drakos13 Posted January 26, 2005 Share Posted January 26, 2005 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
athinaios Posted January 26, 2005 Share Posted January 26, 2005 If this curtails the violence so be it, though I don't think this by itself will do the trick. Nevertheless, it's a sad case that free people cannot go freely to watch a SPORTS game!!!! I wish some day soon things will change. In the US, for example, attending a game (any sport) is fun and can be enjoyed by a whole family! It should be a celebration not a day at the battlefield. How can I take my son (I don't have one, but when I do) or my daughter to a football game in Greece??? I wouldn't do it today--it's too dangerous. We're losing many fans, people interested enough in a sport to support it later. And, why, they allow the situation to exist that we the true fans cannot go to any away match to watch our beloved team? That's why, I'm pissed off at all those in power and the rich club owner that have made it impossible for me to enjoy something I love. And, ontop of it they tax me to give freebies to rich club owners. Com'on.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drakos13 Posted January 26, 2005 Author Share Posted January 26, 2005 that is not true at all. That is a complete myth, it is NOT too dangerous. All the huge majority of violence is with away fans and takes place in Gate 13 andin some areas of 7.... i see kids with their fathers all the time even in those areas and they are fine. It is not ok because the violence in leoforos IS NOT that common. yes when OSFP comes in its different. Its not game in game out , thats just a load of s%$#!. yeah u will see thigns thrown in anger but thats not serious. The stadium NEVER WAS a family picnic atmosphere. It isnt. It wont be. Is ID really going to change things?? no it wont. ticket club hasnt done a damn thing. The darkest day in PAO will be when everyone comes with picnic baskets happy family like in MLS games and other boring US and British events without passion. Who cares if things are rough thats how they are. A couple swears and objects doesnt mean s%$#!.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
athinaios Posted January 26, 2005 Share Posted January 26, 2005 Glad to hear that. I live in the US, so the last time I was in Greece it was summer and could see only friendlies... As for picknick baskets... I don't know of any venue in the US or Britain that there is no passion in the stands, before and during the game! It's very intense. I know since I've experienced it. The MLS is a fruitcake and the exception. Any basketball, football games in the US and any match in England is a big, powerful, worth-of-excitement atmosphere. I love it. I don't want to go ..picknicking watching a PAO game. But, you know, I want to go knowing that I'll return home that night. That my car parked outside will be undamaged and my store next to the gipedo won't be in flames. Oh, and how about this poor father who was knocking on the window of the media enclosure at Panionios stadium begging them to take in his very young son to be saved from the touvla, boukalia, tsimenta and other deadly things coming down?.... I still want to see my team's games in every stadium in Greece....and buy tickets without having to go through a ..cavity search! Isn't it fair? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Protathlitis Posted January 26, 2005 Share Posted January 26, 2005 maybe these IDs are just prelude to installing cameras and booting out the worst ones like in england Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drakos13 Posted January 26, 2005 Author Share Posted January 26, 2005 Glad to hear that. I live in the US, so the last time I was in Greece it was summer and could see only friendlies... As for picknick baskets... I don't know of any venue in the US or Britain that there is no passion in the stands, before and during the game! It's very intense. I know since I've experienced it. The MLS is a fruitcake and the exception. Any basketball, football games in the US and any match in England is a big, powerful, worth-of-excitement atmosphere. I love it. I don't want to go ..picknicking watching a PAO game. But, you know, I want to go knowing that I'll return home that night. That my car parked outside will be undamaged and my store next to the gipedo won't be in flames. Oh, and how about this poor father who was knocking on the window of the media enclosure at Panionios stadium begging them to take in his very young son to be saved from the touvla, boukalia, tsimenta and other deadly things coming down?.... I still want to see my team's games in every stadium in Greece....and buy tickets without having to go through a ..cavity search! Isn't it fair? i have been to many games in the USA and the atmosphere IN EVERY sport is so dull i want to cry. ENGLAND?!??!?!? if greek football ever becomes that calm and dull like the english where the entire fans are seated and so passionless i will wear black my whole life. As for the Panionios match that was OLYMPIAKOS fans. That was also very RARE- that is far from an everygame activity. Way far from it- and thats because the OSFP invaded the Panioios regular section- not the one of the panthers. Man deal with it, sports are competition and people get fanatical over that, the idea of competetion is an ancient tradition and closely resembles war..... let people be free and wild its the only way to live, just keep it within reason, no attacking eachother blatantly but we cant look to follow the USA and Britain on everything and look to these stupid huge clubs as role models for greek football. F#$% them, i want a team with tradition, not fancy seats and merchandise and pamphlets and ads everywhere shoved in my ass - i see this happening to PAO and it makes me sad - sports in america are completly passionless and only merchandise. look at the NFL, you watch a game it takes hours because every 3 seconds there is a commericial, even the damn play of the day has a sponsor. NFL???? NBA???? MLB??? NHL??? they dont even have fans i have been a lot of both and its just dull that the fans arent in to it at all ..in greece u step into the womens volleyball and you will still have fanaticsm ....the reason why PAO is respected and succesful in europe is OUR FANS- our pride and strength is in THEM.......and many fathers and pappoudes go to these games- even in the AEK game Nea smyrni away section i saw a few women and children in our kerkida...nobody got hurt and theyre fine......and these are the most dangerous games. this is traditionally die hard fans territory doesnt mean they are to be scared or in danger. they are compleltly safe in your home stadium in the regular sections....even in 7 i see kids with there dads...they know theres no problems. its overexaggerated overall and these new measures are unnecesary.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcl_jcl2002 Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 Drako, I know you despise the American sports culture, but you're overdoing it. Yes the NHL has no fans, yes MLS has no passion, yes NBA passion vs. Greek League passion does not compare, but there is MASSIVE passion for the NFL, especially around playoff time. The atmosphere is completely electric and I know that they don't chant like they do in Europe, but you've got fat topless guys in subzero temperatures with their faces painted, it may look corny, but you can't deny that that isn't passion. MLB is a weird story, for the regular season, MLS sells more tickets than they do, but come playoff time, the place goes nuts. Esp this year with the Red Sox in the Series, EVERYBODY and I mean EVERYBODY was obsessed. They gave me the day off from work when they won the series and there was not a person wearing some sort of team memorabilia. I know that overall, this is much lower than European passion, but you can't say boring in every crowd you sit. I remember going to an AHL game when I was little and the players got off the bench and attacked the fans with their skates still on...don't tell me that was a picnic... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adonis Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 LOL how about the NBA Brawl this season! lol that was funny the NBA is pretty passionate Anyways, how can someone win in the NBA or the Baseball in America and call it the World Series or World Champs!??? JUst weird i guess for me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Protathlitis Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 F#$% them, i want a team with tradition, not fancy seats and merchandise and pamphlets and ads everywhere shoved in my ass - i see this happening to PAO and it makes me sad - sports in america are completly passionless and only merchandise. look at the NFL, you watch a game it takes hours because every 3 seconds there is a commericial, even the damn play of the day has a sponsor. I agree, Greek fans are unique in that they are the most passionate in europe. Osfp fans (and pao fans too i spose) outsing the home fans wherever they go. BUT when it crosses the line into dangerous anti-greek territory like the stabbings, fan club attacks, pitch invasions etc. then things have to be looked at Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zachos Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 I think that watching the NBA regular season can be boring ..If it has passion for the vistory? I once went to the Lakers and between the music and the events there is actually a game...To see how much the teams struglle for victory (compared to Europe): The Suns were 3 points ahead and let the Lakers shoot 3 three pointers in the last 13 seconds!!! In Europe the coach would be fired for this for not protecting his team's lead... But everyone was happy ever after.. And the fans did not care.. I dont know, perhaps I am a barbarian but I prefer to be able to curse sometimes.. It lets the negative energy go!! But no physical violence!!! B) And I think that sometimes it can be dangerous to go to a game in Greece... :tdown: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drakos13 Posted January 27, 2005 Author Share Posted January 27, 2005 Drako, I know you despise the American sports culture, but you're overdoing it. Yes the NHL has no fans, yes MLS has no passion, yes NBA passion vs. Greek League passion does not compare, but there is MASSIVE passion for the NFL, especially around playoff time. The atmosphere is completely electric and I know that they don't chant like they do in Europe, but you've got fat topless guys in subzero temperatures with their faces painted, it may look corny, but you can't deny that that isn't passion. MLB is a weird story, for the regular season, MLS sells more tickets than they do, but come playoff time, the place goes nuts. Esp this year with the Red Sox in the Series, EVERYBODY and I mean EVERYBODY was obsessed. They gave me the day off from work when they won the series and there was not a person wearing some sort of team memorabilia. I know that overall, this is much lower than European passion, but you can't say boring in every crowd you sit. I remember going to an AHL game when I was little and the players got off the bench and attacked the fans with their skates still on...don't tell me that was a picnic... jc i have been to many sports events- the nfl games i was so bored- all i did was eat. its not exciting- i dont want greek culture to aim to please the stupid west all the time, because then people will eventually be miserable, (dont get me wrong i love america).... sports/this subject is a part of that. I have been to see the Red Socks too dont worry- all i can say that american sports offers is damn good food outside the stadium... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Protathlitis Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 this is sort of unrelated but sort of related as well: What I have really started to hate is when Greeks in Greece use english terms for no reason. They just say the english words out of the blue and not only does it sound terrible but english is ugly compared to Greek anyway. it started with 'okay' and 'hello' and its getting worse :angry: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elastonpappou 13 Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 I think what PAO did with Ticket club is quite good!!! Drako why are you protesting man? Nothing has actually changed. We are talking about gate 7 ONLY that used to be with tickets from the Gisse!!! The rest of the stadium was booked through ticket club anyway... And to be honest most problems came from gate 7!!! I mean cmmon, there were seats thrown in the cup game against Ionikos for God sake!!!! I think if they are actually thinking of monitoring fans, arresting them and so on, then its good. If all these measures are for the eyes of the world only, then there is no point doing it.... ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drakos13 Posted January 27, 2005 Author Share Posted January 27, 2005 i am protesting over a number of things- but my main problem is that i cant go into gate 7 now, i cant go into any section. i dont have taftotia/not planning to get one for a while.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elastonpappou 13 Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 I can get a ticket for you if you like... It will be a nice FRIENDLY price!!! :P :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drakos13 Posted January 27, 2005 Author Share Posted January 27, 2005 thats not it - that wont work either- u will need id AT THE GATE with ur ticket club card......this is stupid.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adonis Posted January 28, 2005 Share Posted January 28, 2005 So get ID I dont see what the problem is! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elastonpappou 13 Posted January 28, 2005 Share Posted January 28, 2005 thats not it - that wont work either- u will need id AT THE GATE with ur ticket club card......this is stupid.... You are not some kind of Lathrometanastis are you? :P Anyway this is Greece I don't expect EVER to go to a football match with an ID.... P.S. Drako, passport would also do the job... Tell me that you don't even have a passport.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drakos13 Posted January 28, 2005 Author Share Posted January 28, 2005 Tell me that you don't even have a passport.... :whistle: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haverhillpao1 Posted January 28, 2005 Share Posted January 28, 2005 Gents, reading some of the posts about passion and supporting the teams , i am led to believe that in order to support your team,one has to Destroy the stadium Hurl objects on to the playing field Swear to opposing players and fans light fires, get into fights destroy private property all in the name of passion and showing a support for your team. HOW SORRY ARE YOU AS A FAN? One can support their team by attending the games, supporting the players on the field, criticizing their performances in a civilized matter, and if not happy with the outcomes show your displeasure by not attending the games. Not by becoming an anarchist. As a greek who lives in the USA, a passionate soccer fan, who has traveled to see Panathinaikos whenever they have been around the east coast of USA, I have to admit that some of the actions by the greek fans in the stadium are repulsive. However, when we as Greeks travel abroad, we are more than willing to cheer our teams with chants and supportive shouts, without violence and idiotic actions. Example Euro 2004. Passion is not about stupid actions, it is about the support and alliance one shows to the team. I hope that Drakos,(and I have to agree with him in some respect about the non-involvement in the stadium, of the majority of fans in American sports) attends a playoff game involving the New England Patriots or a game involving PATS VS JETS. The atmosphere is electric .To any one that attended PATS vs Colts on January 16, 2004 can attest to this. On occassions there are some fights and arguments. limited and quickly taken care off, with fines and even jail time awaiting the combatants. However, most fans in the USA, show the passion to their teams by attending the games, with their children and even their significant one's, because that is civilization at its best. The ability to enjoy a game without worrying about the language ,physical or verbal allegations, by the passionate fans....... Also the fact that a fan will be thrown out of the game and not allowed to return to the stadium, plays a major role in the behavior of the fans. Ask some Greek fans that attended the games in Foxboro in 1994 We were and still are the Beacon of civilization, why slip into the vastness of the Third World countries :box: :box: :box: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slick13 Posted January 28, 2005 Share Posted January 28, 2005 We were and still are the Beacon of civilization[/b], why slip into the vastness of the Third World countries no with this decision we are still a third world country!we are not better than uganda or albania go :gr: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dipapa Posted January 28, 2005 Share Posted January 28, 2005 People, why do you complain? The measure came to no surprise, since a penalty similar to that OSFP was imposed would be catastrophic for current PAO finances (assuming equal judgement). They want to ensure that nothing will happen in their home, at least till the end of season (as it is widely known, any public opinion anger in Greece, like this one against hooliganism, doesn't stay for long). And, afaik, this measure is also used in Holland. So we aren't a third world country just because of this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adonis Posted January 29, 2005 Share Posted January 29, 2005 Swear to opposing players and fans Whats wrong with that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Protathlitis Posted January 29, 2005 Share Posted January 29, 2005 We were and still are the Beacon of civilization[/b], why slip into the vastness of the Third World countriesno with this decision we are still a third world country!we are not better than uganda or albania go :gr: Why dont some of you keep in mind that the punishment OSFP got was still the harshest in Greek football: HARSHER THAN ANY PUNISHMENT PAO HAS EVER GOT FOR DOING WORSE THINGSAND YOU THINK THIS IS CAUSE ENOUGH TO SAY SUCH TRASH ABOUT YOUR OWN COUNTRY. even if your upset for some reason and dont mean what your saying, please say things about the greatest nation in the world Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pao123 Posted January 29, 2005 Share Posted January 29, 2005 We were and still are the Beacon of civilization[/b], why slip into the vastness of the Third World countriesno with this decision we are still a third world country!we are not better than uganda or albania go :gr: Why dont some of you keep in mind that the punishment OSFP got was still the harshest in Greek football: HARSHER THAN ANY PUNISHMENT PAO HAS EVER GOT FOR DOING WORSE THINGSAND YOU THINK THIS IS CAUSE ENOUGH TO SAY SUCH TRASH ABOUT YOUR OWN COUNTRY. even if your upset for some reason and dont mean what your saying, please say things about the greatest nation in the world you gotta start looking at the biiger picture file..this isnt about pao or oly, this is about greek football as a whole...lemme ask you something..if someone doesnt get punished for terrible behavior, do you think the behavior will conitue..YES...IT WILL...the fact that there was a punishment removied from oly and panionios shows how terriblee of a state our football is in..if noone is willing to go out on a limb and show the fans that this behaviour is not acceptable, then nothing will happen...do you want ppl to keep rioting and fighting and there to be soo much bullshit holding greek football back??? if the answer is no, then start looking at the bigger picture instead of just getting pissed at the team rivalry..i hope someone gets punished BADLY and i hope that it teaches everyone a lesson... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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