PAO's New Coach: Ten Kate

[cyberfish]

[DUDE]

http://www.sportdog.gr/new/article.aspx?id=68926

Now that's a funny story. Ten Cate thinking he can put some order in the parking disorder in Greece. I guess he won't be driving around Athens much if he expects vehicular order :LOL:

:LOL:

And guess what, he's at it again! He's warned the players that whenever a story breaks in the newspapers about what is being said/done in training, i.e. player bust ups, injuries, players wanting to leave, etc, each player will be fined 1,000 euros! He's like a general demanding order and obedience... and I have to tell you, I love the guy! Greek football has been plagued by a lack of professionalism. I'll never forget the time that PAO came to London to play Arsenal (the 1-1 draw where Vintra scored). The night before the game (!) many of the players went to a local bouzoukia! Our boys (Greeks) have bad diets, they don't carry out correct fitness regimes, some of them even smoke!!! They're athletes for goodness sake! It's about time someone came in to whip these bums into shape.

LONG LIVE THE ERA OF TEN CATE!

And this is getting ahead of myself, but if he does a good job at PAO and is here long enough to learn the league, give him the NT job when Otto goes.

[drakos13]

definitly Ten Cate is our TOP signing this season. He DEMANDS quality out of his players and shows them how to get it. He doesnt take s%$#! from anybody, hes also quite a friendly guy from what I have heard and is enjoying his stay here.

but wait - Ten Cate will fine players if the media writes they are injred? that cant be right it makes no sense. Something thats nobodys fauilt? I think you mean going to the press about bust ups and wanting to leave is a fine, thats ok...But being injured???

as for Arsenal - I seriously doubt that players went to a bouzoukia. It would have been all over the news in Greece , and I seriously doubt these guys living in Athens would be desperate to go out to London Bouzoukia, with Arsenal game the next day on a tuesday night....no bouzoukia are open anywhere on mondays and tuesdays anyways man!

Theres no players that smoke at PAO....thats unheard of. Maybe at B ethniki teams...I seriously doubt ANY coach even the shitty ones would tolerate smokers, and the doctors, fitness coaches would spot it.

[DUDE]

definitly Ten Cate is our TOP signing this season. He DEMANDS quality out of his players and shows them how to get it. He doesnt take s%$#! from anybody, hes also quite a friendly guy from what I have heard and is enjoying his stay here.

but wait - Ten Cate will fine players if the media writes they are injred? that cant be right it makes no sense. Something thats nobodys fauilt? I think you mean going to the press about bust ups and wanting to leave is a fine, thats ok...But being injured???

as for Arsenal - I seriously doubt that players went to a bouzoukia. It would have been all over the news in Greece , and I seriously doubt these guys living in Athens would be desperate to go out to London Bouzoukia, with Arsenal game the next day on a tuesday night....no bouzoukia are open anywhere on mondays and tuesdays anyways man!

Theres no players that smoke at PAO....thats unheard of. Maybe at B ethniki teams...I seriously doubt ANY coach even the shitty ones would tolerate smokers, and the doctors, fitness coaches would spot it.

He doesn't fine the players if they're injured, the fine would come if there's been an informant/rat/grass. So if Ten Cate is playing Olympiakos on Sataurday and he's having closed training sessions, and someone from the squad goes and tells the media, "Salpi is injured, he won't play. We'll play Mantzios in a 4-3-3 formation", then he'll fine everyone.

As for the bouzoukia, it's true and it was reported on in the local Greek newspapers in London and there was a photo of Basinas walking in to the joint. I remember the owner of the club trying to difuse the situation by saying they left early (by 11pm) but that's not the point, it's not professional.

As for smoking I meant that as a general comment about players in the Greek league, i wasn't talking about any specific PAO players. I know for sure that Olympiakos' Fernando Belluschi smokes for example because I've seen it with my own eyes.

Now regardless of these individual incidents you can't seriously imply that Greek players are professional in their conduct? Ten Cate is just what our football needs.

[drakos13]

belluschi is a moron then. thats typical argentinians for you though......

Greek players are professional as any other country. dont try to villanize greece because Greece is Greece etc....

We won a Euro with Greek league players, and they are levels more professional on the pitch than a lot of teams. Off the pitch is there personal lives. Thats every footballer. Im not saying you can go to bouzoukia before CL games (because something about that I really just dont buy, players like Basinas do actually know better) or smoke, but that crap doesnt happen. There is no way a team runs 90 minutes with France, Portugal Czech Rep and is in bouzoukia/smoking before matches. Not possible.

If the story was actually serious/credible Im know Greek papers in Greece would have devoured it up and blown it out of proportion even more.

Beluschi has been in Greece a few months, and hes Argentine. They think they own the world.

If it was seriously Beluschi was smoking, I dont know he could ever make Boca if he was smoking. I think Sokratis Kokkalis or any half intelligent business man would call him in immidiately and yell at him for 30 mins (smoking RUINS your fitness, and if your not fit to play youre not playing and your under contract).

OSFP, PAO etc have prof physical teams and theres no way...just no way, Beluschi would not pass his fitness tests meanwhile the phys team does not take into account hes smoking, nor the team.

[NikosVazelas]

Professional athletes smoke more then we all may think. Djole smoked two packs a day for like 9 years... he recently cut it down but still smokes.

Basinas, Fyssas and Kyrgiakos all have been taken photos of smoking and Basinas is a well known cigar smoker

its not the end of the world. Many athletes smoke. Nikolaidis smoked. Here in canada, many hockey players smoke. baseball players smoke and half the nfl is under the influence of marijuana... im sure soem of those are addicted to cigarettes.

[adonis]

same with half the italian national team....and hagi as well (according to rumours i had heard)

and darlas also was/is a smoker

[DUDE]

Professional athletes smoke more then we all may think. Djole smoked two packs a day for like 9 years... he recently cut it down but still smokes.

Basinas, Fyssas and Kyrgiakos all have been taken photos of smoking and Basinas is a well known cigar smoker

its not the end of the world. Many athletes smoke. Nikolaidis smoked. Here in canada, many hockey players smoke. baseball players smoke and half the nfl is under the influence of marijuana... im sure soem of those are addicted to cigarettes.

Yes it is a big deal guys. I think everyone will agree that the Premiership teams are the fittest in the world. Half the games they win in Europe is based on sheer tempo.

When Juande Ramos was asked by Uefa.com about the secret of his success with Sevilla, he said something along the lines of "we try to combine British fitness and tempo, with continental technique". The importance of fitness cannot be underestimated. Even a s%$#! team that has no technique can beat a top team on sheer hustle, look at Liverpool vs Juve and Inter in recent years, or Bolton vs Atletico. So how do they acheive this level of fitness? Part of it is of course very hard fitness work and playing to a high tempo even in practise games. Another side of it though is diet. When Wenger first went to Arsenal the very first thing he team was change the club restaurant's menu. Only organic food, nothing too fatty, lots of fruit and veg, diff times of the day meant diff food, for example before training carbs, after training protein, etc. It improved their fitness tenfold. So if things like that can make a big diff, imagine how detrimental the effects of smoking are.

It's not only problematic in terms of fitness but also shows a lack of discipline... they are athletes, they shouldn't be doing it.

@ Drakos: Yes the players were running like mad in Euro 2004, but why? They had a dictator-type coach who demanded discipline. Paixtarades like Georgatos and Tsartas were left out of the squad/team because they either lacked discipline or showed a poor work rate. It's no good in using Euro 2004 as an example and not mentioning the other thousand examples where our teams were embarassed because of a lack of work rate and discipline = Juve 7-0 Olympiakos, Man Utd 5-0 PAO, etc. Were those teams that much better than ours? No top flight professional team is that much better than any other. No team should ever lose by 5 or more. We've suffered in the past because of a lack of professionalism, whether by the players, board, or coaching staff. We need people like Ten Cate in our game.

[drakos13]

Professional athletes smoke more then we all may think. Djole smoked two packs a day for like 9 years... he recently cut it down but still smokes.

Basinas, Fyssas and Kyrgiakos all have been taken photos of smoking and Basinas is a well known cigar smoker

its not the end of the world. Many athletes smoke. Nikolaidis smoked. Here in canada, many hockey players smoke. baseball players smoke and half the nfl is under the influence of marijuana... im sure soem of those are addicted to cigarettes.

nothing wrong with a little pot every now and then....

Cigars - you dont inhale them, so its fine..Not like cigarettes...

Djordjevic is an idiot. How on earth do you play professional football and smoke. You have to RUN 90 mins...how can you not be weezing after 40?

I know when I smoke, my fitness/endurance shoots right down.

In Italy....maybe certain pros...the ethniki italias tho? the type of doctors/physical teams teams like Milan, Inter, Juve etc have are seriously world class. Theres NO WAY they do not know that they are smoking, or that they seriously do not report it. I mean Milan players have fitness tests and psycological tests before every game to see if they are fit. I doubt they wouldnt pay attention to things like smoking which ruin your endurance.

Maybe theyve all been photographed smoking like at a club in the offseason? I smoke when Im at clubs sometimes, but never daily..

Baseball, is different. Football you run 90 mins.....Baseball you sit in the outfield or on the bench and occasionally have to run- never far, and never very long. Theres virtually no endurance required whatsoever.

Honestly it sounds like a very interesting article for a sports publicaiton...someone should write it. I personally had no idea a professional footballer would smoke cigarettes every day. It doesnt make sense. Even in my semi-pro football league , the smokers even though talented, they really cant last much more than 60 mins tops compared to the rest of us...

[athinaios]

People do lots of things to "get off." Some are quite addictive, and some are harmful to the human body. Players who smoke trade in some performance while inhaling toxic substances. But, people even if they know the risks the do it.

Smoking after vigorous exercise is worse because the lungs are "wide open" and absorb more toxic substances.

Great athlethes, espcecially the ones that don't have to "beat the clock" can survive for long time playing professional sports and smoking--or doing other things that take something out of their performace.

[cyberfish]

It's on every online paper, but in case you missed it, there is an interesting interview of HTC.

Some highlights:

"

[paxiotis7]

As for smoking I meant that as a general comment about players in the Greek league, i wasn't talking about any specific PAO players. I know for sure that Olympiakos' Fernando Belluschi smokes for example because I've seen it with my own eyes.[/b][/color]

Where did you see that? Im not calling you a liar but i just find that so hard to belive?! How unprofessional for god sakes. He is a professional athlete getting payed millions. The club is also at fault for this too. How can they pay him millions and let him smoke. What a waste :angry:

[PAO_OR_DEATH]

^^

i mean this guy is a role model for the kids.

what a Ma@@as

[NYPAO13]

rather than starting a new topic

would you give HTC a contract extension, before he becomes a lame duck coach?

[XXX-18T]

Ah well another coach gone :(

Wonder if he will last the season.....

[cyberfish]

Not sure where to put this one. I guess the Ten Cate topic is appropriate.

This interesting article analyzes some of the goals and good plays this season in support of the argument that Panathianikos is well worked in practice, both tactically and physically.

http://www.gazzetta.gr/content/view/53673/2/ (nice videos to support the argument too)

It mentions the set pieces being a strenght (25% of the goals this season)

[NYPAO13]

he should get an extension, especially after some of the crap prior to him.

[cyberfish]

I don't think soccer is baseball where stats mean a lot (since the game itself lacks interest), but I do find these facts interesting, mainly because they provide a measurable way to gauge success or failure.

This article today gives some facts about Ten Cate's tenure with PAO http://www.sportdog.gr/v3/article.aspx?id=112919

With one more win against Asteras he will break Rocha's record of continous undefeated matches. Rocha had 29 games undefeated while Ten Cate has 28.

He is also about to reach Kyrastas' record of most wins. Apparently Kyrastas has 72% wins in his games and Ten Cate can reach that with a win against Asteras (he is at 67%.

I hope we don't jinx the team with mentioning undefeated streaks and no goals conceded from set pieces this year

:P

[Euro2004]

he should get an extension, especially after some of the crap prior to him.

of course he should be, but there are already idiots in the media calling for his head. Great that Gate 13 are supporting him though

[cyberfish]

I think he expressed interest in retiring after this year though. While many talk down his work he has been building the foundations of a good team, or at least he is reversing years of ineptitude on the bench.

The truth is that he also has enjoyed the best talent pool of the last decade. It's been a decade since Panathinaikos had a CF like Cisse and we've never had a winger like Leto. Karagounis I think has been maturing and playing like a team player and he has been having the best years of his career, while the best Greek talent Ninis is enjoying a fantastic year for his age. We never had as good as Gilberto or Katsourani at DM either.

This must be the most expensive team ever in terms of transfer fees and contracts. The coaching staff is also one of the most expensive in history. Someone check the numbers on this one, but I remember they talked about a 2m Euro per year for the coaching staff.

Expectations are high but I've been very satisfied with the way the team has been operating this year.

[athinaios]

I believe that this roster is the best in the last 10 years. Not that we didn't have a few great players before Tkate arrived, but finally we got talent and a very good mix, with depth.

Actually I find it amazing that a team like PAO, with its budget all these years performed this poorly. :angry:

Risking being unpopular, I'd say that 2004 was a fluke. We sucked big time. We played 3 good games only. Very lucky to have Manoli and scored when it counted.

Anyway, if TKate retires, I'd like to see Rotsa, the current academy coach, take over.

[cyberfish]

I agree with you Athinaie that 2004 was a fluke. We did a little better than the years before, Olympiakos did much worst than normal, and we were one act show with Papadopoulos scoring some off the wall goals early on and then Olisadebe picking up his broken pieces as he bailed the team out on a few games. Unfortunately no one remembers the early work of Papadopoulos that kept the team on top and allowed Olisadebe to be the hero. I don't want to minimize the success of that team though. There was some good talent and everyone worked hard. Schum stayed out of the way and Zaets kept everyone on edge until it all worked out. Circumstances worked to our favor as well when Olympiakos hired the most embarrassing Greek to lead their team. Alefandos was a great player for us then, putting Georgatos as a RB in Leoforos hoping to contain Much. Munch had a monster day and the rest was history :)

Rocha is my all time favorite player, since I grew up wathing him lead the team with his amazing style, dribbles and long passes in Leoforos. He also became my favorite coach in the mid-nineties. However, looking at it with cold eyes I don't think he would be a good coach right now. He has not coached a serious team in years (something which tells me the motivation to compete at the top level is not there) and the last time he was brought back early in the millennium he didn't do well at all.

I think Rocha would be a better football manager when Antoniou retires. As for a coach, I will think about it when the season ends. For now Ten Cate is leading the team on a good path and it doesn't help to be thinking so far ahead. Who knows? If we win the title and we make it to the Europa league 8 he might decide to stay.

[athinaios]

OK, I hear what you're saying about Rotsa. All I know is that the guy has talent --truly understands football, and that he coached PAO with success. ALso, that he knows the Greek mentality and domestic situation. I think Kyrastas and Rotsa could have built a better team had they stayed for several years. We went through a dozen of failed coaches.

Schum was the luckiest coach but just as horrible.

Anyway, I think it's time for Panatha fans to smile and enjoy the team over a long period of time instead of seeing a good game now and then as in the past decade.

Man, it's been a long time. I'm old enough to know that PAO never had only 1 title in a dozen years... I hope this is changing. :tup:

[FZ13]

Hey guys

Ten Cate's made a lot of mistakes but he's corrected most of them

Most important he has gotten rid of some MAJOR PALTA (Tziolis Matzios Moon LAzaros now Galinovic is probably out also) Ivanschitz was also very inconsistent

Physical condition is the best we've ever seen

Rotation is over we have a steady 11-14 players

Ok roster is much better now but I think he's doing a v.good job also

O#$%$%$#% journos are after Ten Cate cause he doesnt give ashit about PR

Especially that prick Nikologiannis

Things are working fine so lets hope our mgmt keeps him

.