OFI - Panathinaikos

[athinaios]

Look, with all the players we've traded with OFI, are you sure all can legally play????

Maybe we can still win this one on paper! :LOL: :LOL: :LOL: :LOL: :LOL: :LOL: :LOL: :LOL:

Enjoy life gents! Don't let this bring you down. :tup:

Cheers.

[cyberfish]

Congratulations to OFI. I don't much care for playoffs, and I said before we'll be better off in UEFA cup next year.

i dont think so.....wed be better off giving the team next year the experience and the amounts of matches in Europe that CL offers......also would force some spending this summer....

UEFA is just a tournament to keep us occupied....we have no realistic shot at winning it or even making it past the quarterfinals...

Why not? Zenit isn't a bigger club than PAO. Leverkusen aren't that good either (yes they are probably slightly stronger than PAO, but PAO is slightly stronger than Rangers too, and look what happened there). Sporting definitely aren't anything special, and although Getafe battered AEK I'm not so sure AEK took the UEFA Cup seriously this year. Only Bayern seem super-strong, and even they might be on the verge of going out. PAO (and all the top Greek teams) should be aiming to win the UEFA Cup.

Cyberfish you make good points about the time-table and shows that UEFA haven't thought the process through well enough. The play-off system in greece will also negatively impact on euro 2008, so EPO have been short-sighted too.

I agree. Our NT will suffer from this prolonged season. They could have started the playoff idea next season, but thinking is not the strong attribute of football officials in Greece.

For players, injuries will come plenty and often. Those who make it in the end will be looking ahead at a short recuperation time going into next season. Injuries will come plenty and often then too.

Not good at all.

[cyberfish]

BTW, not to change the subject, but does anyone have a can of WD-40? This bike is staring at me :LOL:

I have a nice series of lectures on the "Peloponnesian War" on audio, and I am looking forward to traversing the hills of upstate NY while I listen to them.

Like nikos would say: "Later Skaters"

[GreenTitus]

OK, here's what I think.

1) It is only football - no point in getting depressed over it.

2) The main reason we fail time and again is stress and the nervousness it entails. Every new guy has to carry this burden as though he was the one who wasted the previous years.

3) It was this kind of pressure that made Peseiro contribute like no other to this failure. It's not whether he fielded this or the other formation or whether he played this or the other player. His major mistake was that he succumbed to the false need to 'change things', play differently, use certain players more or whatever. The moment he did that he lost the 'game'. OK, the team was not attractive on the pitch but they were winning or, at least, taking the results. But then it was all about politics and who thinks what about whom.

3) The same pressure is eating the players alive. They sign not as players but as saviours. Equi will save us from the abalous we had thus far, Spyropoulos will save us from Seric, Iv will save us from Theodoridis, Sapanis and all those mediocre guys who were inadequate for PAO, Manucho will score 20 goals in 3 months etc. How long has it been since you saw a player preform miracles with PAO- I mean, have a really good season and not just a few games? Well, as long as this misery continues you never will again.

4) Misery I said? This brings us to the fans' share of the blame. Bitching, bitching and more bitching. Recycling the misery and the tension will get us nowhere.

5) Management: well, first of all, they picked the manager and the players so... But apart from that, the team is 'bate skuloi alleste'. The players feel that it is always someone else's problem, the manager is supported until he blows the championship etc. Plus, Germanakos is 5 feet from the incident and awards that ridiculous penalty. I 'm not saying they should work backstage - I don't want that. But we 've lost respect to the point of being treated like pushovers by the refs in practically every game. Who will blame them after all? It is always Vardinogiannis' fault at PAO. Send Nikopolidis off at Karaiskaki and you 're dead meat.

6) Luck. Well, let's face it: you need some of that too and we 've been unlucky for not scoring early today or at home with Xanthi.

PS: This is probably the first 'clean' championship in a while - clubwise, because EPO are, well, EPO.

PS2: The whole "OFI will spread their legs" thing worked well, once again.

[drakos13]

Why not? Zenit isn't a bigger club than PAO. Leverkusen aren't that good either (yes they are probably slightly stronger than PAO, but PAO is slightly stronger than Rangers too, and look what happened there). Sporting definitely aren't anything special, and although Getafe battered AEK I'm not so sure AEK took the UEFA Cup seriously this year. Only Bayern seem super-strong, and even they might be on the verge of going out. PAO (and all the top Greek teams) should be aiming to win the UEFA Cup.

Cyberfish you make good points about the time-table and shows that UEFA haven't thought the process through well enough. The play-off system in greece will also negatively impact on euro 2008, so EPO have been short-sighted too.

dude....

Zenit is a much better team than PAO...the club historically is not as big, but they have better players, and they are a very strong team.

Getafe are far better than PAO man....did you see them play Bayern? We dont have that talent and teamwork. Bayern are strong, but Getafe was surprising, there fast and exciting team. Fiorentina, PSV are too much for us.....maybe not in 2001-2003 years but today were really sunk to something else and itll be at least another season before we can rise to that again.... Sporting and Rangers arent great no, we could get as far as them....but the other teams really are a full class above....

[drakos13]

BTW, not to change the subject, but does anyone have a can of WD-40? This bike is staring at me :LOL:

I have a nice series of lectures on the "Peloponnesian War" on audio, and I am looking forward to traversing the hills of upstate NY while I listen to them.

Like nikos would say: "Later Skaters"

are you a hippie? :o

[athinaios]

BTW, not to change the subject, but does anyone have a can of WD-40? This bike is staring at me  :LOL:

I have a nice series of lectures on the "Peloponnesian War" on audio, and I am looking forward to traversing the hills of upstate NY while I listen to them.

Like nikos would say: "Later Skaters"

Where do you bike upstate? Have you tried lake Minnewaska and the surrounding areas?

The Peloponnesian War??!!! Interesting! I got depressed when I read extensively about it. Now I just bring it up to point out that a great empire can become arrogant and make mistakes that lead to its destruction. (sounds familiar?)

Also, notice how cultured people can do stupid things. Oh, and how serious crisis change the behavior of the people and the human condition...

PS> It's, L8r Sk8ters

[kisskiss]

Clearly this team cannot play with a clear mind when faced under

considerable stress & pressure.

This boils down to player quality, their psychology & the coach.

The past couple of years we've had a lineup that's had players such

as Morris, Vyntra, Tzioli, Goumas, Salpi, Paps, Nilson, Galinovic.

Some of them have had very good games, others not.

But, they don't play with a consistent winning attitude & when the water

reaches boiling point and we need some leadership

to pick up this team when needed, then sadly we lack that player quality

from our game.

We ran like headless chooks in that 2nd half and there was no system

or structure within the team to make something fruitful.

Put it down to the fact we don't have the players who can make the difference

and lift the team on a CONSISTENT basis as well as a coach who sh*ts his pants

playing ultra conservatively with a 2 & 3 DM system.

Finally, I'm glad a player like Ninis didn't have to be subjected to the crap

PAO played today, and his absence all season justifies just what a mal*ka the coach is.

PS: Spyropoulo is a very good LB and hardly deserves the criticism for 1 bad

game ...... look more at the players who've been with this team for the

last 3-4 yrs and you'll realise who deserves to play for Panathinaikos and who doesn't.

[MadBoy13]

where is the parade btw?

5th ave in manhattan

[slick13]

it is not 1-2 good players we need !

it is 8-9 good players!

4-5 bacline + goalkeeper

1-2 midfileld

1 striker who will score more than 1 goal a game!

1-2 ready for the starting 11 subs!

i am only counting the players who played today!

[pao123]

i want to see what peseiro has to say for himself...

[pao123]

http://www.sport-fm.gr/article.jsp?id=126354

[athinaios]

Oh, I like stability, you know what to expect. :D

This season, too, will finish several points behind the winner, no cup, out of UEFA, calls to get rid of the coach and most players. :LOL:

[Tsoglani]

Who is going to support Peseiro now?

Once more he started with 2 DM's.

Ah i forgot today Ninis wasnt even on the benche.

Peseiro eise THEOS

EDITED OUT----- (watch it!)

[MadBoy13]

pate deite ti eipe o theos peseio.. kati gia atixies akousa.. o anthropos einai allou.. exei ksefigei... as ton desoun kapou...

[GreenTitus]

Once more he started with 2 DM's.

I seem to remember that with two DMs we had 5 huge chances and dominating the match, whereas with 3 forwards and Equi we sucked big time and couldn't test Tzorvas at all. It's not always about the bloody DMs - will you just let go?

[MadBoy13]

I seem to remember that with two DMs we had 5 huge chances and dominating the match, whereas with 3 forwards and Equi we sucked big time and couldn't test Tzorvas at all. It's not always about the bloody DMs - will you just let go?

to paixnidi to xasame epeidi o peseiro evgale ton ivan... eixe mesa ton nteforme morris kai epeidi den epekse o nillson... also for one more game o tziolis ksekinise.

[Tsoglani]

I seem to remember that with two DMs we had 5 huge chances and dominating the match, whereas with 3 forwards and Equi we sucked big time and couldn't test Tzorvas at all. It's not always about the bloody DMs - will you just let go?

You forget that to enter the strikers and eki he had to take out Ivanschitz.

What a genious!!!!

@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@

Pou eine parepimptontos o Nilson?

O Ninis plironei to oti epekse balara me tin Larisa?

E min trelathoume tora?

[PAO_OR_DEATH]

FOREVER ENEMIES WITH.......PAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

why goddamn it why!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! why must we fark up every year, you know i might just start to support some one who never wins like PAOK or Aris, farking poos man. What a start to an already miserable week.

Greece better win the euro or i think I will finally loose it

:(

[GreenTitus]

I tend to say my opinion without asking what anyone thinks of it. Some of us must learn tolerance - it's a good start. Some equally tolerant guys caused havoc at the airport. Check it out here

[cyberfish]

We are back to square one.

This is where we started this season, and this is where we end it (well it can get worst, but more about this later)

The team looked like they worked hard all these months to fill the bucket with milk, and then just like last season, they began shaking and jumping around wildly until they spilled it all.

GreenTitus said some wise words worth repeating here so I can save the little brain energy I have left:

2) The main reason we fail time and again is stress and the nervousness it entails. Every new guy has to carry this burden as though he was the one who wasted the previous years.

3) It was this kind of pressure that made Peseiro contribute like no other to this failure. It's not whether he fielded this or the other formation or whether he played this or the other player. His major mistake was that he succumbed to the false need to 'change things', play differently, use certain players more or whatever. The moment he did that he lost the 'game'. OK, the team was not attractive on the pitch but they were winning or, at least, taking the results. But then it was all about politics and who thinks what about whom.

3) The same pressure is eating the players alive. They sign not as players but as saviours. Equi will save us from the abalous we had thus far, Spyropoulos will save us from Seric, Iv will save us from Theodoridis, Sapanis and all those mediocre guys who were inadequate for PAO, Manucho will score 20 goals in 3 months etc. How long has it been since you saw a player preform miracles with PAO- I mean, have a really good season and not just a few games? Well, as long as this misery continues you never will again.

4) Misery I said? This brings us to the fans' share of the blame. Bitching, bitching and more bitching. Recycling the misery and the tension will get us nowhere.

5) Management: well, first of all, they picked the manager and the players so... But apart from that, the team is 'bate skuloi alleste'. The players feel that it is always someone else's problem, the manager is supported until he blows the championship etc. Plus, Germanakos is 5 feet from the incident and awards that ridiculous penalty. I 'm not saying they should work backstage - I don't want that. But we 've lost respect to the point of being treated like pushovers by the refs in practically every game. Who will blame them after all? It is always Vardinogiannis' fault at PAO. Send Nikopolidis off at Karaiskaki and you 're dead meat.

6) Luck. Well, let's face it: you need some of that too and we 've been unlucky for not scoring early today or at home with Xanthi.

Spot on. Point number 3 is an excellent point. Peseiro lost control of the team late in the season. It did not help that he does not seem to get shielded by those above him, and it does not help that certain "tsoglania" (no pun intended) players are chewing him from within.

This game is not even worth analyzing. It was a game of errors, most of which pinned Panathinaikos against the wall:

Error #1: By referee

This was not a penalty, and there is no way he did not see it. 1-0

Error #2: By Spyropoulos, Morris.

Half the defense is playing high for the offside trap, Spyropoulos is nowhere to be seen in the line that should be formed nicely in the back, long ball forward, Morris peels-off to mark wide left, but he is beat to the spot, Galinovic is beat as he exits off his line (not an error on his part on this one)

Error #3 By Peseiro

Taking out Ivanschitz was a head-scratcher. Karagounis was much worst in midfield. The move would make sence if you think that we wanted to plug the huge, free corridor OFI was exploiting down our left wing, but putting Postiga in exposed Spyropoulo even more. Worst, with three midfielders, and pulling Karagouni on the left, exposed our right wing as well.

Error #4 By everyone in a Green jersey.

Ofi kept possession way too long before they pulled off a very nice combination play to bring Sfakianaki face to face with Galinovic. Sure Vintra was beat to the ball, but I am not sure ANY other defender would have a chance in such play. Galinovic was also beat again on his near post, but I would not call this an error. It would have been an awesome block if he could pull it off. Mostly it was an error of our DM's, probably Tziolis because the play developed right where he should have been blocking. It would be more clear to me if I watched the game again, but I don't have the heart to do it. You guys tell me if I am wrong on this one.

Error # 5 By Peseiro

Taking out Vintra and putting in Gonzales to play 3-4-3 was probably a last ditch effort every coach would have done, but it made matters worst. First, I think the wrong fullback was pulled off the game. Vintra has played CB before, he is faster and taller than Spyropoulos, and can mark better. So leaving three defenders is risky enough, but leaving in Morris-Goumas-Spyropoulos was reckless.

There are good things that can come out of this game and the way it turned out to be embarrassing, but they will come after this season is over.

For now, we still have many games ahead since we will be in the playoffs, and I will repeat what I wrote in my blog:

---------

It

[drakos13]

5th ave in manhattan

i went to the parade...it was ok...no music (just marching bands, no folk music, how about have the kids play song greek songs I dont understand ? Or at least Greek marching songs? )

except for the Olympiakos float!?!? :xxx: :xxx: :xxx: :angry: :angry:

Ftou to the dhmos Neas Giorkis how can they allowing that crap !!!

[athinaios]

Great points by Titus and Cyber.

See how gavroi have been winning all these years. NOT by playing fancy football.... just they know how to chookoo-chookoo earn enough points from the lesser teams to finish first!

This season's PAO's collapse (another one as per usual) needs to be looked at more carefully because at times this team and this coach showed some very good moments. Many thought that it was PAO among the top 3 to have the best potential.

Also, until the Xanthi game, we had given , what, 7 goals. Since, however, we went back to our past swiss-cheese defense. [btw, I don't think Gali shares blame for 3 if not 4 goals this afternoon).

Not that I cared for, but this will put to rest that OFI gives us the games.....

[GreenTitus]

Not that I cared for, but this will put to rest that OFI gives us the games.....

It would, my friend, if this conspiracy theory was based on reason. They throw us out of a UEFA spot, they cost us CL spots, even championships and it's still on. Self-proclaimed "OFI fans" raise hell every year over these matches to the benefit of everyone but PAO and, so long as this works, it will keep happening. Trust me on this one... Anyway, it's clear that everyone at PAO (and I mean EVERYONE) is incapable of protecting this God-forsaken team. And, I repeat, I mean protect by legitimate and moral means - I don't want journalists to suck up to our owner and players, 'professors' of refereeing to exonerate the commando-refs and even politicians to table parliamentary questions after our fans have caused havoc like it happened after that Nea Smyrni game. No mater how many years we stay without a trophy, I will never chuckle at unfairness, injustice and under-the-table arrangements. And I 'll never support violence and all those Equi-style rebels who take me for a fool. Next time someone rejects PAO, we 'll have to think whether all these 'hurt' fans who visit airports and training centres are part of the reason. Will we ever get serious or is it just me who can't cut the m...kies?

[drakos13]

Great points by Titus and Cyber.

See how gavroi have been winning all these years. NOT by playing fancy football.... just they know how to chookoo-chookoo earn enough points from the lesser teams to finish first!

This season's PAO's collapse (another one as per usual) needs to be looked at more carefully because at times this team and this coach showed some very good moments. Many thought that it was PAO among the top 3 to have the best potential.

Also, until the Xanthi game, we had given , what, 7 goals. Since, however, we went back to our past swiss-cheese defense. [btw, I don't think Gali shares blame for 3 if not 4 goals this afternoon).

Not that I cared for, but this will put to rest that OFI gives us the games.....

That theory was always a load of garbage. OFI cost us last year too I remember....most of the time they lose, because most of the time theres a clear level of difference between the two teams...didnt they knock us out of the cup once too?