MadBoy13 Posted January 17, 2007 Share Posted January 17, 2007 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NikosVazelas Posted January 17, 2007 Author Share Posted January 17, 2007 handball by miecel on paoks 1st goal. offside on torghelle on paoks 2nd goal. great pass by tsigkas on mantzios' goal. flurry of pao chances in the 2nd half. tziolis missed a penalty type oppurtunity. back to back to back saves by fernandez at the very end. shoulda been 0-1 but instead it was 2-1. thats ok. 1-0 at OAKA will be enough. pao's second half was way better then paoks first. paok had the two ''goals'' and one more oppurtunity. pao had the goal and three tete a tetes. and Ninis played very well was composed and looked like a seasoned veteran. nothing but good things to take from this game. Sure our D looked shaky. but with seric goumas and darlas out, we didnt fair all that bad. excellent 2nd half after a 1st half where pao gave up 3 chances.. goals included. then again, goals shouldnt have counted but pao needs some incentive going into OAKA. by the way ball possesion in the 2nd half was 72 28 in favor of pao. later skaters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyberfish Posted January 17, 2007 Share Posted January 17, 2007 I came back from work in time to watch the last 20 minutes. It did not look too bad for us in this period, although out of total twenty minutes, less than five minutes of football was played. 2-1 was not that bad of a result in Touba, but i hope of three points in the Superleague in a few weeks. I saw the goals on video and on the second goal it was funny to see the assistant ref trailing the play by at least 3 meters (it was of-course offsides). Leontiou seemde like he played very well from what I saw, but both goals came from his side. Maybe Ivanschitz was not supporting? I also watched how Mietsel tried to intimidate (pasrwsei) Ninis after he fouled him really hard. Everyone seemed to rally around Ninis and that was good. The kid will toughen-up really fast. The big surprise for me was that Konstantinidis scored :blink: He tried his heart out when he played with us but he could not score to save his life. The thing that was not a surprise, was that Torghelle (last year's PAO fans' hero) did not score yet again :P The Kypelo Elladas is now on ERTworld with the best plays so maybe I can see a little more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NikosVazelas Posted January 17, 2007 Author Share Posted January 17, 2007 mantzios, tziolis, ninis, tsigkas had GREAT games. 8.5/10 7- Romero once put on the LEFT side, as i have said before is his better side, looked ALOT better. 9-Morris was the man of the match. he was forced to play both CB positions in the first half with biscans lack of speed.he made great tackles all game long and is NO DOUBT the best defender in greece. Salpi got clobbered by Theo and was injured. 6-Victor came in but the ball was played on the right and was a non factor. i would try Ivan on the left and Ninis on the right. 6.5-Bovio was decent on set pieces and made a few good tackles on defensive duty. 7-Leontiou was weak on both goals but i must say that they both shouldnt have counted. he was beaten on an OFFISIDE and was deaked by a handball. otherwise, he was solid. 4-Vyntra had horrible crosses and one missed shot. ninis made him look a little better in the 2nd half and mantzios saved him, yes MANTZIOS, by coming back on D on a rush around the 75th. 5.5-Biscan showed how slow he is but we must remember he is NOT playin his position. seeing as we have tziolis, bovio and even leontiou who can play DM, he needs to go. We need to replace Vyntra, YES IM SAYING IT AGAIN. with a solid Right Back, im sure our middle defenders will look a lot better. Honestly. Goumas isnt bad enough to warrant chasing. but with a RB of quality, the whole D will look better. thats all for now.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NikosVazelas Posted January 17, 2007 Author Share Posted January 17, 2007 just to add something. Recently, and by recently i mean the past year or so, i have watched a good number of pao games at a local bar with a friend of mine who is from france. he knew of pao when i told him i was greek and knew vaguely of olympiakos. to sum up his thoughts, more or less of the last year: Morris is a great player and he would take anytime on his team. By the way he supports Bordeaux. he thinks Mantzios looks like a prototypical striker. although i must say he did watch the game last year at OAKA with Werder Bremen when he scored the 2-0 goal and of course todays game. he says that greek soccer is all about set plays and very little about ball possesion. according to him. the refereeing is way too leniant on yellow card situations and that makes the game very aggressive and can cause for slow play and bad pace. he cant believe how many blundered calls the linesmen make, not only in todays game, but overall. apparently in france when a linesman isnt sure, he calls the play offside. He is dumbfounded by the fact that a team like pao has a player like vyntra on their team for longer then 2 weeks. imagine that. 2 weeks.. not 2 years.!!!! finally he cant believe that olympiakos have been champions for 9 out of 10 years having watched more then 20 league games and many champions league games. and just today, he said that ninis is one of the most promising players he has seen under the age of 17 in a long time. Not that he is a football expert, but its funny to see what foreigners think of our soccer. thats it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NikosVazelas Posted January 17, 2007 Author Share Posted January 17, 2007 apparently it shoulda been 3-0 for gianenna with a missed penalty on osfp. INTERESTING. 3-0 woulda been quite difficult to overcome. HMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyberfish Posted January 17, 2007 Share Posted January 17, 2007 Yeah, I saw that, and I liked Karoulias' question to Varouhas: What is the ref thinking when he sees the infraction from 3 meters away?" :whistle: Gitas had a great shot on the crossbar too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NikosVazelas Posted January 17, 2007 Author Share Posted January 17, 2007 ill tell u what he was thinking. he was thinking.. '' Crap, i cant call this. if i call this maybe kokkalis will stop funding my sons college fund and therefore force him to become a bad ref, just like his dad.'' seem about right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyberfish Posted January 17, 2007 Share Posted January 17, 2007 :LOL: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NikosVazelas Posted January 17, 2007 Author Share Posted January 17, 2007 looks like i was right.. both paok goals shouldnt have counted. tsk tsk.. its ok.. by the way there were reports of pao's van gettin attacked after the game. also there were reports of the ref and linesmen of the toumba game spotted outside of a bank carrying two large suitcases. nothing has been confirmed.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyberfish Posted January 17, 2007 Share Posted January 17, 2007 I am watching Karoulias talk and it never ceases to amaze me how articulate he is for a guy who was an absolute brute on the pitch. He just criticized the idea of spending a lot of money for an DM. He said that if you spend money on a star player you should invest it for a position that can change a match with one or two moves. It's a good point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NikosVazelas Posted January 17, 2007 Author Share Posted January 17, 2007 exactly... like a CF. or a CB or a referee.... :whistle: B) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyberfish Posted January 17, 2007 Share Posted January 17, 2007 I take my earlier comment back, the second Paok goal was not offside. I watched it frame by frame and Morris covers Mietsel. I was also wrong about the assistant ref. He only trails the play by two meters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NikosVazelas Posted January 17, 2007 Author Share Posted January 17, 2007 its not miecel that was offside.. it was the initial pass to torghelle. even bloody varouhas said it.. but he was only 4 or 5 feet offside.. so its ok Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve07 Posted January 17, 2007 Share Posted January 17, 2007 Ya it was Tourghelle who was offside. But oh well can't change it now lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyberfish Posted January 17, 2007 Share Posted January 17, 2007 From the camera angle, I freeze it and it looks like both Biscan and Vintra cover Torghelle on the first pass. Biscan does a little hop forward for the trap after the ball is played, but he is too late and that caused him to trail the play. Without the hop, he would be first to the ball. Oh, well. I woke up this morning, made coffee, read the possible lineups and when I saw Biscan in I said to myself "Mietsel will score today". Not that I am clairvoyant but Biscan has become predictable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyberfish Posted January 17, 2007 Share Posted January 17, 2007 its not miecel that was offside.. it was the initial pass to torghelle. even bloody varouhas said it.. but he was only 4 or 5 feet offside.. so its ok Oh, yeah, Varouhas.... :P The guy is not only blind, he is perceptually challenged on top of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NikosVazelas Posted January 17, 2007 Author Share Posted January 17, 2007 tell u what.. take a ruler, and draw a parralel line with midfield and you will see.. at least 4 feet. but hey.. doesnt take away the goal.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyberfish Posted January 17, 2007 Share Posted January 17, 2007 If you recorded the game, watch how Biscan jumps for the trap, then runs to catch up, but all of the sudden he slows down when the cross is made. It looks like he would be the first to the ball but he didn't even try. You are right, it does not take away the goal. Let's hope we tighten up our defense soon, plays like this happen every game. Sometimes they are offsides, sometimes they are not called, and sometimes a striker is just onside. Our defense should be quick enough to spring back into shape. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
athinaios Posted January 17, 2007 Share Posted January 17, 2007 Well, I'd rather take this result (so PAOK can be happy they beat us) and do well this Sunday against Xanthi (away) and beat Paok (away) for the league game. No matter what (I know too many of our players not available) our defense is NOT good. When PAO did very well in the past it was because the defense was rock solid! The recipe for success hasn't changed. Who was #24? In the first scoring, he's watching the Paok player take the ball, turn around and shoot, whithout #24 attempting to block the shot or harrass the opponent. Elementary. Does this away goal count more if we win 1-0 in Athens? And, Tsigas gave a fantastic cross to Mantzios who scored a great goal... [if this cross was by Eki we'd be reading about the GODzales effect, etc, etc...] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NikosVazelas Posted January 17, 2007 Author Share Posted January 17, 2007 true.. but in this case he was offside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pao123 Posted January 18, 2007 Share Posted January 18, 2007 after rewatching the game i saw all the goals and paid very close attention..the first was a clear handball..i dont understand how miecel did not get called for it ..his hands were up and the ball clearly hit it to make the pass back to torgelle before the fasi got worst..standard call, should have been whistled..but, our players were too concerned with the handball instead of keeping position..if we were keeping our positions instead of turning our heads toward the referee, miecel would not have been able to slide the ball back to torgelle before he jetted down the line to make the cross..the second goal too was clearly offsides...what ticks me off the most was the fact that the linesman was not in the proper position for the play..this shows that these refs are simply unqualified..regardless, torgelle was about..i would say, 2 or 3 full yards offside..it happend quick, and the advantage is suppose to go to the attacking player but he was clearly offisde and the ref was not in the right position to get the correct look at it...but we got caught and instead of vyntra sticking goal side with miecel, he let him sneak in behind him and with little effort...i feel bad for ebede because it seemed like he had miecels shot covered, but it redirectied off of his knee instead of a clean hit and he got caught moving in the wrng direction...vyntras defending is unexusable though..that is just simple positioning that vyntra lacks.. WE CANNOT BLAME THE REFS THOUGH..i agree their mistakes changed the face of the match but we still played a very poor first half and our defense was very unstable...i was happy to see us holding possesion and playing much b etter as the second half wore on..i thought we would equalize but we didnt and now back to athens we go..but lets stop talking about the refs, we know they are awful and this is another example but we have known that for years and years and chances are it wont get too much better in the near futurre..we just have to play our game for the full 90 instead of 30 minutes...if we played the whole game with the urgency but attention that our team had in the latter part of the match, we would have scored 4 or 5 goals...our attack is good, very good and very adaptable, but our defense is lacking greatly...our starting 11 looks like two differn squads...we put alot of attention and focus on our attack and now that we have a quality attacking force, we are very much acking in defense... i noticed someone posted about second half possesion and that is important but it means nothing if our defense has as many holes as it does... i do hate labeling our defense though because i hate to include morris in the bunch..he is a wonerful footballer to watch, i enjoy his play very much and am very glad to have him in our defense..now all we need to do is put QUALIFIED PLAYERS AROUND HIM.. sorry for the length but i have another point...i belive we can be a great team..and i am saying this seriously...if we bulk up our defense alittle i think we can become a very good team..we have alot f quality in the team and the players at times play great football..now i just want to see great football for 90 minute sand not just 30-45 but i belive we are capable of it...have faith in munoz, from the time he has been here i have noticed that the man knows exactly what hes doing..have alitle patience...he hasnt even been here for a year and i see glimpses of what the team is capable of if we hold on to him.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyberfish Posted January 18, 2007 Share Posted January 18, 2007 Very good post pao123, I was thinking the same thing about Morris and the rest of our defense. I would like to add that having competent defenders is one step. Good defensive behavior is really the responsibility of the whole team. The whole team must recoil when we lose the ball and everyone responsible must hustle and get themselves behind the ball. I think we suffer from both low defensive talent, and defensive behavior. Who was #24? In the first scoring, he's watching the Paok player take the ball, turn around and shoot, whithout #24 attempting to block the shot or harrass the opponent. Elementary. Athinaie, you can buy a vowel ---> "V" :whistle: Nikovalela: Ok, I only have one view of the play and it's from behind so I 'll go with your assessment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NikosVazelas Posted January 18, 2007 Author Share Posted January 18, 2007 nikovalela? ive never been called THAT B4. id like to buy a ''Y'' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyberfish Posted January 18, 2007 Share Posted January 18, 2007 nikovalela? ive never been called THAT B4. id like to buy a ''Y'' "Nikovazela" einai h klhtikh tou "Nikosvazelas" an 8ymamai kala thn Ellhnikh grammatikh B) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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