xe912 Posted October 5, 2003 Share Posted October 5, 2003 Ok, 3 goals... and all of them created by Govani... 1 he scored by himself... amazing one! Other two, great assists to his team mates!!! who wants more video of UEFA games this year, where u can see him as a playmaker, email me... i will give u.... nr1. http://www.mhaifa.co.il/Multimedia/Video/L...-04-Hbs-1-1.Zip nr2. http://www.mhaifa.co.il/Multimedia/Video/L...-04-Hbs-1-2.Zip nr3. http://www.mhaifa.co.il/Multimedia/Video/L...-04-Hbs-1-3.Zip Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pao123 Posted October 5, 2003 Share Posted October 5, 2003 these may be nice, but playing in israel is alot different then playing in greece...im not saying he isnt good, because he is, but the play is alot differnt... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
christaras13 Posted October 5, 2003 Share Posted October 5, 2003 not bad and thanks for showing us :) makes me thinks twice about signing him , besides pao does neeed a player of his capability and we could do with a few more signings 2/3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evergreen Posted October 6, 2003 Share Posted October 6, 2003 I agree, he is very creative and quick. I think he could help out Lucian with the play-making. :tup: from me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vasilis13 Posted October 6, 2003 Share Posted October 6, 2003 very impressive i believe he is coming to PAO around christmas.. Well no wonder why they sold Boateng so they can save a free space for a non-EU player... ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vasilis13 Posted October 6, 2003 Share Posted October 6, 2003 they should have bought him instead of Zoutaoutas! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xe912 Posted October 6, 2003 Author Share Posted October 6, 2003 they should have bought him instead of Zoutaoutas!if you think like this.. so you are showing your not understanding in football... between those two playeres there is no connection at all... one is a defensive midfielder... other is attacking winger.... so ok, you buy rosso instead of Zuta... so then tell me, who plays in defense? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elastonpappou 13 Posted October 6, 2003 Share Posted October 6, 2003 I dont know ehat you say but Zutautas is the route of ALL PAO problems... First of all, he plays exactly in the position of Basinas. This is why we see Basinas trying to play creative football while he is incapable of making a descend pass to the attack! Apart from that, Zutatutas has a negative effevt in the midfield, because he cannot control the ball, or pass it up front. As a result from all these we end up having Sanmartean playing very high towards the attackers, which means that he hardly gets the ball for play making.... The solution would be as such... Place Zutatutas on the bench (Besides he is not bad for substituting Basinas,) bring Sanmartean to the midfield (if needed get him close to the defenders in order for him to create a descent game) and put an extra midfielder (maybe Munch on the left side). Then you will have Konstadinou and Papadopoulos up front, pure attack. So you see my friend, apart from the fact that Zutautas is not worthy of playing to PAO, he also destroys the whole game and the way that PAO should have being playing... ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kilmanrok Posted October 6, 2003 Share Posted October 6, 2003 Guys, look. It's not like Zutautas is worthless. He is a very valuable player. However, I'm afraid that the problem is he does play in the exact same position as Basinas. What pappou is saying is that we didn't desperately need such a player because our captain has been filling the position more than succesfully for the past few years. We did however need a player like Rosso. Panathinaikos' problem has never been in the defence in the past few years, it's always been in creating. We have a major problem there and that's why needed a winger. On another note, have you guys realised that we're probably the only team in the world that would start out against Ionikos with two central defensive midfielders who have almost no creative abilities? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vasilis13 Posted October 6, 2003 Share Posted October 6, 2003 if you think like this.. so you are showing your not understanding in football... between those two playeres there is no connection at all... one is a defensive midfielder... other is attacking winger....Thank you for mentioning the different positions these guys play in, because i woudnt have known... :blink: so ok, you buy rosso instead of Zuta... so then tell me, who plays in defense? Since you are a fottball guru why dont you tell me, since when a defensive midfielder is a defender and should play defence? A "koftis" player is not a defender. Zoutaoutas was suppose to be Basinas replacement (or the opposite) or play as partners in midfield only in a few occations, since the PAO Management stated this summer that they want more "Offensive" football. i dont know if you have seen this but PAO isnt attacking from the side (which also didnt do very successfully last year as well) because the tream lacks CONFIDENT left and right midfielders. Konstadinidis is slowly showing his skills after a bad year, epale plays as a right midfielder, but is more efficient when his game more "centered". So you know what you will end up seeing in the midfield??? Sanmartean Basinas Zoutaoutas Maric (Michaelsen) or Maric Basinas Zoutaoutas Sanmartean (Michaelsen) So in the midfield you have 3(!!!!!) defencive midfielders. Isnt that defensive enough for you? so wherent we playing defensive in Manchester? So yes i believe that a player like Roso for example could help Panathianikos attack from the sides, i believe that our stikers will get more chances to score, since they are left alone up front, i believe tha a player like roso (or ant other decent player in that position) will help Panathinaikos pressure more the opponents up front, which leads to my answer that a player like roso would be more desirable than another defensive midfielder like Zoutaoutas (who -dont get me wrong- is an important player and addition to the team) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xe912 Posted October 6, 2003 Author Share Posted October 6, 2003 Look, i have to say, that i dont know Basinas from last year and etc... because i didn't mention last year PAO's games so much ... But what i think is, that you guys, accuse some players too much... Anyway.. you say that sanmarten plays very well! hmmm... in my point of view, i dont think so... i agree, that he is very talented and great player, but he plays one good game.. and then some games is realy bad by him.... or maybe the problem is exactly that PAO is not doing so well in creating attacks... Rosso wpuld inprove this... About zuta, i dont think that he is not good enough to play in PAO... cause he is doing his job quet well... ok, he is not creating the game so much... but that he can do very well... in maccabi he was one of the best... hiss passes were amazing by buting long ball in front of strikers... that thay have just to score... If the counter attack with long ball was not sucessful... so then rosso was taking the ball byhimself by the side... he has great crossing skill, that brings the ball to attacker, so he needs just to score... It was like this in maccabi... i dont say that the level of game is the same of those two teams... but i can guess... that those two players will inprove the game... so, every player has his own + and - ... so by taking eveyrthing in one thing, PAO is a strong team... just they need to start to play how they can do it... That should do a coach... to tell the truth... i didn't like Shum last year... and i dont like him now.. he is not such a great coach... but i hope, that when he has good players, he can make them play well and just not to make worng decisions by choosing formating and players.... Anyway, maybe stop blaming the players and start to think in oposite way... For now, PAO is in first place even with that kind of playing... so think what would be if they satrt to play better... There is sad thing, that there is nto enought time to wait.. because in CL we need to play good now.. we need points to get in next phase... So, good luck to PAO and i wish the game will improve... and the results too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pao123 Posted October 6, 2003 Share Posted October 6, 2003 i have to agree alittle more with vasilis...our wingers are the real problem....if we had two strong wing players then basnias would be sitting in the defensive midfield position (which he should be playing in because thats where he can help us the most) and zutautus should be stiitng oin the bench waiting to replace him....mb zutautus can play a good long ball, but basinas has proven himself in that postition already.....for anyone that saw the first porto match last year..zutautus couldnt do the job on deco that basinas did....that is plain and simple basinas' positiotn...zutautus, although a decent player, mb should not have been bought simply becuase we already have a solid player in that area....he can help us out, but when shoum tries to mix basinas and zuta in the same starting line, it does not work.... by the way, sanmartean does play well...he has had more than one good game and for a 21 year old, i think he is the only signing who has shown himself so far...mb he isnt the most consistant player as of yet, but he is stll young and has alot to learn.... i cant stress enough how BADLY our outisde wings are lacking....look at the outside midfielders.... epale-does absolutly nothing, is not a presence at all konstantinidis-he is improving from last year and is playing a bit better, but he isnt the most attacking player that will create us chances....he is a good substitiue... munch-why would we spend money on this guy, he has done nothing for us.. michaelsen-is getting old and still has alittle left in him but he is not the answer to our problems... maric-he isnt bad, but i just dont trust him very much when he is on the pitch...he too, is not our answer...... so by all this im gunna have to say that mb we should buy rosso because we need a outside midlfielder that can DO SOMETHING.....as for zutautus...it was not a bad signing but he should not be on the starting 11 if basinas is.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vasilis13 Posted October 6, 2003 Share Posted October 6, 2003 by the way, sanmartean does play well...he has had more than one good game and for a 21 year old, i think he is the only signing who has shown himself so far...mb he isnt the most consistant player as of yet, but he is stll young and has alot to learn.... Yes Sanmartean is not very consistent yet, and he is sensitive to injury.He came from a Romanian pub Side( :P ) and all of a sudden he makes the covers pages of Greek sports newspapers!!!! But in my humble opinion Sanmartean shouldnt had been the main AMC transfer to PAO (which still was a great transfer!), but he should have come to PAO as the main substitute of a more experienced AMC. He is young, inexperienced and needs to build more tactic skills and be smarter! However the case is that he is our main AMC at the moment and we need to give him time. Zoutaoutas, Maric, Epale, Moris need time as well to tie with the old teammates and to bring out their true skill. With the addition of Roso i thnk we will have a quite strong side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcl_jcl2002 Posted October 6, 2003 Share Posted October 6, 2003 You know what bugs me? I created the Giovanni Rosso coming in January topic a few days back. I said that he'd be better than Maric. You guys start talking trash that we don't need another evreo here etc. Then you see him set up 2 and score 1 this week and you're suddenly on his bandwagon. We can be such hypocrites sometimes... :hypocrite: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vasilis13 Posted October 6, 2003 Share Posted October 6, 2003 You know what bugs me? I created the Giovanni Rosso coming in January topic a few days back. I said that he'd be better than Maric. You guys start talking trash that we don't need another evreo here etc. Then you see him set up 2 and score 1 this week and you're suddenly on his bandwagon. We can be such hypocrites sometimes... :hypocrite: Well what made you want him for our team? :rolleyes: B) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Posted October 6, 2003 Share Posted October 6, 2003 Having seem samtarean so far I do not think he is the right player to control the midfiled. Although he is a very skillfull player, I don't think he has capability to take control. When he got substituted on the weekend by Moris, he immediately made impact by setting up papadopoulos goal. Moris looks like a dynamic player who likes to run at players. While you see samaterean he runs across the field than taking on the defence. And some of his passing and crosses over the weekend seemed very poor. When he is put under pressure, he fails to produce his best. One of the best moves over the weekend was basinas thru ball to kostantinou that split the defence and nearly create a goal. And we know that basinas is a defensive midfield player. So I think pao answer is not samaterean. The boy needs time to show maturity at pao but the question is we need a playmaker now to help our team and not 1 -2 years down the track. A playmaker should be consistant thru out the game and not show one or two good touches in a match. Thats what he did against Ionikos and really do you consider ionikos a quality european team? Show if vardithoganides are serious with Pao they need to take out the cheque book and look for another player. The way things are going this team needs a year before they can show some quality. They might win the greek league this season, however they cannot compete in europe this year. If we had the same team of last year, things would have been much better for us. We lost a good coach and lost quality players like karagounis,lyberopulos and kolka to players like zatoutaos,samaterean,moric etc... Paos problem last year was a quality playmaker that makarian had requested that was rejected by dioktisi at the time. If this had happen we would have a team that would be serious contenders in champions league. If you think about last years run in uefa, we should have reached the final! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kilmanrok Posted October 7, 2003 Share Posted October 7, 2003 Dear Santa, I know it's way too early in the season, but still, I can't hold myself. Santa, please, I beg of thee, we need a playmaker. Why must we suffer in the sight of a barren team weak in weak out? Have I asked for much? No, I dare say I haven't. All I want for Christmas is a freakin' playmaker. All I want for Christmas is Richard Nunez. Your humble and loyal servant, an anonymous PAO fan. PS : You will have noticed by now that since this is a letter to Santa I could have asked for Saviola, I could have asked for Tsiartas and I could have asked for a dozen other stars. But did I do such a thing? No, because I respect your work Santa. So, please, Nunez's side is crap, please deliver him into our hands. Let him play in the proud corn fields of Ionikos and Kallithea, and by all means, do allow him to do what he's good at. Feeding the ball, creating, scoring and doing basically what every good midfielder does. Pleeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adonis Posted October 7, 2003 Share Posted October 7, 2003 Lets not dwell on the past. The only connection this season PAO's team has with last seasons is the fact that we still need a playmaker. So we had a good run in UEFA, lets not get carried away now. The fact of the matter is yes we did lose some quality and key players. And yes we lost our "General" Markarian, and I know Shum is no Markarian, but lets not rush in and point out targets for the next transfer window. Remember that it is in the 1st of Jan that this window opens and by then only God knows what will have happened. A huge problem PAO has and proved over the years is rushing in at January to buy a quick fix. We bought Xenofon Gittas last season and I still havent heard of him since. And the sad thing is it will happen again this January bc lets face it, the huge summer signing spree, if we can call it that, indicates that Vardinogiannis still thinks he can pull off these shady signings and have a team worthy enough to wear the PAO jersey. I believe the team will turn around sooner or later but it can only happen if Shum goes. Zuta plays bc of Shum, thats why his at PAO in the first place. And sadly we prolly will buy Roso if shum is still around and although maybe we do need a winger or someone to help Sanmartean, mind you i still cant believe some ppl have criticised this kid bc hes doin well considering his inexperience and age, another Macabi player isnt the solution. Theres a wealth of talent out there even in Greece, and young talent as well. Lets hope they do their research properly and scouting to find the wats right for us. I dont speak for everyone here but personally at this stage, if we make UEFA, bc lets face it we wont progress, that should be deemed as a success at this stage, but also something that is realistic. As for our playmaker dilemma, PAO has always had this problem. Our last AMC who carried the team on their shoulders was perhaps Borelli. And the problem isnt just Zuta or Shum, its the whole team right from the players to the coach to the Big Shot Vardinogiannis who has been stooging us for quite some time. PS - I have a qn as well - I havent seen much or know a great deal about Munch - who is he where does he play how has he faired to date????????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcl_jcl2002 Posted October 7, 2003 Share Posted October 7, 2003 Well what made you want him for our team? :rolleyes: B) Simple answer: SILVIO MARIC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :tdown: :angry: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xe912 Posted October 7, 2003 Author Share Posted October 7, 2003 Ok, with some of your thought i agreed, with some i dont.... I dont understand what u want from tose players?! to play in a first day the best football ever? first, middfield is new... second.. .many injures... dotn you think that any team without 5 players wouldnt be the same... i dotn say that PAO would play amazing with everybody on the pitch, but still.... Anyway, it's better to get 3 points... and play like this, than lose and play amazing... with just good playing you wont take championship... for now we have luck, later we will have good game.... i think so... Let's wait a bit.... anyway, found one more nice video... i still think, that this player would refresh our playing by sides.... http://www.ivartis.lt/eimio/03-04-Pub-1-2.zip Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcl_jcl2002 Posted October 8, 2003 Share Posted October 8, 2003 I'm not really sure what you disagree upon... Rosso is obviously better than Maric. He's never reached his potential anywhere and was a waste of the little cash we spent. Rosso is a much better investment. He's not Kolkka but I'd take him over his useless Croat compatriot. I obviously do think that our midfield will get it together at some point. Sanmartean is still very very young for the job we've put him. You can't expect a young inexperienced Romanian to take over an established Greek international like Karagounis without some difficulty. I think that people don't mind our midfield because we're not blowing everybody out as much as the fact that we haven't improved since letting Karagounis go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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