SL - R8: Olympiakos - PAOK ( 23 Oct 16, 20:30 EEST )

[BostonThanatos]

I'll chime in with my 2 cents.

 

Whoever thinks that we lost the game because of the ref (although I will say the he was biased toward the home team, but not by how much everyone is accusing) needs to stop watching soccer and take up tennis.  We scored first...and then scored an own goal to tie it up.  After the first 5-6 minutes where Oly was aggressive and playing better, we settled down and were playing solid.  We played pretty well overall, but Campos is a liability.  He cant pass, shoot dribble or anything . Al; he is is fast. period.  I think the 65% - 35% isn't indicative of how the game went. Oly was sloppy. VERY sloppy. ESPECIALLY on defense.  The reason why we lost is the same reason we dropped points to every xorio in Super League.  Too many missed opportunities.  If we don't score that own goal, and make 1 of the many other chances we're up 2-0 and with a coiuple proper substitutions we could have easily walked away with a win.  But we are mizeria and griniarides and when we lose to OLY we have to blame anyone but ourselves.  Was aretopoulos the ref for our $hit show on Thursday...or vs. Xanthi..or the other games we dropped points? I can't hear the same grinia.  We didn't buy a Center forward.  We don't use Pereyra.  s**** sta moutra mas.  

As far as Savvidis goes, I said it when he first came here. PAOK is a hobby for him and probably the smallest investment he'll be involved in in Greece.  He's in Greece on Russian business and to clean some of his dirty money...just like MArinakis, Melissanidis and every other mafiozo in the SL (past and present)

 

 

 

[Blackhawk]

If it wasn't for the silly smoke bombs interrupting the game every 20 minutes, this was a quite an exciting game to watch. It had action and good scoring chances by both teams. This game could have gone either way and could have ended in a tie as well.

After the Quarabag debacle I expected a bad game by the team, but they showed up for the game and were quite competitive. If we had some luck and forwards that could actually score we would have walked away with a win. This game clearly showed me that our problem is in the midfield. Once Canas left the field, it was over. Shakhov was the weak link, and Charisis who replaced Canas is clearly not to the level where we can count on him to solidify the midfield. He is not a starter material. Hate to say this, but Kace should have stayed on the team.

As for the ref, he did play the usual 60-40 for the home team, but he did not influence the final result of the game. The problem was one of the sideline refs who was inconsistent. He allowed the play to go on that resulted in the tying goal, but in exactly the same situation his flag went up when Rodrigues was ready for a breaking run.

[Blackhawk]

That's not the play in question.

[Blackhawk]

That was the other sideline ref. I think that was his only mistake in the game.

The other questionable call was the non red card on Milivojevic on the blatant foul on Klaus in the first half.

[Blackhawk]

I did not know there was one. 

[Blackhawk]

If that was called than there would be 5 penalties in each game in the Superleague. Even Marinakis would not make that call.

[kozi]

The time has come, actually it is well overdue, that Paok behaved like a big club. Carrying on the way we did after the game proves we have a victim mentality. We need to leave that stuff to the off field staff to fight the battle. Hearing Maleza and Glyko after the game talking that way tells me we have a loser mentality of looking to blame when we lose. We need to have a coach who instills true mental strength into our team. People can talk about budgets and fair enough but it also depends on how you spend it. Yes we desperately need a goalscorer but we also need an experienced coach who is not easily influenced by the Greek football landscape.  Our club's biggest problem is that on the big stage WE LACK COMPOSURE. Whether it is missing easy goals, lack of concentration leading to conceding goals, we are not mentally tough enough. A Top coach is what we really need.

As has already been mentioned Savvidis needs to spend the money once and for all and get the right people. Otherwise we will be saying the same things in 20 years. 

Edited October 25, 2016 by kozi

[BostonThanatos]

27 minutes ago, Sokinhte said:

Relax with your transfermarkt stats. Olympiakos wins because of referees and curruption. Not because your transfermarkt phenomenon of Botia, Da Costa, and Maniatis. If this league were fair and square; you'd be around fifth.

Can I have some of what your smoking?

[Bananas]

2 hours ago, BostonThanatos said:

Can I have some of what your smoking?

Can I have some also.

[Original Sydney]

Reality is the game was stopped 3 times, if this happened at AEK PAO or PAOKs ground would Oly have run to the refs and tried to get the game cancelled? Yes. They tried to do it when we beat them 1-0 last season, flares were lit once we scored and Theodoridis ran to the ref asking him to stop the game when not one flare reached the pitch.

Would Oly have come out and finished the game the way PAOK did? No chance. So credit to PAOK.

So as much as it was a good game between both sides, the officials did have an influence on things. The ref for one cant say he will call the game if it happens once more and when it does happen he doesn't stick to his word, then he has no right to go into PAOKs dressing room and tell them they would be docked 10 points if they don't come out and finish the game.

[Bananas]

6 minutes ago, Original Sydney said:

Reality is the game was stopped 3 times, if this happened at AEK PAO or PAOKs ground would Oly have run to the refs and tried to get the game cancelled? Yes. They tried to do it when we beat them 1-0 last season, flares were lit once we scored and Theodoridis ran to the ref asking him to stop the game when not one flare reached the pitch.

Would Oly have come out and finished the game the way PAOK did? No chance. So credit to PAOK.

So as much as it was a good game between both sides, the officials did have an influence on things. The ref for one cant say he will call the game if it happens once more and when it does happen he doesn't stick to his word, then he has no right to go into PAOKs dressing room and tell them they would be docked 10 points if they don't come out and finish the game.

That for me is really a separate discussion which belongs in a different thread.

There are things that are not in your control e.g. referees, quality of pitch at away games, and there are things that are like buying players, manager, training etc.  @ThrylosG7 is talking about the latter.

[Original Sydney]

Well this is the Oly vs PAOK topic so don't know why it belongs in a different thread when im talking about things that happened in the game.

[Blackhawk]

Savvidis already spent quite a bit of money on PAOK. Well over 90 mil in the last 5 years. Some of it were money well spent (paying off the various team debts, Toumba improvements, training facilities improvements), some were spent on players that turned out to good buys, but a lot of it was wasted because he has no clue on running a soccer team, and the people he trusted to do it for him just misused the money. He himself made some very bad decisions (signing Berbatov, Natcho, Noboa, etc.)

Hopefully with Lubos Michel he found the right person steer the team in the right direction, and PAOK can get the maximum bang for the money that is invested in the team. 

 

[Bananas]

2 hours ago, Reaper said:

Thought Nachto was one of the best midfielders I have seen play in Greece. I think Savvidis' mistake was not moving hell and earth to turn his brief loan into a permanent move. 

He was the best midfielder we've had by a long shot.  But I don't think he was ever going to stay at PAOK.  At CSKA he's on around 2 million.  We would have had to pay at least 3 million for him to even entertain the thought.  I just don't see it happening.

[RED SHERIFF]

its cheaper to blame the moon, earth sun, and referees

[BostonThanatos]

14 hours ago, Reaper said:

Thought Nachto was one of the best midfielders I have seen play in Greece. I think Savvidis' mistake was not moving hell and earth to turn his brief loan into a permanent move. 

I agree.  But I agree it was a mistake because he was brought in with an understanding that there was 0 chance of him staying.  If Natcho was signed with the intension of dropping another $40Million to build a team around him, then OK...but that wasn't the case.  We brought him in so he can kill 6 months until he signed with a big team.

[Bananas]

Let's be serious.  What do you think it would've taken to sign Bibras ?  Considering he's on roughly 2 million with CSKA, what would it take to entice him ?  I would've thought at least 3 million and even then, it's just a maybe.  He was a loan signing at best.  Saying we should've tried "harder" to sign him is like saying Olympiakos should've tried harder to sign Campbell.  Nice in theory.

[BostonThanatos]

At the end of the day, this is Greece and it isn't anyone's goal to work here.  You either come to Greece on your way up, or on your way down.  Olympiakos is the team to go to if your looking to get recognized by a top 20 team.  PAOK and PAO are where you go to be seen by a 20-50 ranked team... That's the residual effect of consistant CL appearances.  If Lucas or Mak were on Oly, they would have fetched far more cash than $1.5 million (Lucas) and $3.5 million (mak).  

[Blackhawk]

14 hours ago, ThrylosG7 said:

Ok thats pretty good I have to admit - however as fans what are your expectations going forward - from him as an owner - now that he has improved the club - facilities finances  etc .. what he has done is stabilized and to an extent modernised it - chances are that you will be top 4 as a minimum each year..moving forward..is he expected to increase spending to the level where the squad is capable of challenging year in year out ?? That is the kind of investment that is expensive and requires massive financial commitment - its not just transfer fees - its wages as well - more expensive players require more wages - which you have to be able to guarantee for the length of the contract...

You can read the transcript of Savidis's 4 hour speech when he became the President of the team last week. He answers all your questions there.  

[Bananas]

9 hours ago, Blackhawk said:

You can read the transcript of Savidis's 4 hour speech when he became the President of the team last week. He answers all your questions there.  

Link Blackhawk ?

[pash]

On 10/18/2016 at 2:01 PM, Blackhawk said:

During the first board meeting on Monday after he became the PAE PAOK President, Ivan Savidis gave a 4-hour speech dealing with various PAOK subjects. Here is a transcription of his speech for you to read if you have free time on your hands: 

http://www.paokfc.gr/nea/i-istoriki-proti-omilia-tou-proedrou-ivan/