycha of 39 is not missed. The 30 year old would have. Nikopolidis: Oly offered more money and moved there. Missed or not missed: Missed Neither Chalkias or Galinovic have his proven track record. In time though Galinovic does show that he can do well. I won't comment on the playwers that Just left though, Epale and Chalkias won't be missed. It remains to be seen for Kirgiakos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drakos13 Posted January 18, 2005 Share Posted January 18, 2005 Seitaridis couldnt stay.....he was destined for higher things. Problem is he was worth more than 2 million before the euro too......his value goes up after competing in the euro tournament and people would see his talent. (and look in know we werent going to win we wouldnt have dreamnt, but still we knew the team would go and play their hearts out and had a good chance of next round---- if beating spain ukraine and then 15 games unbeaten conceding 4 goals in qualifying wasnt a big enough hint that our team could play football, i dont know what to say to you) Lybe- awful move let the leading scorer go on a free transfer..... great player great loyalty, Not one excuse for letting him go like that. very difficult player to replace, we got Papa but why not have both and a stronger team??? Lybe was flexible to play diff positions too....... Kirgiakos----- crap idea to let him go and not resign him, let him off for 2 milllion isnt half his value.....he also is not easily replaced at all. Chalkias- hes still here. they just wont even let him on the bench. Stupid move by PAO to treat a good and loyal goalkeeper liek that who has been patient for a long time and shown he deserves that spot (anybody say anything about rosenborg has never been or has any clue about goalkeeping) replaceable though not with as much heart ...... Basinas- i dont really care anymore - its time to cash him in. replaceable Epalle- who is the moron that suggested this guy? Warzycha- man hes 40.....id like to see him on the coaching staff or as a scout. PAO owes it to him. and id love to see him maybe manage one day... Kolkka- i dont know his story only that he was incredible, and we should have resigned him. not easily replaced at all...... Karagkounis wanted to leave---- i think hell come back in a few years though... Michaelsen should have stayed- we havent had any right wing the first half of the season, consistent diciplined, and was overall pretty good. but now we have bidis and wooter so were ok. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trifilli Posted January 18, 2005 Share Posted January 18, 2005 PAO seems to have a relaxed attitude when it comes to resigning players. Manolis excluded, I do not remember recently pursuing a player aggressively. We sell too early, too low, or let them go for free. Players see that, and they do not expect to be here for long. A team that does not show commitment or respect to their players, will never instill the confidence required for greatness. Constant changes destabilize the team, and take valuable time When is the time to reinvest back to the team? PEACE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Protathlitis Posted January 18, 2005 Share Posted January 18, 2005 Nikopolidis: Oly offered more money and moved there. Its a bit worse than that. When you say pao couldent keep these players because of wages, I hope your not excusing your management, pao could easily offer them good money they just dont. Also with Chalkias Im suprised the same thing happened again; what Greek will want to keep for yous now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lalin Posted January 18, 2005 Share Posted January 18, 2005 I personally like the way PAO management operate in terms of buying / selling /not renewing players. I think it is the perfect way of running a busines plus keeping the fans interested. I for one prefer to see new , fresh players coming in. I would not like to see the same 8 players for 6 years in a starting lineup. We buy them young and inexpesive, and sell them when they have matured (Seitaridis, Kyrgiakos, possibly Basinas). I cannot remember the last time PAO was so complete in terms of depth. We basically have 2 players in each position. And in time players like Bides, Wouter, Anderson, Vyntra, will prove valuable assets. I am in favour of any Greek that wants to move abroad. Especially to major clubs with great history in their respective countries(Porto, Benfica, Glasgow). There was no way we could have kept Giourkas and Kyrgiakos and I wish them all the best. They deserve it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GS1905 Posted January 19, 2005 Share Posted January 19, 2005 I'm afraid all of the players who have left for money are and will be quite regretful of their decisions...Karagounara, Kyriako... But the guys who go abroad to take more steps into their careers will not be denied... Giourkas, Fissas... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trifilli Posted January 19, 2005 Share Posted January 19, 2005 The ONLY goal for PAO SHOULD be to win a Euro trophy :tup: PAO has done everything else... That will keep the fans interested much longer than the transfer "soap opera" The way PAO does "business", it shows that making $$$ is the primary goal and NOT excellence :tdown: When every time we get a descent transfer we turn arround and SELL a great player, we keep making steps backwards, which is self defeating :angry: PEACE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HOLLYWOOD Posted January 19, 2005 Share Posted January 19, 2005 i think we took a step forward with bidis and wooter however took a step back by selling Kirgiakos, and perhaps another step back with basinases possible transfer.... i think the reason why most fans r "angry" with managment is because they sell most of our core players for cheap amounts then dnt even invest the money back with decent transfers... lets say we get the 2 mil from the Kirgiakos deal, we wont even spend 1/4 of it on a new player.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vasili0s Posted January 19, 2005 Share Posted January 19, 2005 I'm afraid all of the players who have left for money are and will be quite regretful of their decisions...Karagounara, Kyriako... But the guys who go abroad to take more steps into their careers will not be denied... Giourkas, Fissas... I'll disagree, well karagounis and fyssas in the least. karagounis is getting mega exposure to other serie a clubs all these years, and now he is starting to work his way into inter milans play cycle, which will be a HUGE barometer as to what he will be doing in a few years with his career (from the brilliant to the shed), so i believe he's on the right track at least, now.As for Fyssas, i dont see much for the man, isnt he nearing his 30's now ro there already ? Sure Benfica is one of the finer clubs within .pl, yet i really cant see anything higher in his scope at this point of his career, and knowing his capablities. Getting to the topic, I beleive Lymberopoulos and Karagounis/Seitaridis are PAO's biggest misses. No one has covered seitaridis obviously, karagounis' work rate was unbeleivable even if he was off a particular night and you cant help but cringe at what lymbe is doing now again, but with reborne AEK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HOLLYWOOD Posted January 19, 2005 Share Posted January 19, 2005 Takis is 31 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elastonpappou 13 Posted January 19, 2005 Share Posted January 19, 2005 I will agree with Karagounis's miss. Nobody can argue that Karagounis is easily replaced in a middle class team like PAO... But don't forget that Karagouna WANTED to go... He agreed with Inter 6 months prior to leaving PAO and at his last performances he was crap... The rest I think nobody is missed, especially Lybe... Papadopoulos is much better... Fyssas we got Munch, while Vyntra has performed exceptionally (even better than the last performances of Giourka...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drakos13 Posted January 19, 2005 Share Posted January 19, 2005 Lybe is just as good. We shouldnt have let him go free, also lybe could play midfield roles well too. why go out and sign debbah and keep vlaovic when we could have just resigned lybe???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evergreen Posted January 19, 2005 Share Posted January 19, 2005 Nikopolidis: Oly offered more money and moved there. Its a bit worse than that. When you say pao couldent keep these players because of wages, I hope your not excusing your management, pao could easily offer them good money they just dont. Also with Chalkias Im suprised the same thing happened again; what Greek will want to keep for yous now? You have a point there, a very valid one.All the fans were on Nikopolidhs' side until he decided to go to Oly. He could have gone to ANY team in the world and everyone would still be on his side. But he went to the one PAO fans regard "taboo". From that moment on, he loses all the support from the fans not matter how rational or just his decision is. I don't blame him for going to Olympiakos' better money but he can accept no sympathy from me having made such a move being the fans beloved player. Nikopolidis had 15 years of history with us, we cared about him and his history with the club. If Mitu was to to to Olympiakos, no one would care. Simply because his history with PAO is insignificant. The same thing happend 15 years ago with Apostolakis who left Olympiakos to go to PAO for more money. Only this time it was the Olympiakos fans in the PAO fans role. i remember having some massive arguments with Pappou about Nikopolidis because I had taken his side whislt , Pappou was supporting the PAE's decision to get him dropped because he had already agreed with Olympiakos and he was a Trojan horse. I still don't know how the hell Pappou ever found out that early when he was initially dropped, that he had already agreed to accept Kokalis' money and that he had spoken to Kokkalis before he spoke to PAO. That's why he was blunt in asking for 600.000 euro's. I'm sure if he hadn't spoke to Kokkalis before hand he would never have thrown that amount in if he hadn't due to the situation Greek football is in currently. This is one of the few, if not only argument I was wrong about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trifilli Posted January 19, 2005 Share Posted January 19, 2005 Bottom line kakalis valued Antonis more than kavouroxeris :o That is a shame, a disgrace and an embarrassment On top of that, he sends him to the stands for 6 months to destroy him ... right before the Euro, which makes him a traitor to say the least. Not that he cared about the Greek NT :gr: ...which his negative comments proved :box: Everyone has an opinion about Anotnis. One thing is for sure, he was the victim. To take vardinokaulis side on this matter out of spite for Antonis leaving to gauros, is not only unfair but narrow minded! History has shown repeatedly how the kavouria treat PAO players when it comes to contract negotiations They only re-signed Manoli after he failed his physical in England, they were ready to let him go too. The same will continue to happen until PAO fans start getting MAD as hell :angry: As soon as an offer comes, PAO will be happy to sell, not only Kyrgiako, but the whole team! Gonzo, Gouma, Munch, Papa, Mihalaki, no one is safe I have played football for a long time and I know that any player will perform his best when appreciated. Is that what PAO players see from their owner lately? It is elementary math to figure out that all the income from the CL, TV, tickets, copyrighted merchandise, player sales, is unaccounted for, and grossly over the $ spend for incoming transfers :tdown: They operate this way because our love for PAO is blind, as true LOVE always is. They are counting on the fact that a tiny Leoforos will be full no matter what. May PAO get the future stadium asap which should be double the capacity. If they play the same tune then, I surely hope they will be surprised to play in front of empty seats :nono: PEACE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adonis Posted January 20, 2005 Share Posted January 20, 2005 Antonis was not the victim. He was the one that came out smiling and signing up to become a MELOS!!!!!!! :angry: He came out making more money and thats what he cared about. He pissed all over his 15 yr career with us when he went behind our backs and spoke to Kokkalis. After 15 yrs in Greek football at PAO you would expect to understand and know of the rivalry between the two teams. For me he is a traitor - and if he is happy with his 200,000 extra than so be it. I hope his not expectying any favours from thyra 13 when we play him in Leoforos next. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYC_Olympiakos Posted January 20, 2005 Share Posted January 20, 2005 player last year with many excellent games. 4)Seitaridis: Had 6 months left in his contract. PAO always had the intention to sell him since many clubs were interested in him. The EURO helped and Seitaridis was given a lot more money PAO would have been willing to offer Missed or not missed: Missed Vyntra who has taken his position has been very good, but Seitaridis is world class both in defence and attack seitards was actually sold right in the begginning of euro 2004pao would have gotten alot more money and offers for him had they waited a month but how did they know how great Greece was going to be Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chameleon65 Posted January 21, 2005 Share Posted January 21, 2005 The way PAO does "business", it shows that making $$$ is the primary goal and NOT excellence :tdown: When every time we get a descent transfer we turn arround and SELL a great player, we keep making steps backwards, which is self defeating :angry: Trifili I agree with you and other comments you've made but also adding to the fact that changing coaches regularly destabilizes things and the team doesn't progress. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Prasinos Posted January 21, 2005 Share Posted January 21, 2005 Karagounis and Seitaridis are the two biggest losses. The way Kyriakos was playing he will be a pretty big loss in the near future Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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