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slick13

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the comparison is fair....

so ur saying ud become a turk being that u where a greek all ur life???

then i pitty u follow the same team as me!! :angry:

no, it's not fair.

money is not involved in ur example. and please do not add an amount to ur example.

Why didn't Vardi make an offer to Michalis

and WHY HE NEVER ANSWERED THIS QUESTION

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What dont u understand about my comparison nicos??

Mixali was GREEN even before he was in his fathers ball sacks.. its in his blood!! The fans treated him like a God.. and he moves to the team that he probably himself hated. I can sit here and give u 1001 comparisons to why the PAO fans will hate him... for once... i dont believe this was Tzigers fault...

Mixali had apparently already agreed to terms with the gaurous even before PAO sat down with him to even think about giving him a new contract... if u knew this and u where tziger what would u do??

kai kala ekane kai ton afise na figei... tetious panathinaikous den theloume!!!

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What dont u understand about my comparison nicos??

Mixali was GREEN even before he was in his fathers ball sacks.. its in his blood!! The fans treated him like a God.. and he moves to the team that he probably himself hated. I can sit here and give u 1001 comparisons to why the PAO fans will hate him... for once... i dont believe this was Tzigers fault...

Mixali had apparently already agreed to terms with the gaurous even before PAO sat down with him to even think about giving him a new contract... if u knew this and u where tziger what would u do??

kai kala ekane kai ton afise na figei... tetious panathinaikous den theloume!!!

i am sure Michalis never agreed with oly before he even talked to Vardi. First of all he was expecting for the deal from abroad and second he preferred PAO tha Oly. Answer this please? Why didn't Tzigger answer why he let Michalis go?
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If u read up on these things... he said... "If we wanted him we would have kept him" " Aloi einai h logoi pou ton afisame na figei"

It will come out 1 day exactly what happened... and u will see he was a traitor!!

So Antonis was a traitor, Lymbe was a traitor, Basinas is a traitor, Karagkounis is a traitor, Giourkas is a traitor, Gkoumas is a traitor....

And thats just recent years...

He is being doing this thing for years!!! Why don't u see it. He is investing on young players, to sell them later... Count our championships since he is in charge. BUT WAIT!!! He got Biscan! Yes, that oughta shut ur mouth for a couple of years ...

and then again!

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What do u guys smoke up in Germany I didnt the Jamaaican Gum was that commen there@@@@

man whos smoking? Mixalkhs was a good player but not that amazing....he didnt become a prolific goalscorer like he was supposed to be till last year and that first year in the CL only....his second year he was pathetic the next year he just couldnt score consistently.....last year he was great.

and im not somking and jamaican anything, and im not in Germany im in america but live in switzerland.

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hmmmm.... this looks to me to be exactly what kokkalis wanted to happen. the green fans being all upset with konstantinous move to osfp. unfortunately this is what happens in greece after a move like that. to be honest, i think i would react the same way if, lets say castillo would make a similar move (dont rip me apart, it was just an example).

konstantinou was loved by the vazelous. thats for sure. he was their idol. but like drakos said: he is not the best player in greece. he is a striker who knows how to do his job in front of the goal. not more, not less.

but since his move, things have heated up a lot again and i would say that the situation in greece is not much different and this will be seen in the first match. i expect both teams to get a huge fine after the match in oaka. maybe this was even kokkalis plan. get the vazeloi upset so that they overreact at the derby and they will get some matchbans right from the start.

maybe think about that. i know most people in here are against such happenings.

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What dont u understand about my comparison nicos??

Mixali was GREEN even before he was in his fathers ball sacks.. its in his blood!! The fans treated him like a God.. and he moves to the team that he probably himself hated. I can sit here and give u 1001 comparisons to why the PAO fans will hate him... for once... i dont believe this was Tzigers fault...

Mixali had apparently already agreed to terms with the gaurous even before PAO sat down with him to even think about giving him a new contract... if u knew this and u where tziger what would u do??

kai kala ekane kai ton afise na figei... tetious panathinaikous den theloume!!!

This has to be the biggest bullshit post i have ever read!!! (sorry TRIFILARA but its true)

First of all stop with the Sentimental bullshit that kostantinou was green way b4 he was born ("he was green when he was in his dads bull sacks") lol :LOL:

This is jst plane bullshit and if u belive that then ur Delusional and u live in ur own wacky world.. (Pao = Good, Oly = Bad :not: )

So because of ur Analyses, does that make me a oly fan?? i mean my father is an oly supporter and im preety sure his father was one to??? :LOL:

Anyways had to clear that bullshit statement about the whole "green blood" ect.... :whistle:

Now to the next peace of s%$#! statement u made....

Mixali had apparently already agreed to terms with the gaurous even before PAO sat down with him to even think about giving him a new contract... if u knew this and u where tziger what would u do??

This is exactly the same piece of crap Management said about Adoni!!!! GIVE ME A BREAK how much crap can u honestly swallow here and keep a straight face!!! I seariously cant belive u actually belive this!!! people can look at this and say yeh its kostantinous fault because he had signed the contract however no one thinks hang on, why is it his fault when Pao didnt even try n offer him a new contract when they realised not many teams were intrested in him from abroad????

They had planned this my friend, no to re-sighn him and when they decided this then they decided his fate and he owed nothing to no one esepically pao management and could do what ever he wanted!!!

Since he got no good deals from clubs, then it was only natural that he went to the geys!!! by the way we live in the real world not the 1600 where loyalty counts, espically when theres money involved!! so i for one dnt blame him for going to the geys... im upset that he didnt hold out abit longer (perhaps a foreigh team would come along) however i dnt pin point the blame on him!! i say its 70/30 managements fault, i do recognise that its abit his fault for chooseing the geys however the majority was managements fault when they decided 6 months b4 his contract was up that his fate was sealed.... :tdown:

So thats two down (adoni, Kostantinou) :tdown: i wonder whos next to go?? Pap Gonzalez??? perhaps Goumas??? which way u look at it, theres a nice healthy pattern emerging here, question is, will you see it or will you continue to look at it with ur "green glasses" on???

P.S im not attacking u personaly, so dnt come out all angry and s%$#!, and take a cheap shot like for example "maybe u r a gey fan in heart since ur so anti management why dnt u go there" because that in its self is childish and you know it..... Im pao to the bone, only difference is that im not manipulated by our awfull mangement... so please dnt chuck a Bidis :nono: and go all childish and talk s%$#! because u cant counter my arguments.... if u cant then leave it (however i think u can so this will leave a nice little debate :) )

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one xample of the sentimental bullshit u think doesnt exist in todays world and greek soccer or world of soccer.....look at kostas katsouranis! i wish i had a captain like that at my club...

as for mihalis...pao never sat down with him bc firstly he wanted to go overseas, so pao didnt get in the way with that, and than when he wasnt getting the offers he wanted osfp stepped in with their offer before he sat down with pao...

even then, konstantinou was getting approx 1 mill a year from us ( even more), he was an expensive transfer when we did get him, so with the return on goals he was getting if pao was to re sign him it would have been for less than that...that was obvious, and now his getting 1.2 mill a year only bc his not mihalis konstantinou and his a top striker, only bc he used to play for us, and that he used to his advantage to get the offer he did to sign,

as for management, yes they could of offered him a similar contract and they could of kept him, but deep down do u really want players that come to pao for the cash, lets face it we already have a few especially with flavio and biscan, but if management is so incredibly hyped up in screwing players over why didnt they do it with goumas, why did they resign morris, even henriksen got a contract renewal, papadopoulos got a contract renewal, vazeha played on till he retired at pao

zaets who was a superstar in the early 80's was even given such a huge role just a few years ago at pao and respected by tzigger (whether he did his job well or not is a different story),

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one xample of the sentimental bullshit u think doesnt exist in todays world and greek soccer or world of soccer.....look at kostas katsouranis! i wish i had a captain like that at my club...

as for mihalis...pao never sat down with him bc firstly he wanted to go overseas, so pao didnt get in the way with that, and than when he wasnt getting the offers he wanted osfp stepped in with their offer before he sat down with pao...

even then, konstantinou was getting approx 1 mill a year from us ( even more), he was an expensive transfer when we did get him, so with the return on goals he was getting if pao was to re sign him it would have been for less than that...that was obvious, and now his getting 1.2 mill a year only bc his not mihalis konstantinou and his a top striker, only bc he used to play for us, and that he used to his advantage to get the offer he did to sign,

as for management, yes they could of offered him a similar contract and they could of kept him, but deep down do u really want players that come to pao for the cash, lets face it we already have a few especially with flavio and biscan, but if management is so incredibly hyped up in screwing players over why didnt they do it with goumas, why did they resign morris, even henriksen got a contract renewal, papadopoulos got  a contract renewal, vazeha played on till he retired at pao

zaets who was a superstar in the early 80's was even given such a huge role just a few years ago at pao and respected by tzigger (whether he did his job well or not is a different story),

katsouranis, is 1/100!! and u cnt deny that...

u state that management is sooo good coz they offerd goumas a new contract, well let me ask u this since 2001-2002, he is the only player left from that squad to our current squad.... what does that tell you???? they managed to keep about 2 out of the 24 players we had ;)

if it was any other management we would atleast have 35% of those players still playing, if it was any other management we would big a huge club now because they wouldnt sell out there core players.... however u can b content with our current management and there dirty tricks because im not :tdown: nor will i ever be untill there gone :box: .....

so please dnt

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QUOTE (TRIFILARA @ Jul 16 2005, 03:50 PM)

What dont u understand about my comparison nicos??

Mixali was GREEN even before he was in his fathers ball sacks.. its in his blood!! The fans treated him like a God.. and he moves to the team that he probably himself hated. I can sit here and give u 1001 comparisons to why the PAO fans will hate him... for once... i dont believe this was Tzigers fault...

Mixali had apparently already agreed to terms with the gaurous even before PAO sat down with him to even think about giving him a new contract... if u knew this and u where tziger what would u do??

kai kala ekane kai ton afise na figei... tetious panathinaikous den theloume!!!

This has to be the biggest bullshit post i have ever read!!! (sorry TRIFILARA but its true)

First of all stop with the Sentimental bullshit that kostantinou was green way b4 he was born ("he was green when he was in his dads bull sacks") lol

This is jst plane bullshit and if u belive that then ur Delusional and u live in ur own wacky world.. (Pao = Good, Oly = Bad )

So because of ur Analyses, does that make me a oly fan?? i mean my father is an oly supporter and im preety sure his father was one to???

Anyways had to clear that bullshit statement about the whole "green blood" ect....

Now to the next peace of s%$#! statement u made....

QUOTE

Mixali had apparently already agreed to terms with the gaurous even before PAO sat down with him to even think about giving him a new contract... if u knew this and u where tziger what would u do??

This is exactly the same piece of crap Management said about Adoni!!!! GIVE ME A BREAK how much crap can u honestly swallow here and keep a straight face!!! I seariously cant belive u actually belive this!!! people can look at this and say yeh its kostantinous fault because he had signed the contract however no one thinks hang on, why is it his fault when Pao didnt even try n offer him a new contract when they realised not many teams were intrested in him from abroad????

They had planned this my friend, no to re-sighn him and when they decided this then they decided his fate and he owed nothing to no one esepically pao management and could do what ever he wanted!!!

Since he got no good deals from clubs, then it was only natural that he went to the geys!!! by the way we live in the real world not the 1600 where loyalty counts, espically when theres money involved!! so i for one dnt blame him for going to the geys... im upset that he didnt hold out abit longer (perhaps a foreigh team would come along) however i dnt pin point the blame on him!! i say its 70/30 managements fault, i do recognise that its abit his fault for chooseing the geys however the majority was managements fault when they decided 6 months b4 his contract was up that his fate was sealed....

So thats two down (adoni, Kostantinou) i wonder whos next to go?? Pap Gonzalez??? perhaps Goumas??? which way u look at it, theres a nice healthy pattern emerging here, question is, will you see it or will you continue to look at it with ur "green glasses" on???

P.S im not attacking u personaly, so dnt come out all angry and s%$#!, and take a cheap shot like for example "maybe u r a gey fan in heart since ur so anti management why dnt u go there" because that in its self is childish and you know it..... Im pao to the bone, only difference is that im not manipulated by our awfull mangement... so please dnt chuck a Bidis and go all childish and talk s%$#! because u cant counter my arguments.... if u cant then leave it (however i think u can so this will leave a nice little debate )

OK... 1st off... u cant expect to attack( yes attack... u say ur not attacking but when u sit there and say my statements are BULLSHIT... thats attacking) someone's opinion and then not expect him to retaliate... i see u do it alot in these forums... dude... this is my opinion... have the stuff that i read comming from u i think is total, yet i dont waste my time sitting here writting anything about it becoz it ends nowhere!!

now... when i said that he was green even before he was in this fathers ballsacks... i ment that he was a green all his life... i didnt base it on what his father was...

I for one, like u, i am not in favour of this managment and how they go about things.... but with this i agree with tziger 100%..

They had planned this my friend, no to re-sighn him and when they decided this then they decided his fate and he owed nothing to no one esepically pao management and could do what ever he wanted!!!

So ur saying he owed nothing to a club that invested so much money into him??? are u crazy??? Yes he could do wateva he wanted.... THATS WHY THEY SHOWED HIM THE DOOR!!!!!!! If he REALLY wanted to stay... money wouldnt have been an issue... look at all the signings so far... YES ITS OUT OF THE ORDINARY for tziger... a bigger staduim needs to be filled ... but the money isnt an issue...

Since he got no good deals from clubs, then it was only natural that he went to the geys!!! by the way we live in the real world not the 1600 where loyalty counts, espically when theres money involved!! so i for one dnt blame him for going to the geys... im upset that he didnt hold out abit longer (perhaps a foreigh team would come along) however i dnt pin point the blame on him!! i say its 70/30 managements fault, i do recognise that its abit his fault for chooseing the geys however the majority was managements fault when they decided 6 months b4 his contract was up that his fate was sealed.....

:LOL: SO... ARSENAL isnt good enough for him???? they where knocking at his door on numerous occasions... even his manager has come out and said it!!!

u named players like giourka... karagouni... etc etc..... i dont agree with how we let these type of players go... BUT...this isnt the same issue...

these players where SOLD... kostandinou wasnt for sale... he was free... he could have chosen to go ANYWHERE !!! :angry:

anyhow HOLLYWOOD... this is MY OPINION... if u dont like it... there is no need to call it bullshit... coz u just make urself look small. Im not the only vazelo who thinks this way... ive just come home from greece... i would say 80% of panathinaikos fans think this way... we could be right... we could be wrong... no1 knows... but even if im wrong... i still feel he should never have gone there!! :nono:

PS. just a small tip... in a FORUM u will find that opinions varey... dont think ur always right.. coz u do it alot!! if u dont agree with something... there is no need to attack the other person...

P.S im not attacking u personaly, so dnt come out all angry and s%$#!, and take a cheap shot

how u can say u dont attack me personally when u say im delusional and i live in a wacky world etc etc... anyhow i wont comment on that coz i dont think u understand what it means to attack someone.

Im not angry at all... infact u made me laugh with ur crap... but anyhow.. this is my opinion on this matter.. if it differs to yours... oh well thats life!!! B)

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ADONIS he doesnt understand our point of view... he believes what he thinks is right and thats it!!

astone... he will learn

btw i agree with what u said 100%

same thing could be said about you :huh:

dnt look down apon me as if ur better because thats jst as bad as an insault :ph34r:

Lets jst agree to disagree, however im preety sure its 50/50 on this situation i jst cant belive some of the things u said :blink:

anyways leave it at that....

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no mate... big difference...

i didnt attack ur opinion to begin with... u did mine!!

when i said "astone... he will learn" i ment about not thinking ur point of view is always right!!

take it easy champ gosh... if anything ur acting like that bides person now... and i dont think u wana go there...!!!

i dont dislike u... i just think u should ease up alittle... where all panathinaikoi in here!!!

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no mate... big difference...

i didnt attack ur opinion to begin with... u did mine!!

when i said "astone... he will learn" i ment about not thinking ur point of view is always right!!

take it easy champ gosh... if anything ur acting like that bides person now... and i dont think u wana go there...!!!

i dont dislike u... i just think u should ease up alittle... where all panathinaikoi in here!!!

What the hell?? :huh:

all i said was lets leave it at that, where on earth to u get the impression that im being aggresive?? all i said is dnt look down apon me because u dnt know who i am and what im like....

astone... he will learn

this can be interpretated as, "dnt worry his young and imature he will learn sooner or later" and i jst said dnt look down apon me, thats it....

take it easy champ gosh... if anything ur acting like that bides person now... and i dont think u wana go there...!!!

That was harsh, now whos insaulting who :P

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Hollywood to be honest there are some things i agree with you and and there are some things that i dont. Im not taking anything personal on you bc this just a forum and its a place were we can all express our opinions, thoughts and fact abiout a common topic, in this case PAO.

So firstly TRIFILARA its not about who understands who, its both sides of the case been explained and debated thats all.

Anyways, Hollywood im not saying the management is always right...btw from now on im just gonna say Tzigger instead of management bc thats who were really talking about...and like i said, for starters i agree with u and alot of other ppl that Tzigger does treat PAO as a business alot at times, but as a businessman its within his interest that he uses his investment to the best he can bc not only will PAO become a failure and we will get pissed off, but he loses money. And Tzigger has done very well for himself buying cheap, selling. Yes he has lost players for free, s%$#! happens, but the money he has earned from CL is big! and he knows the price of failure and to make a profit u need to spend as well...just like he spent mihalis

Mihalis is just another prawn in the game....a game between fans and clubs and president of the gays and us...kokalis got him to screw us over, we lost him for various reasons that are realistically known and unknown to us.

But players like him will come and go....But that if were gonna argue about Mihalis going to the gays, why dont we mention Kapsis - his old man used to play for us, why didnt we manage to get the son of a former great - Hollywood ur from Australia, so u know about footy, the father son rule - under that Kapsis would have been a pao player now

QUOTE (adonis @ Jul 16 2005, 09:06 PM)

one xample of the sentimental bullshit u think doesnt exist in todays world and greek soccer or world of soccer.....look at kostas katsouranis! i wish i had a captain like that at my club...

as for mihalis...pao never sat down with him bc firstly he wanted to go overseas, so pao didnt get in the way with that, and than when he wasnt getting the offers he wanted osfp stepped in with their offer before he sat down with pao...

even then, konstantinou was getting approx 1 mill a year from us ( even more), he was an expensive transfer when we did get him, so with the return on goals he was getting if pao was to re sign him it would have been for less than that...that was obvious, and now his getting 1.2 mill a year only bc his not mihalis konstantinou and his a top striker, only bc he used to play for us, and that he used to his advantage to get the offer he did to sign,

as for management, yes they could of offered him a similar contract and they could of kept him, but deep down do u really want players that come to pao for the cash, lets face it we already have a few especially with flavio and biscan, but if management is so incredibly hyped up in screwing players over why didnt they do it with goumas, why did they resign morris, even henriksen got a contract renewal, papadopoulos got  a contract renewal, vazeha played on till he retired at pao

zaets who was a superstar in the early 80's was even given such a huge role just a few years ago at pao and respected by tzigger (whether he did his job well or not is a different story), 

katsouranis, is 1/100!! and u cnt deny that...

u state that management is sooo good coz they offerd goumas a new contract, well let me ask u this since 2001-2002, he is the only player left from that squad to our current squad.... what does that tell you???? they managed to keep about 2 out of the 24 players we had 

if it was any other management we would atleast have 35% of those players still playing, if it was any other management we would big a huge club now because they wouldnt sell out there core players.... however u can b content with our current management and there dirty tricks because im not  nor will i ever be untill there gone  .....

so please dnt

yes katsouranis is a 1/100 case, fair enuff, does that mean Demis is as well...bc he became the president, save the club...hell ive even seen footage of him taking the train to a game with the fans this yr

As for how many players left from that team - you gotta remember the Rizopoulis game and how many players a coach left bc of it, the team had to and was dismantled - it hadnt won a trophy in 7 odd years, fair enuff goumas is still there, vazeha retired, henriksen just left, seitaridis was sold to the european champions just before euro, lybe left one way or another, and as ive said before Karagounis signed with Inter on a free transfer before the Rizopoulis game, Basinas back in 2001 was given a contract renewal, a big one at that, and it just expired now and it was time for him to go, mihalis and adonis are known cases, olisadebe is still here, fyssas went to benifica,kyriagkos is another case were we are not sure of, michaelsen stayed on till 34-35 am i correct, kolkka managened to try his luck in germany and in the english premier league

I think that pretty much sums up that team!

So Hollywood exactly wat arent u happy about the management - is the lack of titles bc i can understand that, but than again, why is it so many pao fans argue with osfp fans about all the titles they stole from us, i mean that title at rizopoulis was almost ours until wat happened, or is it the european poreias that we all enjoy seeing our team do, beating barca, juve, arsenal, psv, rangers, porto, etc etc. Bc if thats wat u like to see id have to say were a pretty succesful team!

Trust me, ive said it before - its not within Tziggers best interest to screw us over for no reason - the team is moving to a stadium with capacity of 70,000 and has to qualifyu to CL where he knwos if they do so they will earn quite a bit of cash. If he doesnt make us happy with the signings etc and he knows he has to replace the void of mihalis with quality - the team has slimmer chances of making a tournament he knows he can earn off, and the team will be playing in front of an empty OAKA and that wil be disastrous - and if i know that, im sure a business man like tzigger is aware of that!

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i think adoni has a point....

tzigger isnt deliberatly trying to screw us over- its not in his interest. With happy fans he makes happy profits.

Looking at the way things are now i think we are a better team than how we finished... i mean i think we could make some better signings and im still upset on missing out on Pappas and not getting Lagos and not even considering Baykara or Gkoundoulakis....but we cant get everyone....

Basinas was such a lump of crap for most of this year i am glad to see him go, and Conceicao has got the experience and talent to give the midfield long needed stability.

Maric was awful and we let him go. We got Tziolis who is way better Same with Konstantinidis who we replaced with Theodoridis.

Munch was begingig to decline and it was time to make a lasting investment in the left wing. Lets hope Seric is a great player. Munch wouldnt play the same role this year and hed be expensive to keep too...good luck to him and by the way Markus Munch would NEVER go to OSFP. THAT IS A PLAYER WITH HEART.

Darlas is back from loan to serve as a backup and train to provide depth for the left side. Good move

Leontiou is another emergency player who is good and ready to train with the first team.

Biscan is an experienced player for defense....Kirgiakos problem solved.

Kostolis left we got Siimitiras and Ebede....i kind of prefered Kotsolis...

Bikovski left and we got Mantzios...Mantzios is supposed to be something special so id like him as a 4th....

as for Konstantinou no he hasnt been replaced.....but if Franca accepts our offer or we get Prso i think we will be doing great, especially with Franca i think we will forget about Konstantinou..besides Papadopoulos is going to be back in action and so will Gkekas....both a better goalscorer than Konstantinou, konstantinou real value was in controlling the ball and keeping a presence in central attack....wasnt till this year when he was a great goalscorer....we let him go maybe because we want someone better.... im fine with that then, as long as who we get is better......

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I was upset with this move by konstantinou. But then again, when you size up situation, mihali really didn't make his mark in europe with pao and thats why no real interest eventuated overseas by a big club.

The fact he moved to gauvroi, is a direct insult to the fans that worshipped him, he will never get that support at another club. He prostituted himself for money and thats it.........

Notice that the gauvroi have bought washed up players from pao to stregthen their squad. I thought they didn't value our players in the first place.

You have a situation whereby the gauvroi will have 31 players in their squad fighting for a team place. Thats where all the biching will start amongst the klikers and new lads. definately to our advantage.........

As to mihalaki, he will always be remembered as a traitor and a has been.

H p****** tou limani..............................

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