greeksoccerfanatic Posted August 19, 2005 Share Posted August 19, 2005 What I can't understand is why Otto does not bring players on the squad that I am sure would help our midfield. I say bring in Stoltidi or Kafe, and get rid of Basina, because he is making me disgusted with his play of late. Bring in Samara to play up-front, instead of Vryza, and possibly even Xouto, since Otto has called him up before, more specifically in the Euro 2004 Qualifiers. Now most of you say "F uck Xouto", and he is garbage, but lets face it paidia, we are on the brink of elimination from qualifying for Germany 2006, and we need any goal scoring option that is available to us. Some of you keep saying stick to Haristea and Vryza, but what I can't understand is how can you stick with players that in six games (and counting) have not put the ball in the net. So what if they played good against Belgium (to me they played mediocre football), they are not producing and doing their job of scoring goals, and this deserves them a spot on the bench. How can you stick with players that can't score is my question, and I am sure it should be everybody's question in this forum that realise our Ethniki is in shambles at the moment. Otto must shake things up, and in a hurry! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drakos13 Posted August 19, 2005 Share Posted August 19, 2005 why we stick to them? the problem is not finishing. No no no. If u saw vs Belgium the problem was all midfield. Strikers need to get the ball and have support to do anything...Charisteas had to go and grab the ball somtimes the midfield were struggling so much.....him and Vryzas were 2 of our strongest yestrday.....mediocre? they were the only ones who could control the ball. hold it up and redistribute it back to midfielders and make runs...nobody did anything to support except for lybe.....charisteas had a beuty header missed by an inch...was a sure goal...vryzas got a cross too quick but still managed to get it on goal....they will do here job. Midfield has to stop sucking and next person who hits more than one long ball a game should be dropped. that was all that happned in germany and look how shitty we played. remember being a striker is more than just weather u score or not...its about opening up the game offensively and helping the midfield attack too...if you cant have chances made for u or good runs for you to make a pass of course we dont score...... karagkounis was decent yesterday but there was no other creativity in midfield...that is a much bigger problem greece has tons of great strikers not enough midfield. choutos and samaras would have just been even worse.....samaras isnt ready and choutos could only rebuild his career if he went to a lower table A ethniki club....he had some skill but there are so many more skilled options. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ziaka Posted August 19, 2005 Share Posted August 19, 2005 Good point Drako. I also believe our problems start at midfield. They are just not making things happen. And on top of that our defense in the last game was also poor. There are enough strikers at Otto's disposal, and we don't need to add additional ones in Choutos and Samaras. Choutos days in Ethniki are over in my opinion. He had his chance and he blew it. As for Samaras, he is young and he is part of the U-21 team, which hasn't been setting things on fire either. Let him gain his experience in the U-21 team, and if and when the senior squad fails to qualify to WC 2006, let the rebuilding process begin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AEKARA-YIA-PANTA Posted August 19, 2005 Share Posted August 19, 2005 Kyriakos has no business being on the national team.....he played extremely poor against Belgium....also, Kapsis had a terrible game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HellenicFront Posted August 19, 2005 Share Posted August 19, 2005 below is an interesting article from todays Sportime: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greeksoccerfanatic Posted August 19, 2005 Author Share Posted August 19, 2005 Hellenicfront, I also agree that Georgato and Stoltidi should be in the Ethniki, and Ziko would be strong in midfield. Georgatos has the capability of opening up the game on the left with his deadly crosses, and runs down the left flank, and Stoltidi is a workhorse in the midfield who is not affraid to shoot the ball on goal. Ziko would be an interesting addition and an effective one. And to those that do not see that Haristea and Vryza are not the answer for our team than you are truly not in touch with reality. When will you get it through your heads that these guys simply can't score. So what if they created chances, and held up the ball well against Belgium, and were good (again mediocre to my liking). Bottom line, no goals, another loss, and things against Kazakhstan could be very interesting. Simply put WE DONT SCORE AND GERMANY IS HISTORY! Now its time for some of you to realise this. Ziaka, why do you think Xouto's days in the Ethniki are over megale? After all it was in the Qualifiers for Euro 2004 that Otto called him up and he played well as I can remember against Ukraine. Do you see any body else scoring goals on this team? I don't, and if can't understand you need to put the ball in the back of the net to win then your football perception is truly distorted. I say bring in Papadopoulo, Samara, Xouto, Kafe, Stoltidi, Georgato, Ziko and this could shake up our Ethniki, and put some wins on the board for us. I dont know about Germany 2006, it may be too late, but for Qualifying for Euro 2008 Switzerland/Austria. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batigol Posted August 19, 2005 Share Posted August 19, 2005 I think the article was spot on with it's reference to Dellas being the cornerstone of the defence and Fyssas and Seiteridis are a bit lost without him. Insofar as bringing in new/other players into the Ethniki, I don't see it being a viable option at this point. How many more qualifying game are there? With the league starting up, would all of these new additions have time to gel properly during practices? Look, I'm certainly not against bringing in some new blood, but some of the names mentioned are simply not going to happen. Papadopoulos - has been called up by Rehagel in the past. It'll happen again. The kid just has to find his scoring touch again. Give it time. Samaras - too bloody young. Like Ziaka mentioned, this kid is on the under-21 team. Let him develop there so that when Euro 2008 comes around, he'll be ready. Choutos - thanks but no thanks. He is not the be all and end all in striking options for the entire country of Greece. Just because he's scored a few goals in the past and he's put a few in for Inter during some friendlies doesn't mean he warrants a position on the National team. Kafe - has been called up regularly to the National Squad. Rehagel has used him sparingly and, to be honest, after seeing him play for a few years now with his various clubs and the National team, I'm not impressed at all. Stoltidis - this kid should get a chance and will in the next few months. Georgatos - forget about it. His attitude toward the team blows and his attitude toward Rehagel after that 5-1 loss to Finland showed me that he doesn't deserve to be on the team. He has skills. No doubt about that. But they are all offensive. He bites it on defence. Not reliable at all in the back. Ziko - I've often wondered about this guy. Obviously he has the talent but Rehagel doesn't call him. Personality clashes? Who knows? Ultimately, if the team doesn't make it to the world cup this time around, so be it. It's not the end of the world. Personally I took great gratification in the games against Turkey. They played like lions and certainly deserved to win both games as far as I was concerned but hey, it didn't happen and thems the breaks. The changeover is happening though. Slowly but surely, it is happening. Players without clubs aren't going to be playing soon. It's happened with Tsiartas, it'll happen with Basinas. Just as it will happen with loads of others. I believe that now is the time to rally behind the team and give them support. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Korisos Posted August 19, 2005 Share Posted August 19, 2005 georgatos/zikos unless they kiss and make up w/ otto, it's not going to happen. the team should remain pretty much unchanged cos bringing in new players at this point will make things worse but of course if the team was doing better nobody would be calling for these changes. why don't we all take a deep breath, calm down and realize how influencial dellas is to this team and zago as well. i mean you saw how we played w/out the 2 best players on the team at confed. cup, when dellas returns things will turn out okay and there will be no need to draw up a list of players to be called. i'll support till the very end and now is the time they really need the support but i have said before and will repeat again that the ethniki will need a miracle to get 2nd place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billydagreek Posted August 19, 2005 Share Posted August 19, 2005 Guys lets not blame one guy or the other ......this is a team sport and the team is not playing very good...in every position not just the forwards......anyway everybody is goin crazy over the belgium game.Remember it was a friendly..yeah we played like shiit but i dont care cuz it doesnt count...if the game counts then ill care.....honestly vs ukraine, turkey etc... when it counted we played much better, and had scoring chances we just didnt finish and had some bad luck....ukraine game should have ended in a tie at worse or a 1-0 win for us, but they caught a lucky break.....anyway my point is its not charisteas fault or anyones fault, its the team as a whole, they seem to have lust their desire and the magic the had last year.....bring in choutos, or samaras or whoever....if you allow a couple goals a game and dont control the ball well it wont matter................... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drakos13 Posted August 19, 2005 Share Posted August 19, 2005 Hellenicfront, I also agree that Georgato and Stoltidi should be in the Ethniki, and Ziko would be strong in midfield. this i also agree with......yes Georgatos is a complete douchebag of a person and has a bad attitude, i........but he can really open the game up and make some chances happen, . He also a great setpeice taker which we need BADLY. the last 4 games corners have been omega ethnik level...i could honestly hit them better myself. Otto and Gregory must both must stop being babies and make up for the good of the team.....Otto should go and talk to him and settle the issue in private, then Georgatos can publicy state he is willing to help and put the team before him. We really need a player with his talents up in left midfield.......he is one of the few creative players we have.... as for Zikos i think he should replace Basinas on the team, but I prefer Zagorakis and Katsouranis..... someone said kirgiakos was bad--- yeah he was mediocre yesterday...but when this guy gets in form with a club he will be a monster again.....when hes at his best him and Dellas will be incredible..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aekrossoponti Posted August 19, 2005 Share Posted August 19, 2005 georgatos is a great player on his day but hes not the answer. hes 33 i think. plus he quit the ethniki, and then before the euro he said he will be available again. what kind of behavior is that? as for zikos he has to be called in.no doubt. he has played ethniki and knows most of the team before so he will adjust easily. somehow he was injured when otto took over the ethniki and didn t get called up at all. by the stubborn otto. that was a mistake in my opinion. tavlaridis has to be called into the squad. we need at least one of papadopoulos and gekas because they are the only quick players we have. we desperately need someone for the setpieces. i dont know if zikos is good at em, salpiggidis can take feee kicks and corners decently but apart from them. .. problem is the confederations cup in germany was the time for experiments. rehagel didn t use that chance. now its too late so fresh blood is not likely to happen against kasachstan. :tdown: i think you shouldn t underestimate kafes. he and stoltidis were the best greek players at olympiakos last season. but its hard for him to make his mark if he gets only 20 minutes at the end while belgium leads 2-0. :gr: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miko Posted August 19, 2005 Share Posted August 19, 2005 There has been no shortage of panic or hysteria concerning the national team during the last four or five months. Poor team play and the failure to score goals is givivng all of us a good reason to worry! But of the last six, only two matter in the grand scheme of things (the Turkey and Ukraine games). In both those two games we matched and bettered our opponents in the amount of quality opportunities which were created--we did this through creative play from our midfield! Unfortunately, luck did not favour us. Throughout the posts I hear the same complaints about the lack of service and how our forwards are left stranded....B**L S**T! Confederations Cup aside, the midfield has worked tirelessly in the past 2 and a half years, and they have produced when needed! Where we go wrong in attack is the lack of a true goalscorer who is capable off producing moments of brilliance! Vryzas can keep possession and Charisteas can finish (at times), but neither one can dribble or singlehandedly unhinge a defence. Otto needs to try new strikers and he needs to do this now! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest GreekSoussou Posted August 19, 2005 Share Posted August 19, 2005 With Dellas back, do you think things will really just fall back into place?? The midfield needs a grade A change. AND SOON. :gr: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aek21 Posted August 20, 2005 Share Posted August 20, 2005 I think the problem is that the players are burntout, they lost the desire to win, to score, to do anything. Bringing Lybe was probably the smartest move Otto has made yet. Lybe will be the creative force in the team that we desperately need, once gets back our defense will improve greatly since he's had a lot of rest. Vryzas has been more unlucky in front of goal more than anything, odd angles and the post have kept him from scoring, Giannkopoulos is one ok not the best but decent. Tooooooo predictable on freekicks, he loses the ball often and ends up diving, but our best finisher. Seems only good on runs and close range finishes. Charisteas can't do anything more or less useless as of recently, Vryzas in my opinion is our best forward. Of all three, he has come closest to scoring and has fooled defenses into paying more attention to him than the play. In the mid field only change should Basinas and in place should go Katsouranis. Karagounis and Zagorakis have been by far our best player and in my opinion have always been. Zagorakis is the heart, soul and lungs of our team. He leads us, he is fearless, plays extremely smart, comes all the way back to cut out plays, sets up the attack, I'd 30% of the crosses come from him 60% from Seitaridis and 10% from the rest. Zagorakis is the filter of almost all the passes and makes more sliding tackles then good knows what. Karagounis could take an entire team down with his quick pace, agility, dribbiling and deadly shot. There is no replacing these guys, kafes is just not good enough, even for a sub. Our defense begins with Dellas, Kapsis and Nikopolidis, Seitaridis is probably our only threat because of his crossing and he is a great maker just like the rest. Fyssas is decent, can pull off some great runs down the flank. But Dellas, Kap and Niko organise everything back there, they are like stone brick walls for atleast half the time (not consistent as much as I'd like them to be). my line-up Giannakopoulos Vryzas Lybe Karagounis Zagorakis Kats Fyssas Kapsis Dellas Seitaridis Nikopolidis I think this our best option for starting 11, for me I feel these have what it takes to take our team where want we them to be. Giannakopoulos isn't a striker, but he seems to be the only one who can finish his chances. Chari has really lost his touch since joining Ajax. I just hope he gets back because he is truly one of our best forwards but 6 games and not even coming close, just sad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HellenicFront Posted August 20, 2005 Share Posted August 20, 2005 your right another factor is the players are burnt out, we sometimes forget we think the momentum started during the Euro 2004 tournament, when the "revolution" really started 2 years before that when England Tied Greece 2-2 in Old Trafford and except for a few losses during those two years leading up to the tourney the Team was pretty much consistent and as the article from Sportime quotes (even though they are referring it to our defenders) for argument sake I'll apply to the whole team they were " Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAOK_001 Posted August 21, 2005 Share Posted August 21, 2005 your right but still it not like we shouldn't qualify for this world cup...we have the players, the coach, experience and skill. all we need to do is play well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slick13 Posted August 21, 2005 Share Posted August 21, 2005 we have also got good defensive players like nastos and luboutis of perugia ac. they will play in the serie a this season. id say give them a go! cause fyssas is also getting a bit old. we need to have fast r/l wingers and fyssas is not getting faster. luboutis could cover this place Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drakos13 Posted August 21, 2005 Share Posted August 21, 2005 we have also got good defensive players like nastos and luboutis of perugia ac. they will play in the serie a this season. id say give them a go! cause fyssas is also getting a bit old. we need to have fast r/l wingers and fyssas is not getting faster. luboutis could cover this place louboutis? nastos? come on they cant play for the ethniki!!Fyssas stll has 2 years left in him.....he did well vs Belgium....he is also the bes DL weve got. Venetidis is crap, and unless giorgopoulos of aek is that great...i dont know..mayve if we were desperate Tzorbatzakis of kallithea is actually pretty good after seeing him play with thrino......maybe when he makes his move to a bigger club... give panagiotis lagos a try in about a year- he is a big talent...and eventualy Darlas when he breaks into the first team after a season....they are no doubt the future of our DL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aek21 Posted August 22, 2005 Share Posted August 22, 2005 Basinas is out, he isn't lazy, he needs rest. I think kapsis is also getting that tired too. Charisteas, he's most dangerous for crosses in the box, but now our oppenents have covered that whole area just expecting crosses. Defensively we've got the good idea, just need to cut down on mistakes. Ofensively we aren't making things happen, teams expect to just cross and head, like japan. Against Mexico we could have scored 4 atleast, problem was finishing. hen players like chari seem like they standing out of play, reason for that is too distract the defense, open them up. I've seen Vryzas do it the most, just look at his runs. Upfront Vryzas has a cool head, very smart and isn't entirely concerned on him scoring goals but the team winning. And I that also leads to the team being too conservative, not taking chances because they feel they're being selfish. Too much emphasis on team play, not always thinking on your own. Which was a clear mistake by our team at the confeds. But by now Otto has used these games to see what works. Hopefully we will get back on track. I predict a 3-1 win over Kazakhstan, it happened before why not now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billydagreek Posted August 23, 2005 Share Posted August 23, 2005 aek you hit it on the head i think...our opponents didnt know what to expect from us until recently and now they are prepared for our crosses...coupled with how bad our crosses are ...our main weapon is gone......we should still beat kaza though...if we dont then this ethniki is done..................and forget about hosting the euro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hellas02 Posted September 4, 2005 Share Posted September 4, 2005 A Big Problem I would say is our Lack of Shot From far it seems like all of our shots are rite in front of the net Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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