Dean97

The thing is we expect 1 player to start the attack in Fortounis and he is then overloaded by defenders and then we lose possesion. Samaris is good at keeping the ball and playing a short pass but we need more from our two midfielders. Zeca is better without the ball then with it. He runs, tackles, blocks, jumps and runs some more. He is a very average passer and not so good dribbler. He has heart though and will keep trying. Samaris dosent like to play a threaded through ball but Tachtsidis does. So does Mantalos. We need more organisation in attack if we want to score goals. We always play to a draw and somehow lose by a goal or win by a goal. We need to have more ambition going forward and players moving more. I cant remember the last time Greece won 2-0 or 3-0. I know people are going to tell me "ah we are not an attacking team" Have a look at the game against Hungary in 2015 we had a lot of opportunities to score and we won 4-3. Tachtsidis, Fortounis, Mantalos and Pelkas were in that team. So was Samaris. We played some younger untried players like Kitsiou and Tzanetopoulos. Kone and Mitroglou were and so were Holebas and Sokratis. The players i mentioned 7 of them play currently in the team. We can attack if we want but who knows if the players are allowed to. A team like this wouldnt hurt: Karnezis Manolas Sokratis Retsos Bakakis Samaris Androutsos/Zeca Stafylidis Donis Mitroglou Lazaros Subs: Tachtsidis/Samaris Fetfatzidis/Lazaros Lykogiannis/Stafylidis Pelkas, Fortounis and Mantalos play best as a number 10. I dont know if any of them are good enough to play that role and carry the team like Modric would do or Kaka back in the day. I think if Ninis had a better career he would play as the sole creator. Fortounis dosent run enough and is weak. Mantalos is faster and stronger than Fortounis but is not consisent enough to be trusted and Pelkas is still young but can definately surpass Mantalos and Fortounis sooner rather than later. So Androutsos or Zeca can play alongside Samaris. Depending on the opponent. Its more defensive this formation but when we have the ball we have options going forward from the flanks and 2 players supporting/wing role behind Mitroglou. Which means there is some always to pass to and move away from. Fetfatzidis can be a good impact sub. Donis and Lazaros would have to do the most running to give support,while Stafylidis and Bakakis have to be wide as possible for an option. We need runners in midfield also so Zeca or Androutsos are capable to run, carry the ball and be involved in the play.

He is just being passionate and I understand where he is coming from. He wants the team to be serious and focused about the nation's league. Let's create positive energy instead of negative. We don't agree with what Skibbe does but we have to accept that he is there and in charge of the team so let's speak positive for the teams sake. Let's be optimistic.

He is not that good on the ball and makes mistakes at times. He is good at free kicks but we also have others that are good as well. Fortounis, Mantalos, Stafylidis, Mitroglou and Pelkas are decent free kick takers. We shouldn't just play him for that. We need someone more solid at left back. Retsos looks more safe there than say Stafylidis.

I agree we must play our best players possible. Meaning no Tziolis or Tzavellas. Insert Kourbelis and Tsimikas instead. These teams are not easy. In the past it was a battle with teams like Hungary and Estonia. Sokratis and Manolas have to lead this team. Mitroglou has to score goals. They are our main players and are irreplaceable.

The Samaris situation is an interesting one. Did we ever think he was good offensively? I know he scored in the world cup 4 years ago but he hasn't done anything since then. I actually really like Samaris as a player and person. I think he is good but all he seems to be doing is play simple short passes most of the time and never gets into space. Is that the coaches doing? Because I think he will give us more If he is not holding all the time. Give that role to Zeca and let Samaris move into space to create another option. I do agree that all players need to defend and that Skibbe has to do a better job with what he has got instead of repeating the same thing. Let's not forget the Fetfatzidis is an option as well. We actually wingers now that can play there. Pelkas, Lazaros, Donis, Fetfatzidis and Gianniotas. Skibbe should choose 2 of those players for the wide options in a 4-2-3-1/4-4-1-1. I'm all in to play a 5-2-3. But I'm not sure if we have the players to bear that role. Even if the two wide players are more attacking they still have to defend.

Samaris and Zeca are the 2 that should start. They are our best. Kourbelis should be the sub and Galanopoulos should be behind Kourbelis. That's all you need. Tziolis is not needed and Tachtsidis can go get some form for his club first. We don't need to be calling up 3 left backs, 5 CDMs and only 1 right back. Retsos can play all across the back. That's an advantage for us. K.Papadopoulos would a better option than Tziolis at CDM. @Rockafeller Skank there are plenty of other options for CDM. What we are missing that player that's in between a CDM and CAM. That's called CM. We haven't got one. Kone can play there or Fortounis. Mantalos I think should play there also. Thing is its not that we don't have players for these positions, it's who is reliable and deserves to play. Kourbelis to me is very average. Taxi too slow and Tziolis even slower. Androutsos might not be ready yet. He should be in a squad role though. Mantalos has all the tools to be an 8 in my opinion

I still can't believe Skibbe ignored Fetfatzidis for all this time. If Fetfatzidis comes back to the team Skibbe will what was I thinking not calling him up. With Fetfatzidis in the team our attack instantly become more dangerous. With Pelkas and Donis also on the field at the same time we can become more dangerous. I'd like to see Mantalos or Fortounis as the 8.

I have that same feeling about Tziolis. Why would Skibbe play him in the friendlies and not be in the plans for the nations league? He played many players from the u21s against Saudi. These players good or bad should be slowly making there way in the first team. Androutsos and Galanopoulos are players who should be involved from now. Tsimikas is another one. The u21s I realised do not have a strong or aggressive midfielder as a 6 who does the dirty work. Like Zeca. Most of their midfielders are box to box midfielders. The right back position needs work aswell for the u21s. Same could be said for the men's team. Hopefully Masouras picks up form at Olympiakos. So midfield in my opinion is a huge problem leading into the nation's league. We will probably see Zeca and Samaris start together.

Did anyone see Fetfatzidis goals in the friendly? Class player. Also Manos is one to look out for and Androutsos looks the stuff hopefully he gets more game time this season.

When Bakakis played against Saudi he was beaten easily a couple of times. He probably had an off game because he played very well against Egypt.

Don't forget RB. Torosidis is ageing and Bakakis is 50/50 in defence. We need the right player next to Zeca in midfield. I prefer to play a promising player that we can give matches to and give experience to also at RB. Masouras can get a chance if he's in form at Olympiakos. Otherwise Retsos can play there.

We need to play with a midfielder that takes charge and creates for us. Like Karagounis or Zagorakis. I thought that Katidis was going to be like that until he F***ed up. Kone looked like he could do that in the world cup. We have no one that can do it now. Maybe Mantalos can. Who knows.

I don't think he's the answer. Very average player in my opinion. Our midfield is our huge problem. Our midfield always gets beaten and our defence makes up for it. We might need to go to a 3-5-2. The wing backs need to run heaps and that's also a problem because I don't think we have players with the stamina to handle that responsibility. We are lucky to have Zeca. He is the engine and never gives up.

Salpingidis, Samaras and Gekas came just after the Euro 2004 win. I sort of agree with you @georgelaz about PAO going down and producing players for their national team. I believe they have good young players in the youth and they should play their best in the senior team. Then they will start progressing as players in the top flight and can sooner rather than later become options. Emmanoulidis is very talented and only 17. Chatzigiovannis is skillful attacking threat and is 21. Pispas can progress if given more game time.

The thing is the Greek media do not like players in the mould of Fetfatzidis or Ninis. They prefer Tziolis and Tzavellas. That is why Skibbe is a yes man and we see the same old thing. He is trying to please his bosses. The Greek people have no idea about how soccer should be played if it was up to me Ninis and Fetfatzidis will be the players I choose any day of the week. They are talented.

Ninis needs to come back to Greece and start earning some form. Why not go back to Panathinaikos. I cant believe he is 28 already. He is soon to be 30 lol. I feel sorry for him but it was his doing. Back when he was in form at PAO he was very creative and scroed goals. His dribbling and passing were his highlights and his shots were dangerous. Now all those things looked toned down and is slower. Right now we have good players at number 10. We have Fortounis, Mantalos, Pelkas, Fetfatzidis, Lazaros and Bakasetas.

Yeah true. I just think we should start talking more about Fetfatzidis, now that he is back with Oly. I dont mind Pelkas on the wing aswell. I just think we get more out of him as the 10. To me Fortounis is better than Mantalos. Its just that Fortounis can be inconsistent as seen last season, although this pre season he is looking solid. Fetfa and Gianniotas are good back ups. Id like to see Donis start more often. If we can start him every game and see what he can do it wont harm us. Whether as striker or winger.

You forgot the best Greek technical player of today. Giannis Fetfatzidis! All in all not a bad line up @ausgreek. I like the idea of Fortounis playing deeper. Pelkas at his best is when he is playing behind the striker. Now is Mantalos a better player overall than Pelkas? In my opinion they are both equal with Fortounis slightly better than both. Fetfatzidis can be used a super sub. We shouldn't be forgetting Gianniotas either. With Zeca doing the work in midfield we can have Mantalos, Pelkas and Fortounis all in at the same time providing service to Mitroglou. We have got depth there at CAM.

How has Charisis been? Also Is Pelkas leaving?

Yeah 100%. Vlachodimos looks the stuff for keeper position. I do t tryst Karnezis 100%. I'd rather give the spot to Gianniotis atm. Manolas also stated something else. He said that we don't have a player in the mold of Basinas, Karagounis or Katsouranis. What he fails to realise is that a player of that type won't do well in the current style of modern football. Back then those players were useful. Not now. We need faster, athletic players in the middle. That's the way it is nowadays.

We drew against them both as well. Manolas is a big advantage for us. So is Sokratis but Manolas is a big game player for sure.

We won't get anywhere though with what we have seen. Androutsos needs to play which is understandable but what about Galanopoulos? He is played more and was one of the reasons AEK won the title. Why wasn't he given chances. Instead Tziolis is our answer who doesn't suit the modern game. It's not 2012 anymore. We need to adapt to the current style of football in order to succeed. That's all I'm saying. We haven't got the depth at CM. Kourbelis played the most I believe for any Greek in the superleague. Wasn't given chances. Tachtsidis proved to be out of form for the whole year. Samaris only played like 5 games the whole year. Tziolis plays in the middle east. These players are slow to begin with. Yet we rely on them. Unless we put players in different positions which is unpopular I've realised on these forums. We better play in form players this time around. I seriously had enough of this bullshit. We can do better, I know we can.

My new formation Karnezi Sok Man Retso Bak Siopi Zeca Tsimika Fetfa. Mitro Donis We have a 4 man midfield that can help defensively and are all fast. A front 3 that can score goals. Look at Donis against Bayern at the way he scored. Fetfatzidis can take on players and quick one touch football.

I couldn't agree more. I think we are all hoping Androutsos to be the answer. I hope was looking at the WC. Siopis would be perfect for our midfield. He is 24, hungry as hell and has the strongest work ethic I have ever seen in a Greek midfielder. That hunger is what I believe is what makes you a success. You got to want it.

All I know is if we want to get better with Skibbe, this is what he has to do: - Never call up Tziolis, Maniatis and Tzavellas ever again. - Do not call up Tachtsidis and Bakasetas for 3 months until they pick up form or if other players are not living up to it. - Bench Samaris. Do not make him a starter constantly. Time for Kourbelis, Androutsos and Galanopoulos to be given a chance. - Mantalos has to play the 10 role. Fortounis is our best but needs to be given a rest as he has not played well.