HOLLYWOOD Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 i agree with you drakos but seariously to invest 12 million on a player who we dnt really need is jst stupid in my opionon... espeically if we dnt really own him??? (thats what really gets me) 12 million can be divided 4 ways (3 million each) to fix our problem areas such as DC; RW; LW and mayb AMC... and with 3 million u can buy really good players and the best thing about this is that we own them!!! but i can see where ur comming from i jst dnt think he can sell enough shirts to make up for this lol... if this does go ahead (i still dnt belive it) does this mean his gonna b cheap when buying other players to fill positions that are our weaknesses?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drakos13 Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 yes that is 12 million....but half of it is from a yearly wage budget....the money is not being fronted immidiately so we cant say we have a pile of 12 million Euro and lets go shopping on the transfer market... hell even the 6 million loan fee might even be paid off over years to come... but the club isnt spending 12 million straight up.... but no im not saying shirt sales will bring in big revenue but just as an example.....if the guy does well he will be worshipped....just using that as an example... but having a star like this should definitly affect season tickets, overall attendance, maybe influence competition for tv/advertising spots for the club etc dont forget he might be playing in the PAO Arena in a year from now (assuming he signed)... i dont like the idea of a loan either, but i definitly understand the idea. we could have a superstar forward while the younger ones get closer to their prime... there is a good thing about a loan - limited risk if hes a lemon he can go back.... 12 million is too much for us to pay for someone who wont perform - imagine if we went ahead and signed Skacel, Torghelle...theyd draining money out just because they were on contract.... some players when they just touch foot in the greek league turn to crap... its definitly been an issue with this club and if i were in the same position id also be cautious... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pao123 Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 boys boys?? are we serious here?? if saviola came to greece i would not mind draining that mon ey over a span of two years...listen...this is JAVIER SAVIOLA...this would be te best player in greece probably ever..yes rivaldo was a great signing but he was past his prime when he signed..way past..saviola is what 25? 26? he is middle aged, expereinced and if he came to greece i guarentee he would be the leading scorer here...he is a great player with still lots of years of great football..if we signed saviola and no one else i would still be happy..yeah we can spend some money oon mediocre players but just the fact that swuch a player would coonsider pao is grea..we are a big team and in order to get ourselves back to where we should be, signing a player like saviola could only help...itll bring fans to the stands, imagine saviola playing in athens? how big of a hit that would be? he would definitly help our team without a doubtt and would deifnitly be in the starting 11..we dont even need to guartee him a spot...this is saviola guys..he is a consistant starter on one of the best national teams in the WORLD...this would be a move that we need to see here in greece..i would much rather see us spend money and him come then bring more 12 players like antonsson and pay just as much money...this iis not flavio guys..this isnt a washed up ex star..this is a player who is still in his great football years... now whether its gunna happen orr not is a different story.. i am not prepared to jump the gun an neither should anyone else be..reports dont mean a thing until he flies to greece ad his signature is on paper... but if this is serious, then i would dish the money...investment wise, football wise and fan wise this is a great move...i guarentee we have the money and the fact that vardinno would even consider spending it is a pleasant surprise..i want to see our budget..plus if you thnk about it, im sure we will make alot of the money back in his jersey sales alone..haha for me it iisnt a question of money...we have it, even though we dont normally see how much we actually hav cause vardinno is a cheap sh*t..its a question of whether he will come or not.. pao is a big team and shouldnt big clubs be spending this much on players such as saviola?? i say yes.. we need to be looking further into the defense though, that is my only concern...saviola can cure our problems in attack...imagine saviola, eki, pap, manztios, gkekas..that would be a wonderful attack..even without saviola we have a strong attack...i think in the midfield we will do well, attack would be on fire..but defensively i am a bit worried Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bar7 Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 there are plenty of decent affordable Greek players on PAO & in Greece for that matter to fill other positions...how do you think the likes of Kyriakos & Seitarides came to our team to begin with...Spend the money & get Saviola... there is no arguement... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pao123 Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 good news is arsenal are loking to get klose bad news is saviola says he wants to stay in spain..particularly stll with sevilla Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
athinaios Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 Honestly, I don't see Saviola coming to Greece. Let's put things in perspective right now.... PAO needs to beef up its defense! We're still in the re-building stage. Greek teams aren't very competitive now in euro play. Let's get our house in order first, by becoming a dominating team domestically, have a well-run organization put together, and then we may attract big talent from abroad in order to compete with the big boys in europe. As much as it pains me to say it, Greek football got worse after Euro 2004. Our national team can not beat Kolopetinitsa and our best teams are for the most part crappy. And, this is the honest truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DUDE Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 boys boys?? are we serious here?? if saviola came to greece i would not mind draining that mon ey over a span of two years...listen...this is JAVIER SAVIOLA...this would be te best player in greece probably ever..yes rivaldo was a great signing but he was past his prime when he signed..way past..saviola is what 25? 26? he is middle aged, expereinced and if he came to greece i guarentee he would be the leading scorer here...he is a great player with still lots of years of great football..if we signed saviola and no one else i would still be happy..yeah we can spend some money oon mediocre players but just the fact that swuch a player would coonsider pao is grea..we are a big team and in order to get ourselves back to where we should be, signing a player like saviola could only help...itll bring fans to the stands, imagine saviola playing in athens? how big of a hit that would be? he would definitly help our team without a doubtt and would deifnitly be in the starting 11..we dont even need to guartee him a spot...this is saviola guys..he is a consistant starter on one of the best national teams in the WORLD...this would be a move that we need to see here in greece..i would much rather see us spend money and him come then bring more 12 players like antonsson and pay just as much money...this iis not flavio guys..this isnt a washed up ex star..this is a player who is still in his great football years... now whether its gunna happen orr not is a different story.. i am not prepared to jump the gun an neither should anyone else be..reports dont mean a thing until he flies to greece ad his signature is on paper... but if this is serious, then i would dish the money...investment wise, football wise and fan wise this is a great move...i guarentee we have the money and the fact that vardinno would even consider spending it is a pleasant surprise..i want to see our budget..plus if you thnk about it, im sure we will make alot of the money back in his jersey sales alone..haha for me it iisnt a question of money...we have it, even though we dont normally see how much we actually hav cause vardinno is a cheap sh*t..its a question of whether he will come or not.. pao is a big team and shouldnt big clubs be spending this much on players such as saviola?? i say yes.. we need to be looking further into the defense though, that is my only concern...saviola can cure our problems in attack...imagine saviola, eki, pap, manztios, gkekas..that would be a wonderful attack..even without saviola we have a strong attack...i think in the midfield we will do well, attack would be on fire..but defensively i am a bit worried Best ever in Greece??? Dont get carried away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drakos13 Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 Honestly, I don't see Saviola coming to Greece. Let's put things in perspective right now.... PAO needs to beef up its defense! We're still in the re-building stage. Greek teams aren't very competitive now in euro play. Let's get our house in order first, by becoming a dominating team domestically, have a well-run organization put together, and then we may attract big talent from abroad in order to compete with the big boys in europe. As much as it pains me to say it, Greek football got worse after Euro 2004. Our national team can not beat Kolopetinitsa and our best teams are for the most part crappy. And, this is the honest truth. i dont think the football has gotten worse exactly... i think weve just hit bad form, and Otto was super resitant to change, and we blew it. The clubs werent in form either... Greek clubs got eliminated from europe quickly....but also keep in mind that the top 4 were eliminated at the DEATH... i mean theres obviously some bad luck in there too. The teams seem to be in the middle of rebuilding, but as for Greek football there is a great strong wave of youth coming up and breaking through the last 2 seasons (Lagos, Samaras, Pappas, Mantzios, Torosidis, Tziolis, Leontiou etc... and more and more players coming in from bigger clubs and more going to bigger clubs.. so something has to be going right. this might be another rebuilding year for all teems but greek football will swing back up... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
athinaios Posted June 28, 2006 Share Posted June 28, 2006 I see your points and I hope you're right. Yet, bad luck can happen but if you see many, many bad results something else is the cause. Greece played many, many games after Euro2004 and not in one of them we played well! We finished 3rd in our group in the qualifying round. Then we went to Germany in that tourney of champs... couldn't score a goal, received aplenty! I just don't see what you see, so I say up to now Greek football has gotten worse since 2004. I don't see ANY Greek team in good shape right now.... All are rebuilding.... and until I see some good results in competitive play (euro), then all I know is the spanking they received last season! :tdown: [please don't repeat Melitzana's point that we tied Barca in Athens... It's like, yeah, we got raped in prison but we had good food on Sundays..it happens!] :wub: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HOLLYWOOD Posted June 29, 2006 Share Posted June 29, 2006 I see your points and I hope you're right. Yet, bad luck can happen but if you see many, many bad results something else is the cause. Greece played many, many games after Euro2004 and not in one of them we played well! We finished 3rd in our group in the qualifying round. Then we went to Germany in that tourney of champs... couldn't score a goal, received aplenty! I just don't see what you see, so I say up to now Greek football has gotten worse since 2004. I don't see ANY Greek team in good shape right now.... All are rebuilding.... and until I see some good results in competitive play (euro), then all I know is the spanking they received last season! :tdown: [please don't repeat Melitzana's point that we tied Barca in Athens... It's like, yeah, we got raped in prison but we had good food on Sundays..it happens!] :wub: i tend to agree with you...to say All the Greek football teams were unlucky in euro play last year is ludacrise... I accept that there can b bad luck in football but to use it as your main defence to defend greek football is not on.. i mean if it happened once or twice then you can deem it bad luck but if it happened all the time (in this case "top 4 were eliminated at the DEATH") then something else is up... The reason why these teams were eliminated at the "DEATH" was not because of bad luck but because they werent good enough; they were like little boys in a mans world trying to compete and we all saw the end result... i honestly belive that Greek soccer is slowly becoming worse; i mean Greece the NT achieved all it could achive; now it seems like they have no more desire because they know deep down they can never achieve this again.... This is your typical Greek Mentality where instead of saying "###### look what we achived lets try and build apon this and become better down the track" they say "###### it; we flooked it and we won a major trophy that we know we can never win again; lets just sit back and drink frappes; we dnt have to prove s%$#! to any one".... i know that was an extreme example but thats what it feels like to me there doing... As for the Greek League i dnt think it has become better or worse; i mean its almost the same crap year in and year out... for example: * Oly are always winning titles based on some bad reffering (not always the case) * Pao always comming in second (this time 3rd) and firing its coach while its fans reamain unsatisfyed.. * A big club is in finanical ruin due to corruption (last year Aek; this year Paok) * You have ur suprise team year in year out (e.g 2003 = Aigleo, 2006 = Atromitos); problem is this is a one year thing were the team that suprised the league doesnt improve instead they decline the next year.. * having some promising stars come through (Lagos, Samaras, Pappas, Mantzios, Torosidis, Tziolis, Leontiou etc..) while having some old farts on the way out (Vryzaz; Zagorakis; lybe; andolakis ect..) the circle of life continues just like in any other League... * Every year you have a Bam singing (e.g Rivaldo; Flavio; Zagorakis; saviola (perhaps??) ect...) *Finnaly you have ur s%$#! foreighners come in (e.g Wooter; Maric; torgelle; flavio; megahead; ect...) thats just my opinon on the League and the patterns it has developed over the past 5 years or so... only thing im looking forward to this year is how Aek will go (they seem to b the only club heading the right direction) weather or not Pao will improve; and of course the summer signings... :rolleyes: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XXX-18T Posted June 29, 2006 Share Posted June 29, 2006 Saviola race intensifies 2006-06-28 09:45 The agent of Arsenal target Javier Saviola says Greek giants Panathinaikos are now leading the race to sign his client. The Argentine international is set to leave Barcelona, and has been on fine form at the World Cup. Gunners boss Arsene Wenger is keen to sign a striker, and it is thought Saviola figures prominently on his list of potential recruits. However, Alfredo Brizuela Cabrera told GOAL that Pana have made an excellent offer which suits both Barca and Saviola: "The offer from Panathinaikos is the best so far. We have had contact with several clubs, but the offer from Greece has made Saviola think very, very hard." Pana are thought to have offered Barca six million euros for the player, and have pledged to pay Saviola three million euros per year. It seems unlikely Arsenal would be willing to match that wage offer, and they may well now turn their attentions elsewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drakos13 Posted June 29, 2006 Share Posted June 29, 2006 to say All the Greek football teams were unlucky in euro play last year is ludacrise... I accept that there can b bad luck in football but to use it as your main defence to defend greek football is not on.. i mean if it happened once or twice then you can deem it bad luck but if it happened all the time (in this case "top 4 were eliminated at the DEATH") then something else is up... The reason why these teams were eliminated at the "DEATH" was not because of bad luck but because they werent good enough; they were like little boys in a mans world trying to compete and we all saw the end result... i honestly belive that Greek soccer is slowly becoming worse; i mean Greece the NT achieved all it could achive; now it seems like they have no more desire because they know deep down they can never achieve this again.... This is your typical Greek Mentality where instead of saying "###### look what we achived lets try and build apon this and become better down the track" they say "###### it; we flooked it and we won a major trophy that we know we can never win again; lets just sit back and drink frappes; we dnt have to prove s%$#! to any one".... i know that was an extreme example but thats what it feels like to me there doing... As for the Greek League i dnt think it has become better or worse; i mean its almost the same crap year in and year out... for example: * Oly are always winning titles based on some bad reffering (not always the case) * Pao always comming in second (this time 3rd) and firing its coach while its fans reamain unsatisfyed.. * A big club is in finanical ruin due to corruption (last year Aek; this year Paok) * You have ur suprise team year in year out (e.g 2003 = Aigleo, 2006 = Atromitos); problem is this is a one year thing were the team that suprised the league doesnt improve instead they decline the next year.. * having some promising stars come through (Lagos, Samaras, Pappas, Mantzios, Torosidis, Tziolis, Leontiou etc..) while having some old farts on the way out (Vryzaz; Zagorakis; lybe; andolakis ect..) the circle of life continues just like in any other League... * Every year you have a Bam singing (e.g Rivaldo; Flavio; Zagorakis; saviola (perhaps??) ect...) *Finnaly you have ur s%$#! foreighners come in (e.g Wooter; Maric; torgelle; flavio; megahead; ect...) thats just my opinon on the League and the patterns it has developed over the past 5 years or so... only thing im looking forward to this year is how Aek will go (they seem to b the only club heading the right direction) weather or not Pao will improve; and of course the summer signings... :rolleyes: well they were unlucky....its not my main arguement but the point of it is----things could be much worse.like PAO playing awful still managed to have a chance to qualify...same with PAOK, AEK just coundnt finish... usually when were ripping on greek football teams never had a chacne to begin with... i think that the statement Greek football is slowly getting is just pessimism. Look at ALL nations----there are ups, and there are downs. From small countries to the biggest they occur. We just came off an up. Greek football is changing and steps are towards the eventual better. Teams are rebuilding and in bad form....like i said ups and downs... the signs that things are heading up are there.... - the obvious Euro 2004 qualification and then victory - investment in stadiums across the country from the Olympics now teams like Ergotelis, OFI, Panaxaiki, Niki Volou, Oly Volou all have proper stadiums to attract fans and attention..... - there is a lot more quality youth emerging and this next upcoming generation has a lot of great talent- yes there is the circle of life but this talent is developing even younger... - more players being exported to bigger clubs in Europe - players coming into the league from other major leagues..... - bigger coaches like Rehagel, Malesani and Sollied are willing to come to the league (yes Malesani didnt do great but he sill had honors like no coach had seen before in the league------Sollied is a fantastic coach and he could be coaching at a way higher level as well---coaches like him will raise the standard in the A ethniki) - a possible formation of a superleague - teams like PAOK might be bought out, new stadiums coming for PAO, Iraklis - smaller teams are becoming more competitive getting attention such as Ksanthi, Iraklis, Larisa... this sport just takes a lot of time for change and can happen unexpectldy sometimes...of what i see we are in rebuilding and in years the standard will be higher. you keep bringing in stuff 5 yrs ago.....this was totally differnt and not too relevant....even the country was very different...its a new era for Greece and its football now.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pao123 Posted June 29, 2006 Share Posted June 29, 2006 Best ever in Greece??? Dont get carried away. who was a better siigning?? 30 something rivaldo, 30 something sousa?? im not talking about players coming in to greece and making a name like warzycha, or players coming from greece (ie stelios) for a player being brought in with such a high profile and potentail to help the team, who would you say is number one? im not trying to start war words, im just wndering IF (and a big if it may be) saviola came to greece, who was a better signing then him? i dunno, there is something fishy about the saviola thing, too good too be true if you ask me maybe..dont want to jinx anything but we are working hard to capture him, the media is hyping it up, these sorts of things often end in dissapoitment for greek clubs.. i guess only tme can tell but as of now, im trying not to read/believe what the papers and sites are teling us...untl his signature is down i will not get hyped up about anything cause i can easily see all of us fans being dissapointed and pissed if he doesnt come to greece... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aekrossoponti Posted June 29, 2006 Share Posted June 29, 2006 I Greece played many, many games after Euro2004 and not in one of them we played well! We finished 3rd in our group in the qualifying round. Then we went to Germany in that tourney of champs... couldn't score a goal, received aplenty! I just don't see what you see, so I say up to now Greek football has gotten worse since 2004. I don't see ANY Greek team in good shape right now.... All are rebuilding.... and until I see some good results in competitive play (euro), then all I know is the spanking they received last season! :tdown: well our ethniki had 3-4 good games since the euro.. the first half against the danes in greece was awesome, the home game against albania was good too, with 80% possession, and the game against ukraine in greece. we played well there. another good game was the confederations cup game against mexico.lets face it, we didnt qualify because all nonsense aside, without DELLAS we don t have a team that can compete defensively. we can talk otto all we want, without dellas he is completely lost. we were lucky dabizas was injured in the euro or else we would have went out first round. Dellas was missing in all games after the euro except for the home game against denmark, which produced 45 great minutes before nikopolidis tried his best to ruin it. without dellas our defense lacks stability...every goal we got in the qualifying was an unforced error from our defence. now add ottos selection, tactics mistakes (we went to ukraine for an all or nothing game with a healthy vryzas and an injured, matchunfit charisteas as our only strikers !!!!!) in the mix and we finish fourth in a group we should have won easily... i do see some greek teams in good shape. iraklis is improving, xanthis is making moves... true the smaller teams got better, but the bigger teams at best stagnate. lets see this years season. pao should do well in uefa..for iraklis, xanthi reaching the group stage would be sensational! lets not expect anything from atromitos, and be happy with whatever...olympiakos needs some quality metagraphes (domi, zewlakow, borja don t impress me much, toure will probably be m.i.a but ne ssems good), aek needs a miracle to reach the group stage. at present the team has no metagraphi endekada, and the cl games are in a month. we lost our best player...lets see what happens... as for saviola lets wait wha happens..namewise apart from rivaldo, giovanni he has to be considered the biggest name to come to greece. lets not forget he is in the prime of his career and a basikos in the argentine nationalteam. which neither rivaldo nor giovani were at the time. the only thing that worries me is even if he does come..what differendce will he make on the pitch?`not much i think...we would still lose in barca, saviola wont change that..hes not the kind of player that elevates a team to the next level. although the prospect of a frontline with saviola-mantzios-pap seems great...but whats the use if the defense sucks... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HOLLYWOOD Posted June 29, 2006 Share Posted June 29, 2006 ey i jst thought of something... We made an offer of 6 Million to Barca to loan saviola for 2 years (each year being 3 million) however Saviola is contracted to Barcelona untill 2007 (correct me if im wrong?)... how does this make sense?? unless its a transfer?? if thats tru then offer him a 4 year contract :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aekrossoponti Posted June 29, 2006 Share Posted June 29, 2006 wa are talking about a transfer here not aloan...you seldom loan players for two years...they would pay barca 6mio and saviola will get 3 mio per year... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bar7 Posted June 29, 2006 Share Posted June 29, 2006 i dont think there has ever been a player of this calibre signed in Greece at his prime....he wont be building a name here, he's already a star & he's not 30 something... i'm in favor, hope it happens Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve07 Posted June 29, 2006 Share Posted June 29, 2006 I would love for Saviola to come here him and Eki would be awesome together. But I'll believe it when I see it don’t want to get my hopes up like last year with his name rumored to come here and the big let down when he didn't. Anyways any news on any other player not named Saviola that Pao is trying to get? Since we are looking at the Argentinean’s we might as well look at players from their first and second division teams I'm sure there are some diamonds in the rough over there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drakos13 Posted June 30, 2006 Share Posted June 30, 2006 lets just hope this doesnt drag on like another FLAVIO :tdown: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athens4 Posted June 30, 2006 Share Posted June 30, 2006 Do u honestly think saviola will come to PAO??? :LOL: :LOL: :LOL: What is the point in him coming to greece? To play against PAOK who hasnt got a team or against Kalamaria who hasnt got any fans. Its jus like nedved and ze roberto going to osfp. They will not go. Both played/are playing in the World Cup so its obvious some big team will get them. You have read about these players "coming to greece" in the papers and online. Can you not see that the papers just put whatever they want (which is too good to be true) to sell the papers. They do this every year I thought people would realise by now not to believe what the papers say. The only way big names come to greece is when they are retiring (rivaldo). I go to Greece every summer, and I see on the papers for example this year "BOMBA ME SAVIOLA" in giant bold letters. Cracks me up every time. :LOL: :LOL: :LOL: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pao123 Posted June 30, 2006 Share Posted June 30, 2006 i agree somewhat...it could turn out o be another Hagi report...every transfer period for 10 years hago was suppose to come..haha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bar7 Posted June 30, 2006 Share Posted June 30, 2006 i honestly dont think it will happen but i would welcome it!! :) the offer has been upped to 3.4 mil??? :blink: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CH-Thrylos Posted June 30, 2006 Share Posted June 30, 2006 do you think saviola is really worth that money for pao? i mean with that money pao could get at least two to three other good players. i don't think that saviola could make such a big difference by himself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pao123 Posted June 30, 2006 Share Posted June 30, 2006 i guess pekerman thinks differently... i would rather have one saviola then 3 or 4 hanssons and antonnson any day..so if we are gunna waste money on m******s such as antonnson, then yes, i believe hes worth it... i think thats how much a starter on the argentine national squad should be around Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drakos13 Posted June 30, 2006 Share Posted June 30, 2006 Do u honestly think saviola will come to PAO??? :LOL: :LOL: :LOL: What is the point in him coming to greece? To play against PAOK who hasnt got a team or against Kalamaria who hasnt got any fans. Its jus like nedved and ze roberto going to osfp. They will not go. Both played/are playing in the World Cup so its obvious some big team will get them. You have read about these players "coming to greece" in the papers and online. Can you not see that the papers just put whatever they want (which is too good to be true) to sell the papers. They do this every year I thought people would realise by now not to believe what the papers say. The only way big names come to greece is when they are retiring (rivaldo). I go to Greece every summer, and I see on the papers for example this year "BOMBA ME SAVIOLA" in giant bold letters. Cracks me up every time. :LOL: :LOL: :LOL: yes usually those are garbage....but there is actual response from Javier and actual offers have been made.....thats a bit different than the usual MPAM ME LAMPARD STO KARAISKAKI junk... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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