Greece v. Sweden @ Euro 2008

[cyberfish]

Ah, just a horrible game to start the turnament. Let's hope they learn from it and move on to find some spark somewhere. Three center-backs are hard to overcome.

At the end of the first half I joked that our strategy is to put the Swedes to sleep with our game and then to score. Unfortunately, our players put themselves to sleep and the Swedes scored. This is a classic case of a good strategy backfiring :LOL:

Anyway, there were so many things wrong with the team today it's hard to fit it all in an encyclopedia. Coaching schools should keep the tape to study how not to lineup a team, and how not to play.

What's more worrysome for me is the lack of conditioning. The players had no spirit and are in no form to play in a major tournament. Antzas even had a cramp :blink:

I feel lucky we played a pretty mediocre team today. Next game will be different, so let's not paint it black just yet. Maybe the strategy was to put the Russians to sleep...

[Guest geok]

Geok: We are out!!

as5664, the only truth is that Mathematically we are still in the game of qualification. I take your point and I share your realism, but with a victory against Russia and if Spain beat Sweden, things are still open. Lets wait and see. 4 points may still be enough.

[Olympiakara10]

What the hell do you mean what did we expect? We expected to show some sort of passion against ###### Sweden. We didn't even have a chance on goal. The only chance we had was when a Swedish defender almost had an own goal off a header. That's pathetic.

Greece sucked balls tonight and proved the critics correct. The way they played showed that they are a one-trick pony. They have no creativity, no movement, no nothing. Absolute s%$#!.

They played ###### 5 defenders against SWEDEN. Sweden ffs. Not Portugal, Sweden. Otto took that team too seriously and he deserves the results he gets with the poor formation and other poor decisions such as starting Antzas and Charisteas(AGAIN).

It's over. I don't like saying that but it is. Even if we beat Russia(does anyone even think we can beat Russia? Besides the fact they beat us in 2004, they have more creativity than Greece), we will get raped by Spain. I see a 5-0 loss in that game if this play continues on to next week. And considering this form has been the same since the Hungary friendly, I don't see it changing so quickly.

[PAO_OR_DEATH]

OK I am the only one who thinks that the second goal should have been dis-allowed for the foul on kyrgiakos??!! (ok, i had to do it) we did play average for defending champions.

Greece did have chances, charasteas open shot was poor (I blame that on the "nerves" of the first 10 mins) Karagounis blundered a perfect oppertunity to score or at least pass to samaras, there were some close corners and there were others but we "missed" fanis in the 2nd half for sure!!!.

Zlatan's goal was the only time (first, at the time) the greek defence seriously miss read the swedes and screwed up.To be honest if the player marking him couldnt read that 1-2 then he shouldnt be playing professional football it was the most obvious goal i think i have seen all year. The 2nd was in my opinion a foul but totally ludacris anyway nikopolidis should have held it!!!!!

I think that we can still be positive, last time England, Portugal lost their first games. Also this is football, amything can happen we are not "out" untill we loose either to russia or spain. I believe that this was a good wake up call for the team and that we can beat russia and we can beat spain we just need to play football.

[as5664]

an absolute crap display of football. rehhagel leaves many perplexed with returning to a 5 defender scheme against a sweden with 2 strikers..1 withdrawn (ibrahimovic) and the other a 36 year old recently recalled player (larson).

the answer to a 90% ibrahimovic and a 36 year old larson? 3 centerbacks. wow..safety first, otto? you see, poland should have played 6 centerbacks against germany.

the key in terms of attacks in this 5-3-2 system are: the fullbacks up the flanks and central mids making forward runs into the box. we didn't see neither and neither did we see 2 central strikers, as gekas was basically isolated in the middle as 1 central striker while charisteas playing almost as a wide right midfielder.

tell me, with a 170cm gekas, how is this player going to do anything up front alone?

poor scheme and some very poor individual preformances from various greek players. throw in the usual blockage in the central mid... and the gallery was justifiably whistling the greek side by 25 minutes.

a couple of things: the greece side has always been famous for SLACKING and being LAX right after a whistle from the ref. this tradition came into play on ibrahimovic's classy goal. players moaning and groaning, players trying to engage the ref in conversation. very amateurish.

another thing i noticed was typical and something phantis should trademark. with greece down 0-2 in the 79th minutes, amanatidis got the ball wide right and made a run up the flank. before the ball made it's way to amanatidis' feet, you CAN CLEARLY SEE, basinas-katsouranis-karagounis probably seperated by 4 yards. UNBELIEVABLE and UNACCEPTABLE. that my folks, is shite football...and this is why the world sneers at greece.

who is amanatidis supposed to cross to? the swedes only have to worry about samaras and charisteas. why aren't some these central midfielders sprinting into the box to make the swedish defense work? if a rebound falls to anywhere, where are the greek central midfielders? i'll tell you where they are, they are 25 yards behind the play.

finally - torosidis had a wrong-foot/wrong-side minute in the 87th minute when torosidis found himself in the 6 yard box. no one-time hit or quick ball back into the middle.....why? because torosidis is not left-footed. torosidis ended up turning his (swedes gain time) to hit the ball right-footed.

i wanted papastathopoulos on the side. today, antzas was crap. antzas to me, smelled like 3 week old dirty, soiled laundry. just a poor preformance. by the way, tavlaridis is on vacation.

what happened today was the epitome of our worst nightmares.

nikopolidis - 4.5 - typical nonsense from him. got caught out in no-man's land on 2 occasions, rescued by poor swedish finishing. made 1 clutch save with his legs - no chance on the 1st goal, i have no idea what nikopolidis was doing on the 2nd goal that sealed the 3 points for sweden. nikopolidis failed to catch a ball and prefered to punch...and the ball ended up in the greek net by the time the next whistle sounded. exposed today for what type of goalkeeper he really is.

seitaridis - 4 - just a crap effort and footballing display this player. surprisingly made 1 dangerous cross. was poor with the ball - poor touches and passes, including a few critical comical passes that put greece on the back foot. if defense is his forte, a ljungberg with a bad rib exposed seitaridis as a player who has fallen miles from his 2004 preformance. booked on a challenge with ljungberg and later played the role of stan laurel on sweden's second goal. no cohesion at all with any central mid or charisteas and later, amanatidis.

torosidis - 5 - once again, trotted out by otto to play on the left. toro had some bright moments in the first half, only to be let down by his poor crossing. of course, i'm not sure if he had more than 1 player in gekas to choose from to receive a cross. was lax in the 2nd half - booked on a stupid foul committed when the ball and swedish player weren't in a threatening position. the resulting free-kick...well. also was very lax on the 1st goal...which started with a throw-in right in front of him.

dellas - 5.5 - not his best match, looked good stroking the ball around with his teammates hoping for 90 minutes to go by and the match to end 0-0. strong in the first half, save a wilhelmsson run and subsequent cross that dellas enjoyed the wind from. caught out a few times on poor greek attacking set-pieces - made a hillarious pass after 2 minutes of greek possession of greek centerback keep-away that had the commentators laughing.

kyrgiakos - 6.5 - easily the best greek player on the pitch. held his own and easily had the upper-hand on ibrahimovic. let down by antzas whenever sweden did a flick or step-over, antzas had a seizure. tried to win a foul the 'mediterreanean way' on the 2nd goal, except seitaridis was 'battling' and nikopolidis went into airplane crash position to defend his goal.

antzas - 3.5 - worst player on the pitch, barely beats out samaras. antzas didn't even look like footballer when the greek backline decided to stroke the ball amongst themselves. made a poor clearance in the 1st half that put the greek defense unde prressure, made some poor passes and lost some balls a 10 year old can trap and bring to their feet. stationary on ibra's headed effort over the bar and looked bad on ibra's goal, as antzas applied to body to throw off ibra. antzas should not even be on this side.

karagounis - 5.5 - poor at times, good at others, mediocre for most of the match. especially poor at set-pieces. had a chance to put greece in the lead, only to be too mechanical and predictable. again, doesn't want to run into the box when greece has the ball out wide.

basinas - 5 - whiner and complainer. cries after every call while sweden is sprinting up the pitch. didn't offer his services to support any fullback or forward. another player that doesn't want to run into the box, prefers to hit 35 yards shots, as being a higher percentage of scoring. hit a good shot that isacsson did well to swat at for a corner.

katsouranis - 4 - poor game, offensively and defensively. he won a few headers only to return possession to sweden and made a hideous pass that made the commentator gasp. made a few runs into the box after the match turned 0-2 for sweden. the 2nd half started with the best greek build-up play of the match (while the score was still 0-0), only to piss away precious greek possession with a blind pass.

charisteas - 5 - nothing here. can't play on the right despite 1 lucky cross - though charisteas did show effort, forcing a save from isacsson - regardless of the ease of the save. not sure why he went in so recklessly (though the swede embellished) to get booked in the first minute. his coolness doesn't match his low technique - if only we can give his coolness to torosidis. didn't seem fazed - this player should not start. otto builds his paper castle around his desrie to keep charisteas in the starting 11.

gekas - 5 - nothing here. isolated up front - didn't go to the 2nd post after charisteas won a header in the box...only to draw charisteas' ire.

samaras - 4 - does this guy realize he's playing in the euro and not a training session? poor on the ball - bad touches. looks confused by the fact the central midfielders don't run into the box whenever samaras wins a flick-on or looks to play a quick 1-2.

amanatidis - 6 - did his job the best he could on the right wing, without any help from giourka or his central mids.

in short - nothing more to say. this side can play better, i have no doubt about this. the problem is otto is compounding the certain lack of abilities of various players by insisting on his tactical and schematic 'nuances'. otto gets a 0 while topalidis gets a 1 for not only kissing otto's ass, but for claiming a few days ago that greece knows where sweden is weak and greece will hit them there. where? the centerbacks passing the ball to each other for 3 minutes?

we'll be in for massive criticism...the side hasn't looked this bad since the 1-4. i thought the commentators were suburb...and they even found it hard justifying greek play. if you're afraid to play, don't come to a euro.

after the 1st round of matches, greece is easily the worst side - top to bottom.

:nw: :nw: :nw: :nw:

[drakos13]

Where is the backing of our team??? 

Yeah we could've done this and yeah we could've done that, but now we have to look towards the next game...

Should this result surprise anyone?  Do we honestly all think that we're going to re-peat??

BE REAL PEOPLE....  The best thing that we can do is back our team and encourage.

repeat???

whos talking about a repeat!

we are 100% correct to be angry! this was pathetic, disgraceful!

We did not TRY to go and win that game or go forward at all! Thats s%$#!!

Id rather go forward test the great players we do have offensively against the Swedes and go for the goals and then we can worry about shutting down the entire match!

This was awful, we were

Repeat? I just want a good performance - I wouldnt care at all if Sweden got the best of us - but in this way, where we sit with 8 in the box not even slightly caring to go forward on our OPENER as a defending champion, is absolutley disgraceful. Wheres the confidence? Why nobody beleives in Greece's ability to go forward - WE HAVE IT.

Its over. Its all over. All i ask is for repsectable games vs Russia and SPain, and thats a lot to ask, maybe even a goal would be nice. Euro 2004 is a great memory and wont ever go away, btu that team is buried in the history books. This is NOT that team, and Rehagel is trying to make it something its not by this crap he played when his teams strengths are no longer in defense.

Ratings:

Nikopolidis 4 - horrible game, way bad positioning many occasions lucky, 2nd goal was a joke too. Time to retire and let somebody else take the spot. 2nd goal was a foul, but also piss poor goalkeeping. Why he punched something right at him (not the first time kotapolidis done this, then in the air not leaping up to tip it away (he can use his HANDS) was awful..

Antzas 4 - pure crap, no suprise.

Seitaridis 6 - decent at times some good saving tackles, did his best, and wasnt repsonsible for the breakdowns that much. Not great but decent.

Torosidis 6 same as Seitaridis, only he was pretty selfish to try to shoot from 1 degree angle

Karagounis 5 - crap, cant look up the field, realize whats around him (some GREAT potential opportunities if he opened his eyes and passed to his teammates short and wide quite often and had horrid crosses)

Kats/Basinas 6 - did what they good, not good enough. They cant create anything on their own like that.

Chari/Gkekas - 6 did fine, didnt have much to work with but not overly disapointing, it was silly to replace Gkekas and leave the system exactly the same.

Samaras - 3 what a horrible game.....he was hopeless out there no team willl ever want him again. cant control a ball to save his life, lost every posession for us and cant see options, hes a very poor excuse for a point striker, and shouldnt have been in the squad.

Amanatidis - not good enough.....

Rehagel 2 - terrible decisons, terrible lineup, terrible selections, and Sweden well prepared to beat him - absotluley no trick up his sleeve and his rigidness is holding us back, were just going to have to come to terms with it. Greece won recently a Euro, we need to move on to the NEXT generation of Greek talent and thats more than new call ups its new systems...... Trying to force a team thats blatantly by character NOT the one of 2004 to be something it not was destined to fail.

We are out....lets have a fun last 2 games, pressure should be off. There is no realistic chance of beating Russia and Spain with this system. I hope we can give some of the youth a shot, and stop being ridiculous and let Lyberopoulos get in and do what he does best...

[NikosVazelas]

Well, at least my favorite contestant won American Idol....

[manifest777]

:angry: YES WE CAN BE ANGRY, what a shameful display. But it's time to encourage this team anyway. A real fan BACK UP HIS TEAM in victory and defeat. What are these m*****es, go and support another team... Now concerning the game, I really don't understand why we still keep on playing as if we can't take the initiative of the game and PLAY FORWARDS. When I see 8 or 10 pass pass with Delas Antzas ans Seitaridis , just waiting the end of the first half, it's like we don't know what to do with the ball...We finished with 31 points in qualifications, scored 25 goals and are not able to play against a poor swedish team ? What do you think is the best approach against Russia who plays very fast, can we really let them the initiative of the game, I don't believe so.

[as5664]

Geok, you're right, it is still possible to qualify. In fact, we are still in control of our destiny; we have to go in and beat Russia and Spain. Period. Unfortunately, this is easier said than done, so you understand my pessimism.

I think the players should really stand up to Otto, especially Torosidis. If he winds up getting the bench, perhaps better for our performance and his club future. I had faith in Otto, and that is why I justified the occasional 5-3-2 / 5-4-1 mutation. But tonight was completely unecessary. I'm starting to think Otto cares more about his own ego than our team. It's as if he is reverting to the style of play (and players) we used during WC qualifications, and our pre- 4-1 thrashing in Athens.

Having an inept Charisteas playing out of his preferred position and short Gekas in exoria with 3 Swedish defenders around him merely compounded what was clearly our biggest problem--our midfield. But what can you expect, using 2 DMs and Karagounis as our only "attack" option. We would really gain from Toro in the midfield and Spiropoulos as a LB. Heck, even a 5-3-2 with Torosidis in what was Charisteas' position tonight (only reversed) and a lone striker would be preferable.

Also, Otto seemed to freeze up tactically. We made only 2 substitutions the whole night. Why did Otto not bring an extra forward in place of Katsouranis or Basinas??? Or Stelios even. We could have pushed with a 4 - 2 - 4. We were down 2-0, what the hell did we have to lose???

On the bright side, we REALLY have nothing to lose now. Maybe players will stand up to Otto and Topalidis AKA Karagiozis and Kolitiri. Maybe we will play all out offensive soccer. Unfortunately, I have a feeling we haven't seen the last of the 5-3-1/5-4-1. And instead of Nikopolidis, I say we hang a scarecrow stuffed with straw; at least it won't run off it's line.

[Lazarus]

we have to go in and beat Russia and Spain. Period. Unfortunately, this is easier said than done, so you understand my pessimism.

Beating Spain might be easier than beating Russia. I'll explain.

We play Russia first and then Spain, on the last day of group play. If Spain beat Sweden by a decent score (anything more than 1-0), they might not be interested in the outcome of the game with Greece -- they'll probably try not to get injured and will play for a draw. So if we get a draw with Russia and win an indifferent Spain, our chances are still there. If we beat Russia (easier said than done after today's display), then we can afford a draw with (possibly) indifferent Spain.

[athinaios]

It's the whole game plan that sucks guys. Gekas totally unsuited for the long high balls, for example. Otto wanted to play it safe. Maybe he thinks GR doesn't have the players to do anything else but what we've seen today.

[drakos13]

its more than enough to play football against Russia --- FROM THE START WHISTLE and actually TRY AND WIN A GAME.

[PAO_OR_DEATH]

ah yes the 4-4-2 94WC!!!!

I have had a wee sleep and calmed down a bit and i am still 100% confident we are not out, its in our hands....this should be a farking wake up call.

BTW Italy was completely owned by the Dutch, they probably had less chances than Greece.

but definately a negative display by greece which i hope they do not repeat.

For Greece's sake I hope we make it through, just to silence the critics/media....I dont want us to be laughed at

[Olympiakara10]

Wake up call for what? They're playing in the damn Euro! If they're not ready for it now, they never will be. They will finish with 0 or 1 point. Go home and don't embarrass us further.

[loup]

ti na poume pathyia???

there was one class player on the pitch we gave him 2 feet and he scorched us

5-3-2????

yiati?

the 5-3-2 requires offense from the mids and wing backs, and we produced none

we looked as slow as we did vs Turkey in the 1-4 defeat

Antzas is a bit of an oaf

Kara blew a golden chance, he scores and we win

And the 2nd goal was miserable, dont blame nikopolidis, find out who let Lunjburg waltz in the 18

Anyway like I said, ti na poume?

We now need 2 wins to go through

easier said than done

:gr:

[as5664]

http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2008/06/10/...2008-Greece.php

Okay, Rehhagel needs to go:

"We have to defend strongly before we can score," Rehhagel said. "We don't have the attacking options of teams like Germany. If we had applied different tactics we might have been 5-0 down at halftime."

Maybe he should have accepted that job in Germany two years ago. He has no attacking options, yet he selects the squad. He has no better options than Charisteas in all of Greece.

Why did he leave out Ninis, or other youngsters who could have benefited from this experience.

[loup]

Geok: We are out!!

as5664, the only truth is that Mathematically we are still in the game of qualification. I take your point and I share your realism, but with a victory against Russia and if Spain beat Sweden, things are still open. Lets wait and see. 4 points may still be enough.

we are better off if sweeden beats spain

then destiny is in our own hands

[mangas21]

i will reserve my judgments for the team until after the spain game.....its only 1/3 rd over......italy also got spanked, remember?

but i have to say this game against a mediocre Swedish side was perhaps the worst game i have ever seen the NT play.....it seemed that otto kept gestruirng for things to happen that the players simply were not doing....and, how do you 5 back against a 37 year old larson and a guy who has not scored in international competion?

they slooked slow, tired, confused, tentative, ....i can go on and on....how many people around the world are still scratching their heads wondering "this is the europan champion"?????

well for this first game i would say they were "defending chump-ions"

awful game....just awful....

[as5664]

Here are the interview from sport.gr

http://www.sport.gr/default.asp?pid=69&vid=10028

Otto is actually defending his "system" and is instead blaming the lack of creativity of our players. He seemed bothered that his methods were being questioned by journalists at the press conference. What was he expecting? Questions about the weather, his grandchildren??? The audacity to say the score would have been 5-0 were it not for his tactics. And to say that our players did not do what he expected. What did he expect our players to do? If they are concentrating on man marking 3 on 1, and have no game plan other than set-pieces and free kicks, how can they be creative. Was this the "secret weapon" Topalidis was talking about? <_< What's worse, our fans kept singing when dellas and Kyrgiakos were playing keep away for 2 minutes straight...rezilikia!!!

[RogueTrader]

We can not expect to win by respecting teams like Sweden and Russia. Awful performance.

Otto should be shot for playing 5 at the back with 2 defensive midfielders against SWEDEN!

WITH NIKOPOLIDIS, WE HAD 8 DEFENDERS. 8 PLAYERS BEHIND THE BALL. COUNT THEM.

1 Nikopolidis

5 Dellas

2 Seitaridis 19 Antzas 16 Kyrgiakos 15 Torosidis

21 Katsouranis 6 Basinas

How do we expect to show any enterprise with only 3 players on the attack??? It was Sweden FFS!! Ridiculous.

Drop Antzas, piss Gekas off and bring in Giannakopulos and Salpingidis.

Additionally, if Charisteas isn't on up front, play Liberopoulos for crying out load.

I don't mind losing, it's bound to happen but pls don't ever play like that again.

[AEKPROTATHLIMA]

Well not a good start but we still have 2 more games. I will keep my opinions and judgement to my self untill the final game.

[aek21]

Greece could never get a proper attack going and struggled to even move the ball forward. The passing at times was mindboggling. I thought Samaras was a wasted sub, Lyberopoulos was a better option and has a habit of saving Greece's hide. Plus Amanatidis wasn't very effective swinging in crosses, that's if I can call them crosses. Pulled off some nice move though. The only player who impressed out there was Karagounis. He always did well when had possession and looked dangerous on the ball, his only drawback was his poor delivery on a few set-pieces. Charisteas did well to carve out a couple of his own chances, but when he was given a more central role later in the game he was MIA. Katsouranis was a little dissapointing, seemed nervous out there.

The difference between the two teams today came down to the fact that Greece looked like a team that didn't want to lose, while Sweden looked like a team that wanted to win. Only after Ibra's wonder goal did Greece look alive.

Anyways, Greece came back from a 4-1 loss to Turkey only to later dominate the group. I'm confident Greece can get the right results against Russia and Spain, and if they don't life goes on.

[AEK-MTL]

Well, what can I say that hasn't been said already? Terrible performance. No creativity, poor passes, easy give-aways.... I actually called for a 5-3-2 against Sweden because I believed the 4-3-3 left us too exposed at the back but now that I've seen this performance, I can see how wrong I was. It doesn't really work when you have 2 DMs, 3 CBs, and 2 full-backs with very little offensive contribution. Way to isolate Gekas and Charisteas.

And that whole "passing between the CBs" thing was laughable. I remember actually counting the passes between the center-backs at one point and lost count after 12-13. And then the crowd booing the team. Absolutely embarassing. I say screw it and just play a 4-3-3 all the way. We need wins. Otto called up 6 forwards; clearly our strengths lay in other areas besides defense. How about actually using these strengths?

If I see 5 Greek defenders lining up against Russia, I won't even bother watching.

[evalagoal]

Honestly guys what we lack as a Nation is "creativity". It's this that we need to teach to youth so when they become men and play in these major tournaments we have that one or two players that can create and change the game.

I hope Otto speaks to these guys and gets them fired up for the game against Russia.

[Akritis_1944]

If they played a team that was better, they would have lost by 5 or 6.

Thankfully it was Sweden and not Spain.

No, I'm not in agreement with Otto about playing ultra defensive not to suffer a heavier defeat. A manager that has no belief in his players should not be managing the reigning Euro Champions.

Otto is 75% the problem and the players the remaining 25% for listening to him and his outdated methods.

I have been calling for Otto to resign gracefully since 2004.

What does Gagatsi and his EPO cronies do? They court him and offer him an extension to the 2010 WC. Unbelievably stupid!

Where is the youth coming through? Why would you not call Papastathopoulos, Ninis, Avram, Dimoutso???

Gagatsi should resign and since he won't fire Otto, then he should do the honourable thing and also submit his resignation.

Thanks for the 2004 Trophy and the memories, but how dare you disrespect a proud people by trotting out that crap.

I am a proud Greek, but ashamed of my national football side.

:gr