slick13 Posted June 16, 2005 Share Posted June 16, 2005 telose o vryzas! also haristeas very unsharp infront of the goal! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Borobia Posted June 16, 2005 Share Posted June 16, 2005 Brazil rulez and that is fact, it's ok we faced a good team like Greek and a very strong and defensive team, but the "Ginga" still is the best. Robinho and Adriano are great players, among Ronaldinho and Kaká. Good game!!! Dimitri I told you ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iliana Posted June 16, 2005 Share Posted June 16, 2005 shame...we could score at least 1 goal.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loup Posted June 16, 2005 Share Posted June 16, 2005 I love when we bitch Reality check is needed - Brazil rocks - we are tough but not too great - don't let crying ruin what we had in EURO We must remember who was on the pitch when we won in Portugal - if they are not up to snuff we can't espect new players to jump in and have us dominate like we did there - at least not right away Zito ti patritha :gr: :gr: :gr: :gr: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turkcell Posted June 16, 2005 Share Posted June 16, 2005 I expected more from the nationals .... ...but Brazil is th king of football they can beat every team....so head up greeks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panathinaikos_Trifilli Posted June 16, 2005 Share Posted June 16, 2005 I didnt think Greece played too bad in the first half, they created good chances and didnt give Brazil too many. But this is Brazil, the best team in the world, and ofcourse they were gonna shine. That first goal was well weird, did you see the way the ball kinda gave itself a boost mid-flight, only the brazilians can do something like that. That third goal was typical of Juninho, he is possibly the best free-kicker in the world. Why does Otto insist on playing Vryzas? He dosent work atall, I wouldnt of even realised he was playing if the team-sheet wasnt read out. Vryzas's days are over, i am not usually critical of players but Vryzas is not capable of playing in the reserves. I think Greece need to practice alot more on converting chances. This was evident in the Ukraine match and todays. We need to take a bit of time out of organisation and practise on conversion. This game not only shows how much Brazil are in a class of there own, but how far behind Europe is. I still think at this moment of time Greece is the best team in Europe, and if Brazil can score 3 against the greatest defence in the world, then theres no stopping the South Americans. Let us meet in the final, Brazil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest GreekSoussou Posted June 16, 2005 Share Posted June 16, 2005 They played ok, but the thing is, they need to find the back of the net alot more if they want to be successful. They could have played better Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exocet Posted June 16, 2005 Share Posted June 16, 2005 Greece needs help on their offensive game. Vryzas and Charisteas are just finishers. They cannot get the ball and create scoring opportunites for themselves. Cross the ball to them and hope for a header in the net. On the ground ... forget it, this is where we are lacking. The Brazilians were in front of our net, dancing around, passing the ball to each other and looking for a shot on net. Greece does not have any forwards who can do that. We could have surely used Nikolaidis if he had not retired. He can plough through defenses and is persistent. We did not score a goal in game against Turkey and Ukraine. We need help to create scoring opportunities and to score goals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
athinaios Posted June 16, 2005 Share Posted June 16, 2005 anybody knows where we can download the goals? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exocet Posted June 16, 2005 Share Posted June 16, 2005 go to sportline.gr.... check out the media section ... u should find the goals there www.sportline.gr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exocet Posted June 16, 2005 Share Posted June 16, 2005 I did not expect us to win, after all Brazil is Brazil, but to at least put one goal in the net. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CH-Thrylos Posted June 16, 2005 Share Posted June 16, 2005 the start wasnt bad. especially kyriakos missing a huge chance in front of the goal all alone! if he would have taken that one better it could have been 1-0 for us in the 2nd minute. it was very clear that our best defender, kapsis, was missing. nikopolidis couldnt do anything against the first goal of adriano. it just came out of nowhere. i was so surprised that his shot went into the net that i completely forgot to swear. ;) the second one was just typical for the greek team. but in terms of the pre-otto-era. everybody just thought "oh, ok, the ball will go out. there isnt anybody to take a shot." and then robinho came in and scored. the third one nikopolidis could have saved imo. he was waiting to long. but anyway. the match is over and the result is 3-0. before otto it would have been 30-0. brazil looks like they are able to win this trophy. but i believe that our players saved their best match for the final against them. B) i just dont understand how otto could take out seitaridis and bring in vyntra! seitaridis played very well on the right side. he should have kept him in the match. finally i dont really believe our team will make it very far, but who did think of that before the euro? so dont start ripping apart certain players just because they play for opposing clubs in greece. e.g. i got an msg from a friend of mine from greece (gavros): "goumas kai kyriakos einai to pio argo amyntiko didimo ston planiti." who did he think to put in against them? anatolakis?! he would have gotten enough yellow cards to suspend the whole team. nikopolidis had some bad exits in the beginning but he couldnt do much about the goals. if these players would have been marked better the first and second goal wouldnt have been scored. the biggest problem are our strikers. even giovanni could have taken care of them as a defender. they were so slow!!! charisteas had about five meters distance from lucio towards the goal and lucio gets him!!!! we need faster strikers. vryzas is slow anyway. but charisteas, kotzam paidi, cant get away from the much older brazilian. papadopoulos had some better moments than charisteas had. ... lets focus on the match against japan now. if we win that one our chances should be ok to advance to the semis. :gr: :gr: :gr: :gr: :gr: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miko Posted June 16, 2005 Share Posted June 16, 2005 I have to agree with most of the posted responses...they capture some of the key elements of our performance today. Vryzas has to make way for the others. Charisteas too seems like he would be a good sub for the final twenty;at times today in 1vs1 situations he would move side to side or push the ball past a defender only to have his speed and lack of footwork let him down. Papadopoulos and Amanatidis both appear to have more pace and intensity to their games. Whatever the case, our offence needs to be activated immediately because we no longer enjoy the element of surprise. It was ironic that Goumas was the man truddging back (slowly I might add) on the second goal instead of running and marking(does anyone recall his lethargic actions during Husin's goal one week ago?). As for Seitaridis being replaced by Vyntra, it had to be injury related because Giourkas was the only reason we were able to cross into the Brazilian half with any meaningful attacks. Like someone posted earlier, Brazil plays at a level that is unmatched. Teams in Europe are just now developing ways to break down stout defensive systems like the one Greece deploys, whereas Brazil has been dealing with this for over 30 years. Everyone who plays Brazil is inclined to attempt to smother or blanket their talent. But Brazilians have always managed to beautifully combine individual flair, skill, and talent with a strong technical and structual assembly. No surprise that we came up short. At the same time there is no reason to hang our heads. Three years ago after losing the two first games in qualifying for Portugal 2004 no one could have imagined that we would be playing in an exclusive tourney against the greatest team in the world, or that we would be representing Europe as continental Champions. Listening to our anthem being sung by thousands with such volume and passion nearly brought me to tears. Put your expectations aside and enjoy these special moments while they are available. :tup: Good luck to us against the Japanese and Mexicans! :gr: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HOLLYWOOD Posted June 17, 2005 Share Posted June 17, 2005 Look we learnt a couple of things today that i suspected for a long time: 1) where not as great as we make out to be, i mean when we won euro, we won it because we had a great game plan and everyone played 100% to there best... However everyone around the world now knows our game plan( e.g Albania beat us, Ukrane, Brazil ect...) and they adjust accordingly, also not all the players are playing 100% (its hard to b consistant in every game, i know) and this shows our weakness a s a nation coz for us to be a good team we need to play 100% while lets say the brazilian play medi-core, then and only then we can beat them otherwise were not that good... 2) for ages now ive been saying Greece has a s%$#! attack!! and Vryzaz is not good anymore, he cant find the net for s%$#!!! We need a new Striker period... Greece has alot of average/good players in its team but no "Super star".. i mean look at Ukrane, they have an alright squad with a "super star" (shevchenko) and there doing preety damn good.. Can you imagine how good Greece would be if we had a "super star"?? :nw: :gr: P.S no matter what happends from now, Otto should be worshiped for what he did i mean what did u expect Drako???? that greece would win every game and all the nations would s%$#! them selves now?? Greece played the tournament of there lives in euro with a great game plan and everyone playing at there best and with the help of some nations playing abit s%$#! and thats why we won.. Dont think we are now a Super power house of a team :whistle: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midnight-Frapps Posted June 17, 2005 Share Posted June 17, 2005 RELAX!!! It's not that bad! Greece had some good chances first half, and fell apart in the second. Although Greece kept control of the first half, The turning point came, when the Brazilian goal keeper preemtively read a greek corner kick perfectely, by following Haristeas. The Adriano goal was not Greeces' fault, since Nikopolidis is governed by the laws of physics, and the ball clearly was not. An early 2nd half goal deflated the greek spirits, and we all know about the 3rd goal of a set play. It wasn't that bad. Although the brazilians have been known to stumble, they are invincible, when they play together as a unit. As much talent as our (or any other) side has, they have the ability to out perform anyone. what do you expect from a team with 5 world cups, volleyball with no hands, 170+ million people? :blink: Next Japan, Mexico, and maybe 2 victories against Brazil and Argentina! :LOL: P.S. The Danes, and the Georgians, are watching the tapes to find holes in our play. I'm sure the coache's are not saying "just do what adriano did..." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akritis_1944 Posted June 17, 2005 Share Posted June 17, 2005 I have read some of these post analysis comments and I honestly believe that some of you people are ignorant defeatists. You are delusional, weak and backward thinking if you think that Ellas had no chance against Brazil before the kickoff. I am not a fickle fan of Greek football. I like to think I have stood by the pathetic trashings of our side and also through our most highest of highs last year. But let’s not make excused here, we are making the most average of teams look good. We basically played like amateurs. We do our football and nation no service by being thankful we "only" lost by 3 goals to Brazil. We are the European Champions and yet we act like pauper nations like FYROM or Malta. Even Hong Kong managed to score against Brazil a few months ago. The issue is not to do with technical abilities on our players part, but psychological, outlook and attitude. Most other European nations would not have crumbled tonight. Brazil is not unbeatable. Their last competitive match was a 3 - 1 loss against Argentina. Yet Argentina scraped past Tunisia last night. We as Greeks think we're better than the so called weak nations, yet when we encounter a Germany or in this case a Brazil this ingrained notion that we are confronting legends makes us humble and bow to these players as if we are in the presence of Jesus Christ. Unless we put caution aside and start playing like European champions against Japan and Mexico, then we will be embarrassed. Not only won't we win against the remaining opponents, but we won't even score a goal. (94 World Cup anyone???) If people are honest with themselves then they will acknowledge that what I am saying has merit. This is not the F\/CKING Eurovision tsirko or some miss universe clown competition. We are supposed to be the benchmark for European football, yet we are playing like a third rate PAOK! Football and a nations success on the world stage provides respect to its people. In our most optimistic dreams we could not have expected our national team to shock the world and become European champs last year, yet we now find ourselves in the position of playing this most retrograde brand of football where our performances are so unpredictable, their putting all the achievements which were fought with honour back to the 1950s! ZHTW ELLAS! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spiro Posted June 17, 2005 Share Posted June 17, 2005 Who cares about Brazil guys? We played the number 1 team in the world and we lost! So what? I'll be happy if we win over Mexico and Japan (teams that suit us better) and then play Brazil in the final again! This is hypothetically speaking of course because a team that lost in its home from Ukraine in such a critical game is good to bring up the Euro 2004 memories only. Not to repeat it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miko Posted June 17, 2005 Share Posted June 17, 2005 Akritis you can not underestimate the discrepancy between the Greek and Brazilian players when it comes to technical ability. Most think that Brazilians are just a collection of poor boys who learned the game on the beaches or in the streets. False! The Brazilian Federation and its development system is the most sophisticated. Their infrastucture produces players at the same rate as factories pump out products. This is evident in the droves of Brazilian players who flood leagues worldwide and the 5 World titles that Brazil lay claim to(to go with the countless other continental and confederations cups). I dont care what your psychological mindset is, when you are staring at Ronaldhinio, Adriano, Robhinio and Kaka you have to show some respect and this must be reflected in your approach when you encounter Brazil. Yes, Greece did triumph at the Euro's last year but that was last year. The players bonded over six games and they took all of us, opposition included, by surprise! But i do recall after the triumph that all players clearly stated that the hard work was yet to come...Greek football had to evolve to ensure the groundwork was there for future success in order to prove that Portugal 2004 was not a one-off type of deal. There is no team left that is unaware of Greece's style. Were you watching the game today? What did we accomplish in the half of our opposition? Nothing! Why, because we have not adapted to the changes and preparations made by our opposition.....the very same error that our opponents in Portugal failed to take notice of. Our offence is non-existent! If fans are growing impatient with the current state of things then I think they are somewhat justified. However, I think it was slightly arrogant to expect that our tactics would overcome the best offensive production in football. (By the way, Argentina did not struggle with Tunisia as badly as you stated...and they are also fielding a largely substitute squad) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spears Posted June 17, 2005 Share Posted June 17, 2005 What AKRITIS has said is one hundre percent corect and the moment you ###### greeks understand this is the moment will we move forward.. Finally someone who understands life.. Bravo Akritis and who ever disagress with his statments you are lost and are a ###### wit! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miko Posted June 17, 2005 Share Posted June 17, 2005 Back to issue of too much respect given by the Greeks to Brazil: What is the alternative? Forget about man-marking? Over commit to clever players with lunges and fouls as opposed to backing off and forcing them into mistakes? Should just allow Kaka and company to roam freely while we go at the Brazilian defence with our own firepower? We have nothing resembling an attack-minded player once you get past the stopper position. All of our midfileders play a holding-type position. Zagorakis is the exception but who is he providing service to? Charisteas?...Vryzas? They are not the explosive strikers we need. Our only option today, considering the opposition, was to hold the fort and hope for a break up front. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akritis_1944 Posted June 17, 2005 Share Posted June 17, 2005 My point is about the attitude and mentality of us Greeks and our footballers. Why do we build our footballers up into superstars but when we face a team like Brazil we tell the world with schoolboy trepidation how much of an honour it is to play against them as if we are somehow unworthy! I am not referring to anything technical as we have many technical shortcomings when we compare ourselves to Brazil. I am merely highlighting the obvious inferiority/superiority complex we Greeks seem to have. I am surprised Goumas or Basinas didn't ask for the Brazilians autograph at half time as they were walking off to the dressing rooms. We need to start behaving and acting like European Champions not like apprentices. Greek culture and as an extension of this Otto Rehagel doesn't put faith in youth. How many players has Otto used in the past few years under the age of 24? Not many. We are one of the oldest sides in Europe. When is the rebuilding phase going to begin? Players like Zagorakis, Vryzas, Nikopolidis, Kapsis, Fyssas should be provided with an honourable farewell for all they have achieved for Greek football, but their continue presence in the team should end. I am 31 years old, and I don't think I am in any way old or over the hill, but I acknowledge that for purposes of future development early 20 years olds should be promoted ahaead of 31/32/33/34 year olds. When doe the powers in control think they will start blooding players like Gekas, Salpingidis, Amanatidis, Samaras etc. Maybe when they are 28? Well it will be too late for them and the NT. The most honourable thing to happen after the Euro triumph was for a broom to to have been swept through the squad and a new more progressive manager put in control. Don't get me wrong, Otto Rehagel will deservedly go down as one of the greatest football managers in history, but I think he has over stayed. His achivements I believe have more to do with motivating and giving the players confidence rather than coaching these players on football tehcnique. We need a new motivator and a new set of footballers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miko Posted June 17, 2005 Share Posted June 17, 2005 Great Post Aek66! Your summary of our midfield and its shortcomings is spot on! I also agree that Seitaridis didn't show up during the last two qualifiers but I doubt that Carlos would have given him trouble (carlos is overated and has been an underachiever in the last three years). You are also correct when you state that too much is expected from Karagounis. He can contribute offensively in games where we play against the likes of Ukraine, who lack a talisman like central midfielder. In those types of contests he can focus on forcing offence (he recently did so against Ukraine and Albania). But in games against strong midfielders he is used as a chaser or pitbull, not unlike Davids, and his job is to be a nuisance and an unsettling influence-just look back to the gritty battles he had with Figo, Zidane, and Nedved. Today you saw him chase down Ronaldhinio on numerous occasions. What are we left with?... Giannakopoulos alone and deep. Basinas would find him with the long-diagonal ball, only to have him chased down and dispossessed by two or three markers! Like you said, we are left to set pieces and game of absorbing sustained attacks for long periods of time. This is not only predictable but it also requires mistake-free football. It is impossible to play like this and win every time. I would expect our formation and philosophy to change against Mexico and Japan; it usually does when we go up against less sophisticated opponents. (By the way: Zikos is not on good terms with Otto, and last I heard I believe Grammozis was suspended for drug use? perhaps I am wrong...can anyone confirm this?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miko Posted June 17, 2005 Share Posted June 17, 2005 Ok Akritis, good on you, I concede. Your follow up post was excellent! I agree with all you said, particularly with Otto being a motivator and a tactician as opposed to being a builder. The Under 21 side and some of the younger and untested players (like Gekas, Amanatidis, and Salpiggidis) should have been sent to Germany as opposed to palying two crucial qualifiers with the preoccupation of having to prepare for the Confederations Cup. You are also right when you say that talent is being squandered by keeping youth out of important events. At the same time we can not expect to qualify for the world cup if we send out an inexperienced side. This team is, for the most part (strikers aside), the best Greece has to offer. We are not that old, and besides, if this bunch qualifies, it allows for the opportunity of some of our younger players to go to Germany in 2006 and take part in a valuable experience. Making total sweeping changes maybe slightly drastic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spears Posted June 17, 2005 Share Posted June 17, 2005 Akritis keep preaching!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REDmagic Posted June 17, 2005 Share Posted June 17, 2005 THIS WAS NOT THE HELLAS OF 2004 :whistle: (Our bench sux) Its obvious we are struggling but guys you should all realise the ELLAS team is NOT the same team that won the EURO..In the second half our back four from the EURO were all out (Dellas,Kapsis,Seitaridhs,Fyssas)..In the EURO they were awsome for us in defence and attack and its obvious they can't be replaced overnight :nono: (Kyriakos,Basinas,Goumas,Vyntra) all looked lost and out of position and hardly created any attacking moves. Basinas should go back in the midfield and Goumas+ Kyriakos + Vryzas+Tsartas watching all the :gr: games on the kanape back in Greece... Rehagal its time for Salpighdhs and Stoltsidhs to be given a fair go :tup: :gr: A win against Japan will ease the pain :gr: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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