Elastonpappou 13

CH we are not an charity house... Why should we build a stadium and gift it to Dimo Athineon? Don't forget that we are also giving Leoforos to Dimo which is PAO's property!!! :angry: The only way Tzigger will accept this is only if he doesn't have to put a single penny on it... Then fine, let the bloody Dimos build the stadium and we can also name it Dora Bakogianni!!!! :angry: OYST!!!!! :box:

So let me get it streight.... We give away leoforos worth of 20bn to the Municipality of Athens... Then we are expected to go to this shitty place near Eleona... Then we are expected to BUILD the stadium.. And all that for what? For the new stadium to belong to Dimo? F&&&K OFF!!!!! If you want a stadium belonging to Dimo build it yourselves ALHTES!!!! :box: Tzigger, don't put a single penny for the bloody stadium!!!! :angry:

What do you mean by "people of Votaniko"? The only people at Votaniko are homeless refugees and tsigannoi!!! There are no properties to live there... The place its full of old factories!!! Well said by Mr. Souflias... People who live at goudi have a problem with the stadium at Goudi, Mayors at Helliniko have a problem of bringing the stadio to Helliniko, now people of Votaniko have a problem, lets get the stadium build in EVOIA!!!!! :P OYST KOPRITES!!!!!!! :box:

I didn't!!! I still prefer Goudi, but at least Votanikos is much better than Helliniko.... Although it is very close to Eleona (the solution offered to us LONG AGO) it is within the municipality of Athens....

Are you crazy re? You think that is ugly? Have you seen Kokkaliskaki? I am actually praying that the ground will look fairly like the one in the picture... I actually like it a lot!!!! :tup:

Yesturday PAE (Tzigger), KAE (Pavlos) and Erasitexnis (Thanassis) all agreed to the solution of Votaniko... I must admit that it looks much better than Helliniko bearing in mind that Goudi is almost imposible due to the reasons we mentioned earlier.... Also the stadium is going to be 45.000, and a new metro station will open in the beginning of 2007!!! It will be the next station of Monastiraki in the blue line.... Now all that is left is for PAO to go and discuss with Bakogianni in the terms of financing... Dimos Athineon WILL have to finance part of the build up due to the high value of Leoforos and the low value of the area of Votanikos.... The meeting will take place sometime next week...... For now just have an idea of the "Leoforo Arena"!!!! PROSKYNATE APISTOI TON NAO!!!!! :nw: :nw: :nw:

Are you crazy re.... You prefer the ghost-area of Votanikos than Goudi the area wher PAO was born and it has its history connected to it? Votanikos is a s***y place full of homeless refugees... You can't even walk there at night without having a gun!!! Why should PAO solve the problem and appreciate the entire area? And I tell you this... What will the government give to PAO for an exchange of Leoforos? If Leoforos is worth X then the same amount of space (not to mention the already build ground at leoforos) costs X/20!!! This means that if PAO decides to go there, not only he has to have almost the ENTIRE area of Votanikos but the government should also PAY for the build up of the stadium!!!! You can give away property worth of 20bn and receive land worth 1bn!!!! :o As far as Mrs Bakogianni is concerned, what can somebody say... She is a joke along with the rest of the clowns of the Government... She is speaking of parks in the area of Goudi and Leoforos and nobody gives her the finger and ask her? What happened to Omonoia where it was supposed to be full of Green and trees?(that is what she promised before her election!!!), What happened to the El. Venizelos park after the PASOKIA gave Licence to Mr. Arxi-pasoko-Labraki to build Megaro Moussikis? Where are all the undergound parkings and where are all the thousends of meters of Green promised by her couple of years ago? OYST!!!! :box: PAO is not going to be exploited and become a victim again... We are NOT going to solve any other Social / demographic problems of Dimo Athinaion.... :nono: :nono: :nono: THELETE DE THELETE TO GHPEDO TOY PAO THA GINEI STO GOUDI PALIO ALHTES!!!!!

Nothing new... From in.gr

First of all I take this statement as a joke not a serious sentence.... The best Metro in Europe? :o You must be kidding!!!! If you say the most poshy, clean, new, then OK I agree (which is much worse than Moscow's even on poshyness)... But in terms of helping people move around? Its probably the worst in europe!!! The metro in Athens serves only few areas, whilist it doesn't even pass from the most populated areas (Zografou, Kipselli, Pagrati etc etc)... Even Helliniko that you mention, there is no Metro to there... The Metro will take you as far as the beginning of Vouliagmenis Av. which is just a little bit further than Dafni... Then you will either need to take the bus, or even worse get the useless tram (which takes 1.5 hours from Syntagma to Glyfada) to go there....Also Almamattar: The PAO ground is not onother instrument for arguiong with the Geys... I don't wont a 50,000 stadium just for the sake of saying that I have a bigger stadium than Kokkaliskaki.. People who have been following footbal know exactly how Kokkaliskaki was build... And to be honest with you SIZE doesn't matter... What would you do with a 50.000 stadium if 5,000 fans went there? Would you go to your gey friends and argue that PAO has a biger ground than OSFP? What is the point? At least the geys got a stadium at their own district, reflecting their beliefs, historyand traditions and they are happy with it.... That is what I want for PAO. Something that reflects what PAO is and what PAO was, his original roots, his birth place, his Athenean fan base... How can I say this... I EVEN LIKE THE SOUND OF "GAMIETAI O PAO KAI H LEOFOROS" if you know what I mean.... I wouldn't want to hear in couple of years time something like "Gamietai o pao kai to Helliniko!!!" but most of all I prefer "ETSI GAMEI H LEOFOROS!!!!" This has been going around for almost 100 years and Goudi can still be considered "leoforos" because its the same area... Helliniko sucks big time and is s%$#!!!!! Anyway today is the meeting with the Aliti Souflia!!! Tzigger will pressure for Goudi but he will try to get some reassurance that the work and the build up it is goingto be smooth without any interuptions from the mayers or the population.... Lets see what happens...

You will see... The people you see going at Leoforos are mostly the people who live nearby... And its not just the distance but people will also refuse to go due to morality reasons... :P Can't you remember OAKA... We were 3.000 - 5.000 at OAKA which is fairly close to Abelokipi and to other PAO fan bases such as Kifissia, Maroussi, Psychico, Holargo, Halandri etc etc....

M Kafe, Karaiskai WOULD fill if it was bigger but the gey-roi have a different mentality than us... The problem of Leoforos is not the capacity nor the poor condition of the stadium nor the ticket prices... You are right on attendances at OAKA on big European nights, but in normal league games (apart from derbies) we were never more than 15.000... ;) This is the mentality of the PAO fans unfortunately... If its too warm we will sweat so we don't go to the game, if its too cold we will catch a flu and we don't go to the game, if it is raining we will get wet and we don't go... We need the perfect weather conditions, the perfect players, the perfect stadium and most importantly the perfect OPPONENT... If we play against Juventus yes we may fill a 50,000 stadium at Helliniko but in normal league matches I don't see more than 3.000 going... Especially if the ground is at Helliniko!!! ;) By the way latest news from contra.gr....

I think 50 would be too much bearing in mind that we usually tend to be 12-15000 (even back at OAKA).... But yes the PAO stadium is said to be for a bid of the 2012 euro... This is the only reason they are actually thinking of building a stadium.... But the bottom line is... Are they building the stadium for having a serious bid for the 2012, or are they actually doing it for PAOs welfare... I just hope that Tzigger pressures them, and not doing it THEIR way!!! ;) Screw Helliniko and Screw Votaniko and Eleona!!!! GOUDI or NOTHING!!!! :angry:

Almamatter, you seem to forget that a serious ivestment doesn't look to capture the one-off fan who will visit Athens once a year and go to a PAO game.... The investment should be targeted to the PAO BASE fan, and they will be the ones supprting the team in the entire season!!! And they live near Abelokipi!!!Also the investment must consider the inflows on ANY business day other than the day of the match... Do you honsetly feel that a PAO supporter from Abelokipi or Goudi or Zografou will take the bus to go one hour away to have a coffe at Helliniko? Building the stadium at Goudi means that most PAO fans who live nearby (and they are the majority) will support and contribute to the investment every day.... Having Basketball, football, volleyball and the PAO fan base close, then it will be the best solution... And to be honest why should we compromise with the bloody government? Why wasn't anyone concerned with the build up of Karaiskaki? Why wasn't the mayor of Pireaus concearned about Parks and all other bullshit? Why does PAO have to give solution to the Athens Park problem? (And don't expect that Goudi will become a park even if PAO moves to Helliniko)... Living outside of Greece doesn't give you the entire idea of the problem... PAOs stadium is based on politician talks and I refuse to be dragged out of my history home, my base, my traditions into another bloody area that has nothing to do with Athens and PAO, just because some politicians want to... I say lets take Karaiskaki to Helliniko and lets build the new Leoforos in Peraus!!!! :P :box:

Yes you are right, although Highbyru is North-east London it is more towards the north.... The station "Highbury" is in Victoria line of the underground if I remember correctly.....

Athineos is rigfht on most things... However I don't agree with many of you that say, it doesn't matter that the ground will be a bit further out of Athens... Did anyone ever consider why Arsenal plays in east London, why Stamford Bridge is near Fulham and Chelsea or why Wembley is within London? Have you ever heard before Barcelona building a stadium OUTSIDE of Barca, or bayern playing to a stadium outside of Munich? I mean these things happen only in Greece... And commercially it might be better for the reasons that Athineos and many of you mention (i.e. the space, development of shops etc etc) but you keep forgeting something really important... WHO IS GOING TO GO TO HELLINICO EVERY WEEK? Certaintly NOT me!!! And it is not going to be due to my objection to Hellinico (I do recognise the difficulties building it in Goudi) but it will be due to difficulties going there every week... Gents, 70% of the PAO fan base, are located in Abelokipi, Gyzi, Goudi, Zografou... Do you think that all these people are willing to travel 45 minutes away to watch their teams? Or that they will travel to go for a cofee at one of the stores in the stadioum? If the ground was in Goudi then all this people even when there was NO match, could go to PAO cafe and have a coffee on an ordinary day.... That is why I am in favour of NO ground at all!!! Lets put the pressure on the bloody government for once instead of doing half jobs, settling with anything the government has to offer... remember people, the STADIOUM is a LIFETIME investment it will route PAO's history from now onwards and we won't have another opportunity to build one... This has to be done correctly or not done at all!!!! :angry: