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Omonoia9

Croatia-Greece

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Tzorvas is 27, his international career should be just beginning.

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This is insane and i really dont like the fact that Gekas is not naming the person/player that he has a beef with.Tzorvas is an idiot since his NT career is just starting and when exactly he had time to get upset with anyone....EPO and Pilavios need to investigate the matter because we had 3 players departure already,Kurgiakos,Amanatidis,Gekkas and now we have Tzorvas and Seitaridis thinking of leaving also.If there is a player that bosses the rest around,yeah i would like to know his name and details so maybe he could be kicked out and the matter resolved there.If Santos is the problem because he does not treat our NT players like Otto did then F--K them.To play for any NT is an honor and not a job.If some players dont see it that way,they can all get out and let the younger guys step in.Thank god we have many and plenty good youngsters that if they get the chance,they will perform 100% better in the future than the guys we have right now.Ninis,Mitroglou,Fetfatzidis,Manolas and many others.....

Greek NT is above ANY player.Players with bigger balls have played in our NT(Saravakos,Mitropoulos,Anastopoulos,Manolas,Zagorakis and many others) but never had we heard or seen that much BS.

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i knew this would happen...only i did not expect it so soon...it really speaks to the control otto had and the respect the players had in return...its obvious there were problems that were present during otto's tenure but were not really distractions or issues...but, the moment he leaves - BAM - abandon ship...

its the greek way - its cultural...the erratic nature of many of the players personalities off the field translates into the erratic, inconsistent nature of their performance on the field...the first reaction is still "i got mine", and everything else is secondary...

santos really needs to address this swiftly and decisively...

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Well said Crazy. furthermore i'd like to add that Tzorvas is the biggest scumbag of them all! He's 28 and retiring just because he's lost his spot? SCUMBAG!

Gekas is no better, he's always had a big ego and despite his one good season in the Bundesliga he hasn't done anything to warrant that level of an ego.

PUNKS!

EPO need to release a public statement to say, "whoever wants to retire has a responsibility to their country to do it now so the manager has time to prepare before the next international game." Then if they don't do it immediately but delay their decision EPO should publicly criticise them and the media should vilify them

Edited by Euro2004

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Pesta re paidia give way to youngsters and let them schock the world and then u will see how fast greece will forget about the clickes leaving

Good bye!!!!!!!

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Greek youngsters shock the world!?!??!

:LOL:

Aside from our centerbacks and Fetfatzidis, Ninis theres absolutley nothing impressive about our young talent.

The only possible wingers we do have are going undeveloped and will eventually and already have started to wash away (Lazaros, Dimoutsos, Koutsianikoulis).

Aside from Mitroglou ------- our young strikers are GARBAGE have a look at the team rosters for yourself......There are NO good greek young striker in our league, no promising ones either.

The only upcoming striker is Papazoglou, whose not that special. Really, there is not ONE other striker. Athansiadis (sucks) Pavlis (sucks)

Gkekas is a top scorer for 2 tournaments and the only reliable forward we really have, in 4 years of the ethniki he hit 20 goals, which is impressive considering at that rate he would have been the top scoring Greek player by another 2 years.

Definitley a huge loss for us, especially as Amanatidis is gone too.

This means Kapetanos or Charisteas will be getting the call up.

As for Tzorvas, I guess its Xalkias, maybe Daskalakis in replacements..

But --- Tzorvas did not leave the team I dont think he will. If he does, thats a pretty low move.

I guess these guys figure the team is never going to go back to a World Cup, so after they enjoyed the ride theyre done with the team.

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drakos13 you can find even younger guys than the ones we know and put them in the squad.I dont care if our NT has 3-4-5 years of average results if we become something like Barca in a way.Get the even younger ones and let them swim.We will lose 1-2-10 times,at some point they will start clicking and not at this 4-5-1 style that we play in order to get results...

Gekkas is good and lovely but NT was,is and should be a HONOR not a reservation or attitude or click place.

Posible team:

---------------------------Sifakis-------------------------------------

----Torosidis------Papastathopoulos----K.Papadopoulos---Spyropoulos-

-----Fetfatzidis----Katsouranis-------Ninis--------Koutsianikoulis-------

-----------Mitroglou -------------Vellios------------------------------

and i bet money you can find some other names that you can put in the mix.......(Katsikogiannis-Manolas-Papazoglou) and give me some more.

We are not as bad as you think.That is my personal opinion tho.

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crazy, we are talking about the National Team here...vellios, koutsiani, fetzfatzidi, and papadopoulo are not ready...ninis is barely ready to be a star in the team let alone 4 players who are just basically beginning their professional careers...2-4 years down the line i hope that may be a resemblance of the squad, but not now...

whoever quits the NT because of little arguements or disagreements doesnt deserve to wear the jersey in my opinion...with this, gekas is showing everyone that he is a spoiled little brat...when you wear the jersey, you play for your country above all...amanatidis, kyrgiakos, gekas are three great players that could really really help us, but i dont want them putting on the jersey if they are going to be petty..

i agree, call up some youngsters, see how they do, get them expereince but dont build the team around them quite yet...the only ones that are ready in my opinion are mitroglou and ninis...hopefully pliatsikas when he gets fit...as i said, give some more kids the chance but we cant build the team around them yet...

santos should come out and say, if you want to represent the country, keep your mouth shut and give 110%..if your not going to do that, then tell me and i wont call you up anymore...if you have any problems, come to me and we can talk about it, if you are going to whine, get off the team..its as simple as that...

to me, what these three players are doing are embarrasing...to themselves and to our ethniki...

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Vellios??????? come on get serious 1 goal with OSFP?

I HOPE he turns out to be good. Because really, Papazoglou, Athansiadis, Pavlis are nothing, and Koutsianikoulis, Lazaros, Dimoutsos as possibly wingers are all heading towards flopping and becoming nothing. Dont be suprised if Vellios turns out to be nothing.

Its not that Greece has no good young talent --- its that its concentrated almost entirely in one area. Centerbacks. Aside from ninis, Fetfatzidis, Mitroglou theres no REAL offensive talent actually coming up the ranks.

Papazoglou is nothing really special. He'd be decent at best.

Koutsianikoulis, Dimoutsos, Lazaros are promising --- but theyre not going anywhere, and in 1-2 seasons of not playing they'll be moved to the rubbish pile. Its very likley going to happen.

Crazy about that lineup:

Spyropoulos is HORRIBLE. Tzavellas was so much better against Croatia than Spyro was against GEORGIA. Spyropoulos is declining --- like many if not most Greek players do, peak early.

Katsouranis has to go. Tziolis is a better DM too no question.

The best prospect for the ethniki is this back line. The midfield is a catastrophe and the strikers are looking glim.

a returned form Seitaridis or Torosidis-----Sokratis---Papadopoulos (either Avraam or Kyrgiakos) and Tzavellas.

If Mitroglou gets benched at OSFP when Marinakis inevtiably signs some big name to replace him, the ethniki is going to go into serious troubles.

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Its all about tryin new thing because these spoiled old dogs under ottos reign had it made new coach new phelosophy new attitude

YOU like that shock the world WE HAVE TO BE POSITIVE CAUSE THIS REALLY STINKS

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This is insane and i really dont like the fact that Gekas is not naming the person/player that he has a beef with.Tzorvas is an idiot since his NT career is just starting and when exactly he had time to get upset with anyone....EPO and Pilavios need to investigate the matter because we had 3 players departure already,Kurgiakos,Amanatidis,Gekkas and now we have Tzorvas and Seitaridis thinking of leaving also.If there is a player that bosses the rest around,yeah i would like to know his name and details so maybe he could be kicked out and the matter resolved there.If Santos is the problem because he does not treat our NT players like Otto did then F--K them.To play for any NT is an honor and not a job.If some players dont see it that way,they can all get out and let the younger guys step in.Thank god we have many and plenty good youngsters that if they get the chance,they will perform 100% better in the future than the guys we have right now.Ninis,Mitroglou,Fetfatzidis,Manolas and many others.....

Greek NT is above ANY player.Players with bigger balls have played in our NT(Saravakos,Mitropoulos,Anastopoulos,Manolas,Zagorakis and many others) but never had we heard or seen that much BS.

Go with the youth movement.

This is the perfect chance. The NT can still qualify for the Euros even with a young squad but the move has to be made now.

Leaders will develop.

Ninis is so young compared to the rest of the team that he probably can't and doesn't do what he's capable of.

If a bunch of old farts are still hanging around then the next generation can move forward.

Yes there will be some bad results along the way but overall the team will grow. It has to be manage tactifully. Can the new coach do this???? I can't say for sure but if he wants a more ball control and attacking team then some changes have to be made.

Let the 27 year olds and up move on if they want. Germany did this and ended up with a better team who will still be good for the next world cup.

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The question of our youth and their level is an interesting one and I'm somewhere in between Drakos and Crazy. We have one of the best u21 teams in Europe but how many are ready?

No point in wasting time on Papastathopoulos, we know he's class.

Ninis, 20, (PAO) - he's too lightweight to be a star but he does have some ability. He needs to move abroad to develop his game. In the mean time he needs a kick up the backside because people are overrating him and there are signs it's getting to his head because he isn't always working hard. His best position is right wing, it's the only place he can be effective for the national team. Conclusion: he could be a starter.

Koutsianikoulis, 22, (PAOK) - He needs to leave PAOK asap but one thing is for sure, he's a striker NOT a winger. He doesn't have the dribbing skills or crossing ability to be a winger, but his finishing can be good and his pace is frightening. He's a striker and should be given a chance with the men's team. When we're defensive and teams are playing a high line he'd be a constant threat because all it takes is one long ball forward, a Mitroglou flick on and he's through on goal. Conclusion: he coule be a useful impact sub.

Dimoutsos, 22, (PAO) - I'm a big fan of him. I think he's the most underrated young player we have. He too needs to leave his club though because PAO won't give him a chance. Conclusion: He's not ready for the men's team and needs to develop first.

A.Papazoglou, 22 (PAOK) - Big and a threat aerially as i try to think of other attributes he has I can only imagine those old cowboy films where some tumble weed blows across the screen and all you can hear is wind. Conclusion: He's not good enough and never will be!

Lazaros, 23, (PAO) - He's not a youngster anymore and he hasn't developed as we'd have hoped. He needs to leave Greece to develop. Conclusion: In years to come he could develop enough to be a squad player, right now, he's not ready.

Pavlis, 20, (AEK) - Showed alot of promise when he first broke through but he's small and his stature seems to be a major issue. He lacks dangerous attributes and he's not ready. Conclusion: I doubt he'll make it and he's not ready now.

Athanasiadis, 21, (PAOK) - Quite simply not good enough and doesn't have the mental strength to improve either. Conclusion: not good enough.

Tachtsidis, 19, (Genoa, on loan at Cesena) - Has the build and the versatility to be dangerous in years to come, but he's always clubbing and stuff and i doubt he'll be great. Conclusion: not ready yet.

Soiledis, 19, (Olympiakos) - I'm a big fan of this kid. He's an out and out left winger. He's only focus is to beat a full back and whip in a cross. Ketsbaia was also known to be a big fan. Unfortunately he seems to be yet another victim of the Greek club mentality. When Ketsbaia was sacked last season Soiledis barely featured, instead they prefered Oscar and/or Maresca on the left :LOL: This season they've signed Riera so he's off to OFI on loan <_< Clearly playing in the 2nd division will stunt his development. Conclusion: has the talent to be one for the future but without any trust being shown in him he'll probably end up like Dimoutsos. Either way, he's not ready for the NT yet.

Fetfatsidis, 19, (Olympiakos) - has the potential to be very good but at the moment he's ridiculously overrated. They are calling him "Messi" in the Olympiakos papers :LOL: For a start he's not that sort of player and secondly he's still on the bench for the u-19s (and that's without Ninis and Pliatsikas being available to them!). He has alot of talent though and could be one for the future. Conclusion: he's not ready yet.

Giannis Papadopoulos, 21, (Olympiakos) - His work rate and determination are superb! He's the sort of kid that could fight his way into a team but in terms of natural ability he is limited. Conclusion: could perhaps be a squad player for the national team.

Siovas, 21, (Panionios) - He's great for the u21s but i'm not sure he's ready for the men's team. I know this is going to sound very Ottoesque of me but i'm not keen on giving kids a go that play for mediocre clubs in Greece. Except for 3 or 4 games a season he isn't tested as he would be at international level. If I was his agent i'd get him a move abroad. Conclusion: possibly one for the future, not ready now though.

A.Papazoglou, 21, (Olympiakos, on loan at Panserraikos) - Not to be confused with PAOK's Papazoglou, this guy is a defender. He has talent but hasn't proven himself in the superleague yet let alone for the NT. Conclusion: not ready.

K.Papadopoulos, 18, (Schalke) - I think he's class and although he's still young I honestly can't see an argument for him not being in the squad. Conclusion: He's inexperienced but should be given a chance off the bench in games we have secured. So he should be a squad player.

Argyropoulos, 20, (Asteras) - A good youngster but hasn't shown anything to suggest he should be in the men's team. Conclusion: not ready

Argyriou, 22, (AEK) - I like him. He's big and strong but has yet to play at a strong team (he was at Panthrakikos last season). conclusion: not as good as the other right backs we have so he's not ready yet.

Mitroglou, 22, (Olympiakos) - He all the attributes (except pace) that a forward could want. The only questionnable thing is his desire and focus in front of goal becuase he can be lazy and can miss sitters. Conclusion: Has alot of talent and as long as he's working hard he should be in the first team.

Pliatsikas, 22, (Schalke) - He was a big talent and very versatile before getting injured. The only question is how he's going to react to his injury. Conclusion: it was a big injury. If he returns as good as he was he has the ability to push for a first team place.

Vellios, 18, (Iraklis) - A young talent but it's not even arguable that he should be in the team. Conclusion: Maybe one for the future but isn't ready

We have some very good young players but the fact is only a handful could make the squad and only one should be guaranteed a first team place as long as he's playing well, (Mitroglou). This is a vital transitional period though and many of these guys could and should help so I just hope Santos' decision's improve

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euro excellent post....

common theme? domestic greek league kills our young players....

when the fish begins to stink it starts at the head......

everything is inter-related to some degree.........

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wait, so 23 is not a youngster but 22 is??

how do you know athanasiadis doesnt have the mentality? he is 21...he has time..

i agree with some of this but it seems like you are also too quick to judge some player..who knows what the will be like in the near future...

its very difficult to tell how a player up until the ages of around 24-25 will progress...yes, for some with exception talent its easier, but for players with potential its very difficult unless you are seeing them on a daily basis, which none of us are...also remember some players peak earlier and some later...

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mangas21 that's exacltly my point, the longer they stay the more their development is stunted.

Pao123, At 22 you can still play for the u21 team if you were 21 at the time that the qualification process began. That's why Mitroglou, Koutsianikoulis, Papasta, etc, are eligible to play for the u21s. At 23 years old you're either a fully fledged member of the NT or you aren't playing international football. That's why I don't consider Lazaros a youngster. There has to be a cut off point somewhere, otherwise i could ask you the same thing. If you consider a 23 year old a youngster why not a 24 year old? etc.

I don't believe Athanasiadis has the mentality because he doesn't seem to play with confidence on the pitch. Furthermore when he was a kid (young, like 10 or something) he went abroad with his family to play in Germany and Italy and he got home sick and forced his family back to Greece. That's totally understandable, he was a kid, but I also read that when he was 16-17 he got another offer from an Italian club but again he didn't want to leave Greece. A kid that wants to make it would give everything to get there. Of course that alone doesn't mean he's mentally weak, but like i said, he also seems a little mentally weak when playing. Either way that's a judgement on his future, and i may be wrong about his future, but that's all speculation and irrelevant as to whether he can play for the national team now. At this moment in time, mentally strong or not, he isn't good enough to play for the NT. The same applies to the other players we're discussing. There's no point in talking about whether they will be ready in 5 years time. They could all become excellent, who knows? But at this moment in time only Mitroglou, Pliatsikas and Papastathopoulos could cement a place, while K.Papadopoulos, G.Papadopoulos, Koutsianikoulis, and Ninis are capable of being in the squad and battling for a place in the team. That's my opinion of course.

One thing i will say though, i strongly disagree with you about not knowing how a player will develop until he's 24-25. At that age half their careers are over. Rooney is 24, Ronaldo is 25, etc. It's not just the elite players that we should be looking at either. Katsouranis was 25 when we won Euro 2004, Charisteas was 25, etc. In other words Charisteas' best moments of his career came up until the point he was 25, not after it. We need to get away from the mentality that's prevelant in Greece which considers players youngsters until they are 23-24. A player should be ready for first team action by the time he's 21. Arsenal's players are and there's no reason they should be trusted while ours aren't. Mitroglou was a better youngster than Bendtner, Ninis was better than Ramsey and Wilshiere, there wasn't much difference between Koustsianikoulis and Walcott either. They have faith in their youth, we don't, that's the difference

Edited by Euro2004

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I mostly agree with Euro.

The grand conclusion, is that aside from Ninis, Mitroglou none of those players are capable or ready for the senior team.

I would not have bothered with defensive players. We are set defensively. Our urgency comes from midfielders (not defensive midfielders) and strikers. Where we don't have much talent coming up thats going to make an impact anytime soon--- if ever.

Giannis Papadopoulos i doubt will become anything, hes just never going to see time on the field. OSFP bought HORDES of midfielders, this kid is very likely sit on the bench until his contract expires. a total WASTE, as his career could be better had he stayed at Iraklis, developed to the point where he could go abroad.

Fetfatzidis I disagree on ---- if he plays consistently like he did against Iraklis, put the kid on the team. (not sure if you saw the highlights, but he looked like OSFP's best player out there) If he becomes a critical OSFP player in the selection through all the tons of junk signings then hes got something to him worth putting him in. Hes on the U21 team now btw, not U19.

Lazaros - he was so good last winter and improved a lot since Nioplias took over. He just needs to play, but even so it may be worth trying him on the ethniki, as theres not one real winger on the whole squad.

Koutsianikoulis is dying at PAOK another Stelios Illiadis case.

Dimoutsos is such a sad story. Hes being killed off at PAO. Hes very talented, but once his time at the U21 team is over, it'll be the start of the decline for his career too. Not at all sure why PAO fans berate him, as when he actually DID play for the club he had many matches where he was our best player under Peseiro, and the guy was only 17-18 years old.

Players like him and all the other youth being horded by OSFP, PAO, PAOK are reasons why the Greek Cup should be only Greek players.

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i can yap all day about this, but i will spare you all the diatribe... buts it fascinating to watch this play out, even from a distance...

sports are microcosms of life..yet. otto genius was his ability to corral the greek/soccer player egos into a, for the most part, self-LESS group of athletes pulling in the same direction...(as selfless as i have seen) his tactics (loyalties, etc) were questionable, yet he understood how to engineer out egos for the betterment of team....and he accomplished alot with a little....these elements are gone - want proof? look how quickly all the rats are jumping ship....want more proof? Kyroagos not only was left off a game here and there, he was hurt, yet still played when otto asked him...now, hes healthy, has spot locked up and leaves....all these controversies did not happen overnight.....yet were not issues before....bad signs, very bad signs....

Greece has always been a very "protectionist" state....they talk a big game about "democracy" and "free economies" but its all bullshit....trust me, i have worked in greece, dealt with some of the biggest names in industry and legal, and will tell you unequivocally, that the movers and shakers function more like a bunch of slave drivers than captains of industry....why is this relevant? they control the soccer teams also. the players a chattel - a means to an end....and the decisions are premised on that ALONE....

what should happen is a limit on foreign players, and how many can be on the field at one time, (a low number) a tax that goes to weaker clubs if you exceed that limit, and a formula that allows greek player to go unencumbered overseas if foreign based limits are exceeded.....the result? 3 or 4 teams dont beat up on the rest of the leaugue's garbage, greek players get time on the field, not on the pine and MORE foreign players will scatter themselves across more super leaugue teams now that you can have more parity....the next wave of results? more competion, more greek players developing, bigger crowds everywhere, healthier balance sheets, better facilities, more money pumped into youth development and, believe it or not, more pride in wearing the shirt.......

problem? not enough time but its all based on lack of leadership in EPO and the powers that be....look greeks arent stupid...get a bunch that can agree and work together and u have a very formidable group.....(and here's where it all comes together) otto was able to do this - albeit on a very very limited scale - with a soccer team......

we all know what wrong...my kids will probably be repeating the same things in 30 years...until the mentality of the mover and shakrs changes, nothing will change dramatically.....

this team needs to have the core gutted out.....like euro said, show some trust in the young guys, show them you have confidence and good things can happen....

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euro, i believe all in all we are arguing the same thing...i think you just misunderstood what i was talking about judging a young players talent before 24-25...

what i mean was that their progress and talent as young players is difficult to judge before that age...i can now judge rooney and ronaldos talent at the age they are at now bc of their successful development...before this age, talent needs to be fostered and supported...it is at this age that MOST players really make the step up from being young players with potential and talent into world class, maturing players...the fact is that players bodies and physical condition are not at their peak until around that age...it plateaus for a number of years (depending on the individual) and then fades off...physically, there is a difference between a 22yr old body and a 29 yr old body...even as fit as a 22 yr can be...this is also going to be a contributing factor to what will happen in the future (players burning out sooner, players retiring at an earlier age and players seeing worst injuring in their mid-late 20s and early 30s) premature physical development...but that is another whole issue together (but thats what i base most of my labeling of youngster/mid-aged/advanced aged players, not whether they qualify for playing at the youth level) and also just so you know, players that are 23 are still eligible to play for the olympic team which is still considered a 'youth' competition....telos pantwn...

in modern football players need to get first team expereince extra young these days...look at my previous posts all throughout oly's forum, you were the only one agreeing with me EURO!!!!..we need to integrate these players into our teams...unless we do so we will never see them step up into the national team...as much belief as we can give them, a player like vellios, who has rarely featured for iraklis, will almost never be successful on a national team level bc he has never competed at that high of a level..

these players need to be fostered, not thrown under the bus...and lets not forget again, that alot of players develop at different ages and under diffrernt circumstances..for instance, dimoutso could move to a club abroad and at 26-28 could become a vital part of the national team..who knows.. look at luca toni, no one even really knew who he was until he was 26-27 yrs old...

in saying this, i like what teams like pao and aek are doing this year..its not IDEAL but its a step in a good direction...they are integrating players into their squad and getting them playing some time...manolas, marino, ioannidis, argyriou, gentsoglou...these guys are the next generation and i think will see some decent time this year...they need to see more time and be molded into great players by their clubs..and then all the other teams need to follow suit as well...

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Drakos i know Fetfa is in the u21s, it was a typing error to say u19. That's why i said he's on the bench despite the fact that Ninis (men's NT) and Pliatsikas (injured) aren't available. My point still stands though, the kid is on the bench for the u21s so saying he's the answer to the NT's problems might be a bit premature. I won't be adament though because no i did not see him against Iraklis. I did see him against Standard last season though and I have seen him in their pre-season friendlies. From what i've seen he's neat on the ball but not spectacular. That's a problem because doesn't have any physical attributes. He isn't particularly fast and he isn't particularly strong either. That can be a problem in the modern game as we frequently see with Ninis getting bullied, so small players that aren't fast have to have exceptional skill.

I've just found this highlight video of him on youtube. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwuRlkSXfbU

If you actually watch him against Atromitos (ignore the youth games, you can't judge a player from that) then you're left asking yourself. What does he actually do? He's neat in possession. He turns on the ball well which is a skill Xavi has mastered. It basically makes it very difficult for you to get dispossesed because your body is always between the opponent and the ball. But what does he do in this video which would contribute to a team winning a game? He tries to go on positive runs, then turns back and plays a simple pass because he doesn't have blistering dribbling skills. His passes are pretty basic, they aren't exactly defence splitting, etc. So why would he be a better option than anyone in the team now? Clearly according to Georgiadis (for those that might not know he's the u21 manager) he isn't even a first option for them.

Have to be careful because it's a fine line between rating a player and giving him a chance, and blowing his ability out of proportion and ruining him.

Mangas21 I totally agree with your analysis of Otto's ability to squash egos. Unfortunately I believe he only managed that because of what he achieved. So unless we got a big name in i can imagine the players' egos always dominating. I mean check this out, rumours are that some of the retirements have been brought about because of a poor atmosphere in the dressing room. What's causing it? Katsouranis is apparently a favourite of Santos

http://www.sportdog.gr/v3/article.aspx?id=145207

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the timing, the difference in defectors (two guys who may lose playin time, one guy who was called back, and one guy who would play all time), the sequence of events and how quickly it all happened all seem to suggest something very, very odd.

But i go back to same thing, the mentality of these little bitches - it all starts from there...

hey i lived it....i was playin in a playoff tournamnt and we had only five guys...we had a guy playin center from greece..in the middle of the second half he got pissed that he was not getting the ball enough...so he just walked off the court and left !!!!!!!!! knowing that we would have to play 5 on 4, but - sta a*****a tou....

ive seen this so often icant tell you..its not the exception, its the rule....what the prior regime did was the exception....

players pulling together can accomplish alot while the same group bickering can get beat by latvia and albania and georgia.....

i said in an earlier post before all this even became an issue that i did not think santos could pull this off and that we could see the team turn into a bordelaki pretty quickly...and few of you, namely my boy euro agreed...well i never thought it would happen so quickly.......what happens in the coming months will shape the NT for the next several years...

stay tuned......

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plain and simple we don't export enough players because they'd rather stay in greece in the comfort zone picking up decent wages enjoying a nice climate in a 30 game league season and its not too challenging thats why mediocre foreign players all flock to greece and why greek players tend to stay. salpi ninis torosidis could have left but choose to remain. vyntra turned down germany a couple of years ago, the list is endless and when a player like kone went to brescia iraklis tried to block his move like paok did when lazaros was on the verge of joining liverpool. also why did players like basinas and lyberopoulos wait til they were in their 30s before moving.

Croatia we'd all agree has a better side than greece despite having a population thats less than half of greece and has a league that's inferior to the greek league. croatia produce and export more players than we do.

holland is another good example, there are loads of dutch players playing in the big leagues all over europe.

until more of our young players move abroad our NT will continue to be mediocre at best

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i've just heard Fetfatsidis has signed a 5 year contract with olympiakos until 2015. another young player who's decided to stay in greece, lets see how much playing time he gets and how he develops

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