Time for Reflection...

[adonis]

Guys, I live in Melbourne, am 21 yrs old and have been following PAO since i was a lil kid and my dad told me to do so! Im new to this forum this season, have expressed my opinion here and there however lately i have been sitting back and reding everyone elses criticism. I aint gonna sit here and rebut or agree with everyone bc mostly everyones criticism is justified.

On Saturday night, like most of us, I watched the game, PAO - Halkidona. However, before the PAO game started I was watching Man Utd Portsmouth live, and was so impressed the way Man Utd could pass and move off the ball and just kill their opponents off by attractive possesion like that. And they didnt even break into a sweat. We are no man utd!

I turned the channel to ERT and watched PAO. I was disgusted. I went from one soccer extreme to another. I rarely saw players moving off the ball, passing fluidly and we were so predictable. All we did was go from one wing, cross, to the other wing, cross. Mind you Halkidona had two great opportunities in the first half to score. I was so disgusted i turned off the tv at half time and went to bed.

Gents, we havent won a title in 7 yrs and that hurts. Lets be honest, we had a great coach, the General if you will, Markarian, a great team last season and we choked. Honestly, we wont win the title this season again.

However, I admire the predictability in all PAO fans to come out and criticise and call for the coachs head and Vardinoyiannis not even half way through the season. I agree, Shoum should go. It took him this long to bench Zoutautas, imagine how long it will take him to realise Maric and Munch arent no better either. Tactically he confuses me. How can u play against a German side in Germany playing 3-5-2, sorry 3-6-1!!!!!!!!!

Fair enough if we had decent midfielders we could flood their midfield, but we dont, and we get caught out at the back were we had two first 11 centre backs out missing the game against Stuttgart. And he aint no motivator...his realised how deep the problem runs.

As for Vardinogiannis, maybe we criticise him a little to hastily. Honestly we all know hes not prepared to sell the PAE. He has made mistakes, yes, but hes got a chance now to fix this. Starting with Zaets. Zaets is perhaps the root of all evil at PAO before Vardinogiannis. He gave us Maric, he wanted Giovanni Rosso, he gave us Saric, i give him half credit on Vlaovic.

What I would like to see is stability and consistency. Bring in a fresh coach, preferrably greek! Lets get a young team out on the field. We have one of the best youth academies in Europe. Lets use it, Vardinogiannis, if you dont wanna spend money, you have young, GREEK, talent at your doorstep...and ill tell you something, those young kids will wear the green top with more pride than fukn Munch and his buddies. Lets get some cohesion about the team; a coach who has an idea and is willing to stay long term - please our next coach if he is good and does dorp points here and there lets not call for his head - we need some consistency. Like for example, imagine we had Markarian from pre season, building a team the way he wants.

And yes, we have bought badly this summer, but Vardinogiannis doesnt get credit sometimes. He has fukt up now but his record shows he has come through more often than not. I bet you all that when he bought Luberopoulos no one was expecting him to become the player he is now. Or kuriagkos.

Gents, it kills me as well, i share everyones pain, we all have one common goal and thats a title and a good run in europe, but were just gonna have to be patient. Changes need to happen but with the state we are in they cant be drastic - they require alot of thought and planning - the quick fix isnt always the best for the long term and what we need is a long term solution because forget this season. I honestly will be happy with a new coach and one good player, at a nice good age (no more 30 yr old has beens plz) by January.

Thank - you all if u have the time to read what i wrote!

PS - My prediction for PAO - Stuttgart - 1-1 - and i hope to god konstantinou scores to silence his critics and get himself some confidence bc he is lethal when on form - we all know that!

[jcl_jcl2002]

Adoni, mou, Theos na se filai. That was one of the best posts on this board. You said it rationally, calmly, clearly and correctly. :tup:

[athinaios]

File, I live on the other side, the US, but I'm a PAO fan to the bone, and it hurts me to see our team in this horrible shape. However, we must be critical and face reality, and, yes, boycot like PAO fans have done in the past. My father used to tell me that if there was crapy play fans stayed away, and would not eat "koutohorto" or follow like sheep ...like Gavroi. It was when OLY was playing "giourousi" system.

OK, Vardinogiannis is not about to sell the team, but I ask you: who pulls the strings in PAO. He does. So, you want to be the king, accept the blame too.

We suck, and if he doesn't see that, then he's senile, an old idiot who doesn't know when to leave.

With the team we've got this year, I'm realistic, we can only try for a good show in the Greek league. Unfortunately, the way the internal climate is, the way we play, the stupid coach (who I don't think he sees what the rest of us do), etc. we are NOT making ANY progress. Are we?????

I hope for a loss by Stuttgard (since I don't hope for anything in Europe this year), so MAYBE this loss will put things in motion. I hope so.

Finally, I'd like to ask you? How/why did you become a PAO fan?

Being without a title for so many years, I have to remind you friends, we are losing thousands (perhaps a generation) of young fans. Think about it. Success brings in more fans. Memory will only serve so long, and only for the older of us who have experienced the "good old days". We need fresh success, not only for us (We won't change our love for PAO) but for the younger generations.

[Yaniotis1]

I think that more fans can be made from european success than winning the greek league. PAO came really close to winning the uefa cup last year. We should have kept all our players and added a better playmaker. If we would have done that, we would do unbelievable in the champions league his year. I am so sad that Markarian left after all the european success he has helped us achieve because of some morons who felt they needed to attack the players ad coach durring the practice a few days after the PAO- Oly game. So not only do i blame Vardinogianni for not signing our stars but i blame the fans also for Markarian's departure. He was one of the greatest coaches we have ever had. What i do see from what pao is doing is rebuilding. Which is completely rediculous. The big comotion was for imediate success, and then in the meantime we don't sign our veteran stars and sign young guys like papadopoulos and sanmartean who will become great players in the future. By taking these steps not only have we ruined our european progression but we don't even stand a chance of winning the greek league. This is a very frustrating year and i think its gonna take a few years to get out of this mess the ownership and fans have created. Not only do i blame the morons who attacked markarian and the players but i blame the fans in general who decided to take our european success for granted and cause trouble because we haven't been winning the greek league. That was a huge mistake, i do not understand how fans can enjoy winning the greek league as opposed to beating teams like Barcelona, Arsenal, Juventus and most likely in a few years winning a european trophy. Maybe i think this way because i do not live in greece and the league isn't as important to me. I don't know but thats how i feel.

[vasilis13]

As for Vardinogiannis, maybe we criticise him a little to hastily. Honestly we all know hes not prepared to sell the PAE. He has made mistakes, yes, but hes got a chance now to fix this. Starting with Zaets. Zaets is perhaps the root of all evil at PAO before Vardinogiannis. He gave us Maric, he wanted Giovanni Rosso, he gave us Saric, i give him half credit on Vlaovic.

i strongly disagree here mate,

Zaets went for player-hunting with a budget set by Vardinogiannis (he said that on the radio). However, he didnt object to that,but perhaps he agreed!

i think on the other hand we havent critised Vardinogiannis enough.. :ph34r:

WHy?

look after 96 what has happen

cheers

[drakos13]

Starting with Zaets. Zaets is perhaps the root of all evil at PAO before Vardinogiannis. He gave us Maric

Maric is horrible. that was not a good thing at all.

[adonis]

[Finally, I'd like to ask you? How/why did you become a PAO fan?]

athinaios

i knew when i posted this topic i would have ppl disagreeing with me. ill be honest with you, im not here to disagree with you or others...i agree with everything, starting from the coach, to zaets, to vardinogiannis...im just taking in everything more light headed...

ppl are right....vardinogiannis doesnt wanna spend for us...but he also hasnt spent big in the past.... but i believe he has an opportunity to see the consequences of this bc its staring blaringly in his face... but whats spending big gonna do...

everyone, and i mean EVERYONE, keeps on saying vardinogiannis should go or if he stays spends...ok so he stays and spends, with the state he has put us in this season, lets say he does throw money on the table...who will he attract...the players we need at the moment will be lured to bigger clubs bc of money and more simply bc of reputation...why cant he just than look at his own backyard and pick home grown talent....look at our under 21 team at national level...theyve been great over the past few yrs....we have gittas...i havent seen him play, in fact i havent even read his name anywhere since he signed...and we were out muscled by olympiakos for another young defender, plz excuse i forgot his name, this summer, and for stoltidis...wat kind of bargaining power is that...and this was before he went on a "spending spree" and bought the players that unfortunately wear the PAO top

but plz, give him credit for papadopoulos at least...he is a player to come for next few seasons....and you want european success like wat we have been experiencing. well except for now, vardinogiannis hasnt failed you there.

so lets not over criticise, yes he is at fault, but lets cut the crap and say he has never done anything at pao

as for your qn...i became a PAO fan before i could learn to play soccer....and it was bc of my father and cousins...and since than i bleed for the team...understand me file, it hurts, it kills me to see olympiakos win 7 or 8 wateva it is at the mom in a row...and i get up early in the mornings whenevr i can and watch them play whenever its on tv and im always trying to inform myself daily of any new coming out of the PAO camp...im as loyal and as passionate as eevryone else is on this forum and i dun regret being a PAO fan not one bit...

[jcl_jcl2002]

I definetely agree that we should bring in the homegrown talent. Stoltidis is a good player and we could've used him. I'm not too familiar with the players outside of the big 3 so do you know what other Greek could be bring in that would be cheap? I think we should've held onto Pittsas as well. He wasn't too bad and wore the jersey with more pride than the kraut. It's a matter of pride, and Shum don't got it. Maric don't got it. Epalle, Zutautas, kraut and even Morris a bit don't got it. We need to bring back the passion that comes from our team's history and success over the years. It was there last year, and getting rid of the good kids like Karagouni and Liberopoulo hurts that drastically. The leader on the field for Pana is a player who should exemplify all that the team is. I don't see it on this roster. Basinas is the closest to it but he's not that leader that we wanted.