Transfers

[Kojak]

Dellas is having a tussle between Celtic and Rangers. slight interest from Premier league as well. According to BBC radio (i think radio 5).

[almamatter]

My guess is that Dellas & Seitaridis will join Giannakopoulo at Bolton.

[m_kafes]

I just read this artcle on Super - Sport Fm website

[Panathinaikos_Trifilli]

if most of these speculations are true, then PAO will go through another scramble year, where we will sell our best players, buy some cheap ones, have a really bad start to season and thus be knocked out of CL and have a really bad start in the league.

Im really fed up with the total annialation of a team just as it is stabilised to form a realistic CL club.

Please please shareholders of PAO, please do not sell your souls. The green god (fans) will give you every shread of praise

[almamatter]

I honestly don't expect Pao to get more than good foreign players this coming Summer. If you check the roster the last 2 years we have made more than 10 professionals just coming out from the academy. I think next season if we win the Chapionship this year, will be a season for many changes and the coming of many youngsters. The way things look 8 tp 10 players will leave including Basina, Kostantinou, in order to complete the cycle of letting players go ever since the Rizoupoli loss from Osfp (Strarting with: Lyberopouo, Karagouni, Kolka). Whithout a leader player like Basina, we will leave the team cripled and we shouldn't be having much expectations from Manzio and TZioli replacing them, at least for the first year. Malezani wasn't hired to make the current team good, but to make a team of his likes from scratch. Right now he mostly listens toFylakouris Opinion to save the Title for us. Anyway, the team past has shown we always win 2 Chapionships in a row for the past 20-30 years.

I think I was pretty damn close to what Sportday said. :D

[athinaios]

My question is this, does PAO ownership think that the team can ever be a euro powerhouse? I'm not asking if they would like it to be, but whether they believe it is a goal within reach.....

First, we haven't seen any coach good enough to stay several years and built a world-class team. Melitzanas (I hope) may, may be the one.

We haven't had stability within the team for years now. We suck. Last year we sucked less than the rest and we had Olizadebe at crucial games scoring....

This year we suck.... Yeah, we're first, but, honestly, we haven't shown traits of a great team. OK, lately, we've getting some good results, but that doesn't make us a great team.

Now, if you want to be a great euro team--a team that is a powerhourse and goes to the "final four" more than every 30 years--then you can't have crappy players on your team.

Then, we MUST KEEP ALL YOUR QUALITY PLAYERS, like Karagounaro, Fyssa, Kyriako.

Otherwise, you say, look, I'm good enough for Greece, I can play a good game or two in Europe, maybe have some luck and advance a bit, but I don't have the organization, the personel, don't want to spend the money to be great outside the domestic league (which sucks), so there you have it!

[Panathinaikos_Trifilli]

We can't keep expecting a new manager create a team from scratch, because he'll probably be gone in four months time anyway. A big mistake was getting rid of Itzak Schum... he was gr8... poor guy... the ego of zagec F***ed us up big time.

[m_kafes]

We can't keep expecting a new manager create a team from scratch, because he'll probably be gone in four months time anyway. A big mistake was getting rid of Itzak Schum... he was gr8... poor guy... the ego of zagec F***ed us up big time.

here we go again. I cannot believe that there are still people missing Schum!!!

[athinaios]

Please, Schum was one of the wrorst coaches, clearly unfit to lead PAO. He was a nobody, had no guts, had no vision, used crappy players (remember Zuta?), players out of position..... no eye for the game...etc

simply horrible.

PAO needs someone with knowledge, able to stand up to management, use the best players for the good of the team (not play stupid dioikisi games), and have a vision for the future to build a team.

Precisely because we don't get this kind of coaches we suck. Schum was lucky last year... all the teams sucked and he was saved by brilliant moments of individual players! I watched lots of videotape last year.... all I saw was a team with no organization, crappy football and Schum not knowing anything about modern football!

No defending Zaets either...

What Melitzanas is trying to do is to build a team. I also like his set up, use of players, and works alot on TACTICS! Hope he stays and he's let to build for the future with players HE likes (not because any Zaets is making money on transfers).

PS>don't point out to the 2 games last season when PAO played good football.... 2 out of 75 is the exception to the rule!

[drakos13]

here we go again. I cannot believe that there are still people missing Schum!!!

Soum was no legend but we did go a goal away from undefeated in greece last season.....impressive.

i dont miss him now but there is no doubt he is way more intelligent about the game than ZDENEK SKAT0ZNY

[Panathinaikos_Trifilli]

are you a little spasticated or something athinaios??? are u forgetting schum delivered our first two trophies in over 7 years??? and he was 'one of the worst coaches'???

all im saying is that a manager at pao cannot start a team from scratch cos he'll be fired within half a year, all he can do is make do with the players he has... sorry pao fans, but thats the way it is

[m_kafes]

I do not understand the points you are trying to make guys.

Ok we got a couple of titles, but how did we do in Europe?

We are always gonna be contending for the title in Greece (sometimes we will get them, sometimes we are gonna come second) so what. WE NEED TO DO BETTER IN EUROPE (as we always did) and clearly Schum was not gonna give us any success there.

I think getting rid of schum was the right thing to do (its the timing that really sucked)

[athinaios]

m kafes is absolutely right! PAO is one of the top 2-3 teams in Greece so we got one last year... PanTrifilli if you think we got it because of Schum you're mistaken....I think it was DESPITE Scum.. It'd come sooner or later.... just because all the others sucked more than we did....

Again, we got it not because of any grand strategy by Scum, but by individual brilliant play---the right thing at the right time. Anyone who watched last season's games and knows football could see what HALIA we had on the pitch!

And, Kafes is making another good point: if you're bad, it shows in Euro play! End of story.

[almamatter]

I don't know, but in my opinion Schoum was a very good coach. There was deciplent in the team and he did extremnly well in the derbies. I think that we did very bad in Europe that year because at that time nobody really cared about Europe. Having won nothing in seven years. the pressure was very high and the guy had to deliver the goods with a team that just had lost Lyberopoulo, Karagouni, Kolka and had Olisadebe only to play in the 3 last key games. Not to mention that Zaets obviusly had told him to leave out of the first 11 Hengrisen because he wanted to give more time to Gouma and Morris next to Kyriako. (If you remeber the game against Aithoven we lost in the 84th minute after Scoum put in Morris as a thir defenter next to Kyriako Gouma. Simply imagine if he had chosen Hegrisen. Would there be a chanse in a million to consive a goal with 3 defenders including Hegrisen?)

-In my opinion with Schoum as a coach Pao would have won the title by 20 points from the second by now.

The possitive is that Malezani gives us hope for some good soccer while with Scoum the games were boring. But will Malezani do good in Europe?

In my opinion I honestly doupt that he will do any better than Schoum did.

Remember that Malezani after he saw the first game with Sevilia and Pao with Filakouri as a Coach he said "I don't understand why Pao does need a new coach. Pao looks like a very good side to me already".

It is like saying. What the more you Greeks want from your teams ?

It is true that Italians think Greek soccer sucks and that when Malezani did win the Uefa cup had some Superstrs in the lineup like Crespo and Veron.

So time will tell for Malezani as well...

[adonis]

First, we haven't seen any coach good enough to stay several years and built a world-class team. Melitzanas (I hope) may, may be the one.

We haven't had stability within the team for years now. We suck. Last year we sucked less than the rest and we had Olizadebe at crucial games scoring....

This year we suck.... Yeah, we're first, but, honestly, we haven't shown traits of a great team. OK, lately, we've getting some good results, but that doesn't make us a great team.

For starters - we have changed coach three times this season and were still first. Wat does that tell you about us as a team/club and wat does that tell you about the rest of the league - when second AEK was in debt almost out of the league and now there contenders and havent had a change in coach.

This topic has brought out the true PA fans and there one great quality that everyone (including myself) has in common. And this goes for every greek fan not just PAO. were the biggest fickle supporters ever - we want this and we want that and were never never happy

We can't keep expecting a new manager create a team from scratch, because he'll probably be gone in four months time anyway. A big mistake was getting rid of Itzak Schum... he was gr8... poor guy... the ego of zagec F***ed us up big time.

you know wat ur right - UNFORTUNATELY - bc i would like Malezani to build a new team from scratch - and i dun wanna judge a coach on his first few results as a coach at a new club - but having said so Malezanis only defeat so far was at Seville in his second (??) maybe third game in charge and we conceded goals only after a red card

and you know wat else - what do u and everyone else expect if we all start calling for the coaches head after 4 months like u say bc were not happy. when u have these so-called glorified "Journalists" that work at so called papers like HXO and derby, that print front page papers that want the coaches head on a silver platter anything else isnt good enough - otherwise if you dont deliver its not good enough and we just wont stand for it

in my opinion i hated shoum - i thought he was one of the worst coaches - and you know wat he was really gutless (it showed against Auxerre) and yes he didnt lose a derby but how good competition were our rivals last yr

and than you talk about been a EURO powerhouse - a EURO POWERHOUSE - are you dreaming - were no porto and were no liverpool or psv - but yes we can be - we have the ability to be a team like those ones but even our attitude the fans would help a long way to reaching that goal - letting players like basinas and mihalis isnt the worst thing that could happen to us - just look at all the young players coming in - tziolis and mantzios were signed a month or two ago - isnt that telling you of the clubs investment in to the future - and we are the top two in greece - im not saying top three - and we did well in europe this year and who knows wat would have happened in seville if we had finished the game with 11 players - anyways

im just really pissed off with the criticism the club in this topic has received - btw how many foreigners you want the club to sign - we are a greek team in the end - i want to see greeks playing as well - we cant always buy foreigners and always keep the best players we have - its called the food chain - teams at the top take their pick and if the players wanna leave than so be it - as for karagounis liek everyone says - he signed for inter way before the Rizopoulis game!!!!!

[XXX-18T]

All i have to say is our past coaches were jokes

I dont care if we won derby's / cups with one joker they were both lucky to even step foot into a team like Pao

This is where Vardi got serious and got us a worthy coach

I have great faith in Melizani i think he will be Pao's version of Otto :nw:

Both by the way he has bonded with the players and the way his tactics are u can tell his quality

I think he will take us far into Europe next year (if we make it)

I have great faith in him and i reckon our teams confidence will grow and grow and be ready for next year :box:

[HOLLYWOOD]

i like the idea that pao r lookin to the future with players like tziolis and mantzios....

we need to rebuild the team around our core players (gonzalez, basinas, kostantinou, pap, gekas) with young greek talent....

whats happeneing with iraklis left winger Lagos??? r we getting him??

his got hot prospect written al over him....

[Panathinaikos_Trifilli]

I do not understand the points you are trying to make guys.

Ok we got a couple of titles, but how did we do in Europe?

We are always gonna be contending for the title in Greece (sometimes we will get them, sometimes we are gonna come second) so what. WE NEED TO DO BETTER IN EUROPE (as we always did) and clearly Schum was not gonna give us any success there.

I think getting rid of schum was the right thing to do (its the timing that really sucked)

You give a guy a job and expect him to win the treble in one season flat...

The reason he didnt do well in europe is cos he was thrown in it just b4 it started

I'm not critising the manager or the club, all im saying is that if u expect a manager to go into his first season and give pao fans something to remember then ur kidding urselves.

Nothing is ever good for us greeks, we go on a run of three bad matches and the manager will be out. Pao needs stability, and its the fans who take it away.

US!!! THE FANS!!! WHO WILL DESTROY THE FUTURE OF OUR CLUB!!!

patience is a virtue

[drakos13]

I do not understand the points you are trying to make guys.

Ok we got a couple of titles, but how did we do in Europe?

We are always gonna be contending for the title in Greece (sometimes we will get them, sometimes we are gonna come second) so what. WE NEED TO DO BETTER IN EUROPE (as we always did) and clearly Schum was not gonna give us any success there.

I think getting rid of schum was the right thing to do (its the timing that really sucked)

how can u even count Shums european performances man?

it was the begining of the year....he was still adjusting, and lets not forget that our new signings werent that great at all, and we had heavy injuries. also looking at the teams in our group....

Manchester? ok i think theyre worthless we should have at least tied them in leoforos but the first game they were playing well and we were too disoriented and injured...not to mention we had the Kota in goal playing one of his 'great' games... :tdown:

Stuttgart- people only think of big names in european success.....Stuttgart was/is a fantastic team and was WAY above the level of PAO last year. They were fast, young, on the rise this team was great and forget it......and we still managed to dominate them in leoforo getting thousands of chances but just no luck......then bad luck.... it happens. Auxerre were also a good team......he didnt get a proper chance- his side was just cleaned out from last season and europe wasnt even a focus for last year. our #1 was the prota8lhma all season because it was about time we got one and end the red reign.

[m_kafes]

I do not understand the points you are trying to make guys.

Ok we got a couple of titles, but how did we do in Europe?

We are always gonna be contending for the title in Greece (sometimes we will get them, sometimes we are gonna come second) so what. WE NEED TO DO BETTER IN EUROPE (as we always did) and clearly Schum was not gonna give us any success there.

I think getting rid of schum was the right thing to do (its the timing that really sucked)

how can u even count Shums european performances man?

it was the begining of the year....he was still adjusting, and lets not forget that our new signings werent that great at all, and we had heavy injuries. also looking at the teams in our group....

Manchester? ok i think theyre worthless we should have at least tied them in leoforos but the first game they were playing well and we were too disoriented and injured...not to mention we had the Kota in goal playing one of his 'great' games... :tdown:

Stuttgart- people only think of big names in european success.....Stuttgart was/is a fantastic team and was WAY above the level of PAO last year. They were fast, young, on the rise this team was great and forget it......and we still managed to dominate them in leoforo getting thousands of chances but just no luck......then bad luck.... it happens. Auxerre were also a good team......he didnt get a proper chance- his side was just cleaned out from last season and europe wasnt even a focus for last year. our #1 was the prota8lhma all season because it was about time we got one and end the red reign.

You know what excuses are like assholes (everybody has got one) I do not agree that the teams Schum faced were that superior.

I remind you that we have done much better against Manchester in Old Traford in a similar situation (we were only chasing the championship)

Was Stutgart any better than PSV (were they younger or faster) Well NO.

This is very simple why don't you try to get it. THE GUY HAD NO CLUE OF WHAT WAS EXPECTED OF HIM IN A EUROPEAN MATCH. The strength of the teams we faced had nothing to do (we have faced far better sides with a lot of success)

The problem with Schum was that he had no ability of developing the team. This is why we always saw the same thing. Malezni has shown that he teach football rather than sit on the bench and stare at the players.

Doesn't ANYONE remember How many times we have said that SCHUM was sleeping at the bench? TRy to visit the post with the player ratings if you don't remember.

[adonis]

QUOTE (drakos13 @ May 8 2005, 06:35 AM)

QUOTE (m_kafes @ May 7 2005, 06:57 PM)

I do not understand the points you are trying to make guys.

Ok we got a couple of titles, but how did we do in Europe?

We are always gonna be contending for the title in Greece (sometimes we will get them, sometimes we are gonna come second) so what. WE NEED TO DO BETTER IN EUROPE (as we always did) and clearly Schum was not gonna give us any success there.

I think getting rid of schum was the right thing to do (its the timing that really sucked) 

how can u even count Shums european performances man?

it was the begining of the year....he was still adjusting, and lets not forget that our new signings werent that great at all, and we had heavy injuries. also looking at the teams in our group....

Manchester? ok i think theyre worthless we should have at least tied them in leoforos but the first game they were playing well and we were too disoriented and injured...not to mention we had the Kota in goal playing one of his 'great' games... 

Stuttgart- people only think of big names in european success.....Stuttgart was/is a fantastic team and was WAY above the level of PAO last year. They were fast, young, on the rise this team was great and forget it......and we still managed to dominate them in leoforo getting thousands of chances but just no luck......then bad luck.... it happens. Auxerre were also a good team......he didnt get a proper chance- his side was just cleaned out from last season and europe wasnt even a focus for last year. our #1 was the prota8lhma all season because it was about time we got one and end the red reign. 

You know what excuses are like assholes (everybody has got one) I do not agree that the teams Schum faced were that superior.

I remind you that we have done much better against Manchester in Old Traford in a similar situation (we were only chasing the championship)

Was Stutgart any better than PSV (were they younger or faster) Well NO.

This is very simple why don't you try to get it. THE GUY HAD NO CLUE OF WHAT WAS EXPECTED OF HIM IN A EUROPEAN MATCH. The strength of the teams we faced had nothing to do (we have faced far better sides with a lot of success)

The problem with Schum was that he had no ability of developing the team. This is why we always saw the same thing. Malezni has shown that he teach football rather than sit on the bench and stare at the players.

Doesn't ANYONE remember How many times we have said that SCHUM was sleeping at the bench? TRy to visit the post with the player ratings if you don't remember.

I too think that PSV is a better team than Stuttgart - they beat milan 3-1 and almost had a foot in the final.

And we beat them 4-1

and why is stuttgart a level higher than PAO - why cant we beat them and why cant we be feared like we fear them - come on that 3-1 in leoforos was disgraceful regardless of wat our number one priority was

schum not only had no idea about developing the team (his main tactic was papadopoulos in the first half of the season - than super sub manoli) but he was a KOTA and he proved it with the most stupidest tactics 3-6-1 in leoforos! and than even in his interview after he left pao he said the PSV players were at a higher level than at PAO! great belief he had in the team!

[almamatter]

I really don't get it. I see that most of you believe that it was Schoum's falt we did bad in Europe or that we lost to Auxere. I think all of you forget the presure that the team had to undergo to win the title after 7 years. The game against Auxere was not a priority. THE TITLE WAS.

Regarding our group in the Chapoins League then you shouldn't forget Manchester United is a MUCH BETTER TEAM.Stutgatrd was a very good side that if we had faced the previus year we would have probably done better against them. As for the Rangers we did what we could to get a 3 place against them.

You all blame Schoum when you forget the bad signings that Zaets did for him and with Seitaridis gone having Vintra to cover up with no experience at the time. Half of them left by Christmass...

By the way I think Mallezani is a good coach with great experiense in Italy but he gives way to much attention in 2 things Offence with 3 forwards and defense with 3 central defenders. You know after all this might be the system Pao needed after all this year. We all have to wait and see, but we shouldn't curse on a Coach that brought our 6th dubble in our history of almost 100 years.

I mean come on.

-By the way Aithoven this year was way better than us and only loosing 1-0 should be acceptable.

[Panathinaikos_Trifilli]

^ exactly, what else did u lot want Schum to do? Win the CL???

[drakos13]

Was Stutgart any better than PSV (were they younger or faster) Well NO.

stuttgart were close to being just as good....trust me. they dominated chelsea last year and hit the post about a million times home and away to lose 1-0 to a complete accident own goal.....they are a great team.

why compare the 2?

honestly we beat PSV when they were already through.

When they wanted to play against us we got 2 shots all game and they had about a million to get lucky and one bounced in. Of course everyone blames Soum for this, ignoring the fact we dont have wing players to handle those two Koreans.....not many teams do. Soum made some errors but to get dominated like that its not really a massive coaching flaw being entirely his fault. PSV are probably the fittest and fastest team in europe right now. also lets not forget this year we have Eki...Soum didnt get Eki in europe....

[HOLLYWOOD]

nice convo but remember this is a transfer topic!!!

is Lagos comming???