plato-ny Posted December 15, 2005 Share Posted December 15, 2005 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plato-ny Posted December 15, 2005 Author Share Posted December 15, 2005 OOOPSSS. Mourinho coaches Chelsea, not Manchester United... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYC_Olympiakos Posted December 15, 2005 Share Posted December 15, 2005 King Otto is #1 on my list !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoussouGreek Posted December 16, 2005 Share Posted December 16, 2005 Coach Otto will always be #1 in my book Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billydagreek Posted December 16, 2005 Share Posted December 16, 2005 einai kai o protos o trellos...................GEIA SOU RE OTTO......................!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheCity1924 Posted December 18, 2005 Share Posted December 18, 2005 Pio Mourinho.... Otto did the impossible, Mourinho did what was expected of a coach with a blank check. OTTO :nw: :nw: :nw: :nw: :nw: :nw: :nw: :nw: :nw: :nw: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Korisos Posted December 18, 2005 Share Posted December 18, 2005 Otto is #1 on every one's list in here but Morunhio is a briliant coach, it's not just a matter of splash the cash, players also need a good coach. Morounhio was getting criticized for his defensive tactics that gave him 3 points every week and chelsea were very unlucky to lose to bloody liverpool in the champions league. i read one of morunhio's quotes once and he said something like, if abramovich was managing the team they would be in last place and if he was managing abramovich's business they would be broke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batigol Posted December 18, 2005 Share Posted December 18, 2005 i read one of morunhio's quotes once and he said something like, if abramovich was managing the team they would be in last place and if he was managing abramovich's business they would be broke. Cool quote.I'm very happy Otto got the recognition in a foreign sports journal. It's one things for Greeks to recognize what he's done for the NT, quite another for a foreign paper to do that as they're usually inclined to choose one of the bigger name coaches like a Mourinho, etc.... Excellent job Otto! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Montreal_Thrillos Posted December 18, 2005 Share Posted December 18, 2005 how come sollied and malezani are not on that list? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYC_Olympiakos Posted December 19, 2005 Share Posted December 19, 2005 Otto is #1 on every one's list in here but Morunhio is a briliant coach, it's not just a matter of splash the cash, players also need a good coach. Morounhio was getting criticized for his defensive tactics that gave him 3 points every week and chelsea were very unlucky to lose to bloody liverpool in the champions league. i read one of morunhio's quotes once and he said something like, if abramovich was managing the team they would be in last place and if he was managing abramovich's business they would be broke. easier said then done lets give Mourinho credit here he is obnoxios and arrogant but he wins look at Real Madrid they are the poster boyz of spending money and how many coaches have they have since Bosque departure i think on there 5 coach now not sure lost count lol if Mourihho goes a season with out winning a major trophy he is either gone or not the hot seat lol But he still doesn't Beat King Otto Remember King Otto has 4 Bundesliga titles and 4 German cups and i think he won a uefa cup not sure on that O Germanos einai trelos !!!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olympiakara10 Posted December 20, 2005 Share Posted December 20, 2005 how come sollied and malezani are not on that list? :LOL: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Korisos Posted December 20, 2005 Share Posted December 20, 2005 Remember King Otto has 4 Bundesliga titles and 4 German cups and i think he won a uefa cup not sure on that :nono: :nono: :nono: he won the German cup w/ Dusseldorf in 1980 Bundesliga titles w/ Werder Bremen in 1988, 1993 German cup in 1991, UEFA cup in 1992 and another German cup in 1994 and another Bundesliga w/ Kaiserslautern in 1998 so that makes 3 Bundesliga, 3 German cups, 1 UEFA cup :D he coached Werder Bremen for almost 15 years :blink: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plato-ny Posted December 20, 2005 Author Share Posted December 20, 2005 Dont forget that he lead Bayern to the '96 Uefa Cup final before bring fired by Voeller because of a fear of mutiny on the team directed against Rehhagel because of a dislike for him. Voeller coached the game and won... BTW, Bremen won the cup winners cup in 1992, not the uefa cup... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aekrossoponti Posted December 20, 2005 Share Posted December 20, 2005 otto is very arrogant insisting on players to play to his system and not adjusting to the strength of the individual players. if otto managed a club team, he can do as he wishes. otto manages a national team, and there is no room for stubborness. the facts prove: greece finished 4th and scored only 1 more goal than georgia. i'm surprised he hasn't used fyssas as a right midfielder just to prove what a visionary manager that he thinks he is.a very good point. stelios is wasted by otto. based on some of your previou comments, i also start to question karagounis role. although i like the player very much, he seldom was the offensive option we desperately needed in the qualifying campaign.i could start to rant about ottos mistakes in the qualifying. i believe they partly cost us playing in germany. the other problem was that otto lost key players: injured dellas who played only one qualifying match that mattered. nikolaidis who hasnt played many games in the past due to injury but could always spark some offensive action. tsiartas whose brilliance oftnetimes saved greece. what i use against rehagel is that given dellas absence he couldnt provide a solid defence at any point in the qualifying.so is rehagel a great coach or was dellas just incredible. were was rehagels coaching when zagorakis and basinas didn t play superior ball? rehagel coaching cost us in albania, against the danes, against the ukraine, etc... the way he wasted the conf.cup as a time to experiment was criminal...anyway. better luck in the future. given the groups outcome we should have easily made it to germany if we played at our normal form. @plat-ny. it was beckenbauer and not voeller. voeller loves rehagel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aekrossoponti Posted December 22, 2005 Share Posted December 22, 2005 i am very unsure about the role karagounis is supposed to play in the team. you are right with what you say about karagounis although maybe a bit harsh. he shouldn t be the scapegoat for greece performance. he had some good moments and in the end it was otto who put him on the field... my problem is i dont see karagounis as a playmaker. lets be fair he does have a good shot but he seldom plays a great opening pass nor produces creative play. doesn t he remind you of gattusso? to me karagounis is a technically-gifted worker who perhaps would be more valuable as a defensive minded midfielder. problem is, we have zagorakis, basinas, katsouranis for that position already. having said that greece have exactly one offensive midfielder and thats stelios. thats not enough... the big problem with the ethniki is we seldom play football. we work football, try to keep clean sheets as opposed to scoring. this is understandable but i think we are limiting us too much. the defense without dellas was never solid. ottos solution katsouranis cannot defend in the penalty area because he is no central defender. when put under pressure in the box he easily makes costly mistakes. lets forget about ottos basinas as libero fiasco that was probably the worst idea he ever had. i dont know if otto is the right coach to build a team that will be able to PLAY football. this will be very hard but is a necessary step. i agree with you on the denmark game, seldom has greece done so little in a make or break game. in the past we may have lost as well but we did have a technical superiorityat times giving away great chances. this time we didn t even have any. the whole qualifying was a big disaster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Korisos Posted December 22, 2005 Share Posted December 22, 2005 i wouldn't say the whole qualifying campaign was a disaster but just the outcome. it wasn't looking pretty after 2-1 loss to Albania and we had to wait until kazahkstan for our first win but it was going okay. I'll admit beating Denmark 2-1 at home was lucky (zago surprise free kick deflecting off a defender and the foul on stelios in the box, was it really?) but the campaign was going fine until the loss to Ukraine. after that game the wheels came off. a draw in that game would have been fine the way it was going until Kapsis got injured. otto has a healthy Kyrgiakos on the bench who's also a CB but instead what does he do? he decides to sub Kapsis for Vyntra who will now play on the right and Giourkas will move into the middle to replace Kapsis. this was a disaster waiting to happen, a few minutes later Basinas missed a tackle and Giourkas got caught in the middle of nowhere, breakaway for Ukraine and we lose 1-0 and hopeless going into the confed cup. i'm still puzzled as to why otto didn't simply make a direct CB substitution. and Turkey beat Ukraine, big deal, by then our ship was already sunk. Basinas as sweeper vs. Turkey i'll never understand, otto could have called up Kyrgiakos much sooner and even Tavlaridis instead of using a midfielder as a defender and that would have kept Katsou in the midfield for the whole campaign. i understand otto wants to remain loyal but it led to tactics that didn't make any sense and eventually cost us our ticket to Germany, nevermind players that were injured/suspended, otto didn't use the right players in the right positions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aekrossoponti Posted December 27, 2005 Share Posted December 27, 2005 karagounis' play was so terrible during the qualifiers, it seems you refuse to believe he was that bad and instead, maybe you think he had a different role, since karagouni was invisible offensively...so, you won't have to criticize karagouni.i thought that maybe karagounis was used in a wrong position. i understand what you say but to me karagouis is no and never will be a dekari or a playmaker. if our offensive ideas rely on karagounis, no wonder we never score. we have one good offensive midfielder and thats stelios. no one else. in the euro qualifying rehagel had tsiartas, lakis at his disposal. players who have not been in line to perform after the euro.i see what you say and agree to it fully. it has always striked me that olympiakos as the dominant team has not contributed at all to the euro team.even in a wider sense, we were lucky dabizas was injured otherwise i doubt we would have progressed. stelios is the only olympiakos affiliated player that contributed 2004.and in the euro he wasn t that big a factor. what makes me worry is our total lack of offensive power. yes stelios is a good player but he is the only one and 31. masmanidis may be an option but hasn t seen big time football. on the other hand, germans second league is better than greek first league. so otto should give him a shot. lagos, well can be great, but ... charisteas has a wicked header, else hes not great. he was the number 4 in bremen and rightfully so. vryzas can play but scores once a year. lympe is o.k, mantzios shows some promise. but all of them are lame as hell. we cant scare any team in the world with these strikers. pap and salp are faster players, but do they have international level?lets not talk about gekas, amantidis is not even the best striker frankfurt has. leaves only samaras who shows great potential. who will score the goals we need to qualify for the euro? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aekrossoponti Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 i am not a big fan of charisteas being a lock selection. yes, charisteas played a great euro. yes he scored against the ukraine in the last minute of the euro 04 qualifiers. but he was rightfully the number 4 on the werder squad. he can do little to nothing with his foot, he doesn t "play". i think if we use charisteas we need crosses. who can deliver a decent cross let alone a decent corner? basinas and then....giourkas had two good crosses in all the qualifying. if we don t get decent crosses in, i believe playing with charisteas is like playing with 10 players. because oftentimes he doesn t show at all. i agree that vryzas is vastly underrated and sadly so. he can "play" football, he can hold the ball, he can defend and gives 100% every game. his time is up though. i am very much in favor of the target man/speed skill combo. i believe greece best striking duo in the rehagel era was nikolaidis and vryzas (sometimes charisteas). the vryzas/charisteas combination was born out of need because nikolaidis went to the euro injured. in the euro qualifying whenever otto could, he started nikolaidis and vryzas... in the euro qualifier away to spain otto removed charisteas after 15 minutes and brought in lakis. i miss this courage on rehagels behalf. why stick to charisteas no matter what. he is not the paiktara he seems judging from his euro goals. in the world cup qualifying otto sticked with the charisteas/vryzas combination. but this was not portugal as the albanian fans rightly proclaimed. in the euro04 greece was the totla underdog we didnt need to play. we needed to defend. whatever happened in front was great but the team was defense minded. playing with roughly the same team we used against the almighty czech republic in albania shows thzat otto went mad in our qualifiers. he didnt even have stelios in the starting eleven. when i heard that endekadfa i really went mad. not even talking about dabizas.... we either need another fast/skillfull forward or we need players who can produce offensive action. charisteas can not... masmanidis may be a valuable option. forget gekas but pap and salp may be options. i agree they are not the greatest players but do we have better? samaras would be a great idea as opposed to charisteas because he can play football. same goes for mantzios and even lymbe.dont get me wrong charisteas can be great but if we dont have crosse we dont need charisteas. i we decide to stick with charisteas and see no other forward up to par i hope we play like this. ............................charisteas(samaras).................. masmanidis(lagos).....................stelios ...................karagounis(kafes)...... ..........basinas...katsouranis....... fyssas....dellas(tavla)...kiriakos...giourkas ........nikopolidis........ else we can play like this... .............pap(salp).....charisteas(samaras,mantzios).. masmanidis(lagos)..........stelios ..........basinas...katsouranis....... fyssas....dellas(tavla)...kiriakos...giourkas ........nikopolidis........ i agree that maybe lambriakos should have been tested. but i can only speak about ottos criminal misuse of the conf. cup. kafes didnt play a minute although zagorakis was in serie a league action and karagounis injured. no striker was tested although vryzas had a broken arm... i just hope we dont end up playing the flintstones football i love to hate. it is one thing trying not to lose against the czech republic offense powerhouse. it is another trying to win games against lesser rated teams. sadly otto didnt get the difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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