January 2010 Transfers

[Euro2004]

I guess you're right about money Cyber, but it's not always the case. Kaka turned down the big bucks of Man City. Closer to home, Saviola has consistently rejected big money from Greece. Sometimes other factors play a part.

Tavlaridis would be a good signing for someone like Kavala, possibly even AEK simply because they're terrible at the back at the moment. Definitely not PAO or Oly level anymore. He's become slow and clumsy. Apparently he has offers from Greece, Turkey and England.

[NikosVazelas]

WOW I agree with Everythign Euro just said... awesome ..

Tavlaridis is a joke. Hiding in the french league at sub par teams doesnt make you a good defender.

Senderos Signed for everton on a 6 month loan... with an option to buy for 5.5 GBP

[pao123]

i know this doesnt belong here but no one really ever goes to any other part of the forum :1eye: so ill post it here..

http://www.sport.gr/default.asp?pid=69&vid=27901

these are the highlights of the asteras-panionio game..at the end estoyanof commits an awful foul on fytanidis (who by the way a year or two ago was rumoured to sign with pao) in the last couple seconds it shows fytanidis getting kicked in the face by the ref as he is on the ground..i laughed my ass off when i saw it..just thought you all would enjoy a laugh too (not that players getting injured is funny, just the kick :) )

[pao123]

and as for transfers...if we offered senderos a very good deal we could have signed him..if we threw the money down, we could have gotten him no problem..though the premiership is far superior to the super league, pao is a much bigger club than everton..

[cyberfish]

ha ha that's bad luck. Getting axed by one player and kicked in the face by the ref :LOL:

But, man this was a horrible play by Estojanof. Did he get ejected? It's textbook ejection for sure. He could take his lower leg off the way he lounged like a trireme with his cleats.

[PAO_OR_DEATH]

haha what a funny ref

terible play all round there, it must be so demoralising being kicked in the face by the ref when your liyinh on the ground injured hahahaha.

[drakos13]

WOW I agree with Everythign Euro just said... awesome ..

Tavlaridis is a joke. Hiding in the french league at sub par teams doesnt make you a good defender.

See "Cedric Kante" :LOL:

Tavlaridis isnt that bad. Havent seen him in a while. He'd be an upgrade though not much of one. I can see him at a Panionios level club.

[cyberfish]

Well, given that we've pulled ahead by 8 points I can see us not signing a CB now. We'll probably suffer against Roma even if we do get someone now since there will be very little time to gell with the team.

Maybe it's best we wait till summer when we can spend 3-4m Euro and when the market is full of players. Besides, the team seems to be doing well in protecting our defense. One player doesn't always make that huge of a difference. Look at Olympiakos with the best CB in Greece ;)

[Euro2004]

Well, given that we've pulled ahead by 8 points I can see us not signing a CB now. We'll probably suffer against Roma even if we do get someone now since there will be very little time to gell with the team.

Maybe it's best we wait till summer when we can spend 3-4m Euro and when the market is full of players. Besides, the team seems to be doing well in protecting our defense. One player doesn't always make that huge of a difference. Look at Olympiakos with the best CB in Greece ;)

Generally I'd agree with you, particularly now that Senderos has gone to Everton and Strachan won't let Pogatetz go I can't see where a great opportunity would arise from, and I'd hate to see a panic buy. A loan deal would be good though.

Let's remember that this is a world cup year however, so players won't want to sign anywhere til after the world cup. Even then they'll want a long drawn out process to see if they can get any last minute big moves. So we could end up with another Engelaar saga and that would be a nightmare.

[pao123]

http://www.sentragoal.gr/article.asp?catid...2&pubid=7028103

got to love that workrate

[NYPAO13]

Roma will probably bitch slap this group of defenders

[pao123]

http://www.sportdog.gr/v3/article.aspx?id=121198

good move in my opinion...

[cyberfish]

I was a huge fan of Mattos in his first season but I was very disappointed the way he played his second one. He looked so stiff, it took him three touches to bring the ball under control, and for a DM who's main job is to push the team forward fast that's fatal. If he can play like his first season he would be welcome, if Mattos come back to play (and complain) like his second one it won't be a good move. Hopefully his second season was just a fluke.

Also in the news today: http://www.prasinanea.gr/html/ent/614/ent.11614.asp we are looking for a CB while Milan and Juventus are "seriously considering" our loaned stud David :rolleyes: I would not mind him coming back, but I don't think he is the CB we all have in mind for a starter.

He could be a good fourth option behind a new "real" CB, Vintra, and Kante, and that would be a less than exciting CB corp. I am not sure if we'll keep Bjarsmyr and no one is talking about Sariegi renewing his contract that expires this summer, so I guess he will depart (personally, I'd rather have Sariegi at that depth spot).

[Euro2004]

I'm a big fan of Simao and the return of Mattos will affect his development so I'm not sure about it.

The Greek sports paper "H Gata" today claimed that Pateras really wants to continue in his role (we all know that) but he's said that if the other shareholders allow him to do so he'll inject 20m euros in transfers over the summer.

[pao123]

http://www.sport.gr/default.asp?pid=4&aid=57398

tziolis gone

http://www.sportdog.gr/v3/article.aspx?id=121264

vyntra might go in the summer

http://www.sportdog.gr/v3/article.aspx?id=121223

another young gun

[drakos13]

We don't have the room for Mattos, we just had to offload Tziolis for being the extra DM.

Although his situation could depend on Gilberto/fitness and weather he will stay or not a 3rd season.

I think bringing back David could be a smart thing. I've heard hes doing pretty well on loan. Seeing as were not signing anybody we may as well bring the guy back if hes showing promise.

Tziolis to Chievo sounds good for club and player and even e8niki. Hope he gets regular time and form because Otto will likley pick him in the squad.

[pao123]

david is just about to get an italian passport too

[Euro2004]

We don't have the room for Mattos, we just had to offload Tziolis for being the extra DM.

Although his situation could depend on Gilberto/fitness and weather he will stay or not a 3rd season.

I think bringing back David could be a smart thing. I've heard hes doing pretty well on loan. Seeing as were not signing anybody we may as well bring the guy back if hes showing promise.

Tziolis to Chievo sounds good for club and player and even e8niki. Hope he gets regular time and form because Otto will likley pick him in the squad.

I agree about Mattos and David. Chievo is also a good move for Tziolis, but it's a nightmare for the e8niki. He is an abysmal player and has no place in the Greek team, by playing in Italy he'll be an automatic call up, whereas if he's gone to PAS or Atromitos or something he'd have stayed away.

[drakos13]

Ok Tziolis is definitly overcriticisized

He sucked in his first two years here I couldnt stand the guy but he definitly improved the last 2 seasons, and is definitley, unquestionably on eof the better Greek DMs and far from abysmal if you got to see him play with Bremen he was actually quite solid.

He's the most (easily) over scrutinized player in Greek football.

Personally, I think he did really well when he was called up to protect our 1-0 lead in Ukraine, and of what he did at PAO last year he was solid, and with Werder Bremen too.

For the ethniki he plays so-so, but then again so does the ethniki.

PAO management wants to get rid of him for not being as good as Gilberto, Katsouranis, Simao, and Mattos. --- essentially 4 of the 5 best DM's in the Greek league has to offer. Can't blame PAO or Tziolis there.

& Get serious theres no way he was going to end up at Atromitos man.

Chievo could help him develop and get his form- and you're quite aware Rehagel would be calling him up regardless if he was still on the bench at PAO.

Greece doesn't have many DM's to pick from. Any manager with half a brain has no choice but to take the guy. He's more experienced, available, and talented than the bulk of Greek eligible DMs.

Who else is there after Kats and Toro?

Pliatsikas - Yes, but he won't make the WC because of injury

Makos- I like the guy but he's behind Tziolis thats for sure.

Giannis Papadopoulos???? No.

Fotakis? No

Basinas? Retired. And if Tziolis finds his form and fitness I'd rather have him than an aging and not-playing Basinas, who is simply not reliable anymore and the last couple years been pretty crap at the national level.

So yes, this move IS good for the ethniki. Playing time, a top league? Thats exactly what we need for the Tziolis, and unless Gilberto gets Greek Citizenship, then weve got no choice but to settle for him anyways.

[Euro2004]

Ok Tziolis is definitly overcriticisized

He sucked in his first two years here I couldnt stand the guy but he definitly improved the last 2 seasons, and is definitley, unquestionably on eof the better Greek DMs and far from abysmal if you got to see him play with Bremen he was actually quite solid.

He's the most (easily) over scrutinized player in Greek football.

Personally, I think he did really well when he was called up to protect our 1-0 lead in Ukraine, and of what he did at PAO last year he was solid, and with Werder Bremen too.

For the ethniki he plays so-so, but then again so does the ethniki.

PAO management wants to get rid of him for not being as good as Gilberto, Katsouranis, Simao, and Mattos. --- essentially 4 of the 5 best DM's in the Greek league has to offer. Can't blame PAO or Tziolis there.

& Get serious theres no way he was going to end up at Atromitos man.

Chievo could help him develop and get his form- and you're quite aware Rehagel would be calling him up regardless if he was still on the bench at PAO.

Greece doesn't have many DM's to pick from. Any manager with half a brain has no choice but to take the guy. He's more experienced, available, and talented than the bulk of Greek eligible DMs.

Who else is there after Kats and Toro?

Pliatsikas - Yes, but he won't make the WC because of injury

Makos- I like the guy but he's behind Tziolis thats for sure.

Giannis Papadopoulos???? No.

Fotakis? No

Basinas? Retired. And if Tziolis finds his form and fitness I'd rather have him than an aging and not-playing Basinas, who is simply not reliable anymore and the last couple years been pretty crap at the national level.

So yes, this move IS good for the ethniki. Playing time, a top league? Thats exactly what we need for the Tziolis, and unless Gilberto gets Greek Citizenship, then weve got no choice but to settle for him anyways.

I'd only seen Tziolis play a few times at Werder and on all of the he wass anonymous. That's not to judge a player on his time at Werder but a German guy has just come to work at the office i work at. He said that Tziolis became a bit of a joke among German fans. If Tziolis could make it as a pro then so could they, he joked. They love Gekas and rate Lybe and Amantidis too but they consider Tziolis to be a division 2 player in Germany. He wasn't even saying it tongue in cheek, he was being totally honest. So based on my knowledge of him from PAO and the ethniki and on what this guy says I'm sticking by my guns. He's terrible. If he was half decent for Werder they'd have kept him.

He can't run, he's dumb, he's slow, he's lazy for a holding midfielder and generally he just doesn't do anything. He's not easily the most over scrutinized player, he's easily the most overrated player because no one else of his ability could have played for teams like PAO and Werder.

Katsouranis, Torosidis are obviously better than him and I would actually rather have Basinas in there. Have you been watching him for Portsmouth in the last few games? He doesn't have the legs for 90 mins any more but it's unlikely that either Tziolis or Basinas would play for more than 20 mins and I'd rather have Basinas. I'd possibly also rather have G.Papadopoulos because he'll work his butt off to shut down the opposition and he's quick. If we're 1-0 up with 10 mins to go I'd rather have him come on to help protect the backline than Tziolis. A backline of Vintra, Kyrgiakos, Moras and a midfield of Karagounis, Kats and Tziolis is ridiculously slow.

Either way, it's a fair argument to say you'd have him in the squad, but if he's playing in Serie A Otto will probably start him, that's why it's bad for the ethniki. As for Atromitos, they have a chance of making Europe this year. What other Greek team would he get into? He wouldn't get into Olympiakos' team, we don't want him, AEK could def use him but that's just because they are abysmal this season. AEK of last year might also use him but he wouldn't be a key player. PAOK are pretty good in centre-mid and he wouldn't fit into Aris' style of play (and he wouldn't dislodge Nafti anyway), so where could he go? Atromitos? Xanthi? Kavala (probably not, Dobrasinovic has been class for them). He's limited in my opinion and I can't wait til he's sold and we can use the money elsewhere.

[drakos13]

Ok Tziolis is definitly overcriticisized

He sucked in his first two years here I couldnt stand the guy but he definitly improved the last 2 seasons, and is definitley, unquestionably on eof the better Greek DMs and far from abysmal if you got to see him play with Bremen he was actually quite solid. 

He's the most (easily) over scrutinized player in Greek football.

Personally, I think he did really well when he was called up to protect our 1-0 lead in Ukraine, and of what he did at PAO last year he was solid, and with Werder Bremen too.

For the ethniki he plays so-so, but then again so does the ethniki.

PAO management wants to get rid of him for not being as good as Gilberto, Katsouranis, Simao, and Mattos. --- essentially 4 of the 5 best DM's in the Greek league has to offer. Can't blame PAO or Tziolis there.

& Get serious theres no way he was going to end up at Atromitos man.

Chievo could help him develop and get his form- and you're quite aware Rehagel would be calling him up regardless if he was still on the bench at PAO.

Greece doesn't have many DM's to pick from. Any manager with half a brain has no choice but to take the guy. He's more experienced, available, and talented than the bulk of Greek eligible DMs.

Who else is there after Kats and Toro?

Pliatsikas - Yes, but he won't make the WC because of injury

Makos- I like the guy but he's behind Tziolis thats for sure.

Giannis Papadopoulos???? No.

Fotakis? No

Basinas? Retired. And if Tziolis finds his form and fitness I'd rather have him than an aging and not-playing Basinas, who is simply not reliable anymore and the last couple years been pretty crap at the national level.

So yes, this move IS good for the ethniki. Playing time, a top league? Thats exactly what we need for the Tziolis, and unless Gilberto gets Greek Citizenship, then weve got no choice but to settle for him anyways.

I'd only seen Tziolis play a few times at Werder and on all of the he wass anonymous. That's not to judge a player on his time at Werder but a German guy has just come to work at the office i work at. He said that Tziolis became a bit of a joke among German fans. If Tziolis could make it as a pro then so could they, he joked. They love Gekas and rate Lybe and Amantidis too but they consider Tziolis to be a division 2 player in Germany. He wasn't even saying it tongue in cheek, he was being totally honest. So based on my knowledge of him from PAO and the ethniki and on what this guy says I'm sticking by my guns. He's terrible. If he was half decent for Werder they'd have kept him.

He can't run, he's dumb, he's slow, he's lazy for a holding midfielder and generally he just doesn't do anything. He's not easily the most over scrutinized player, he's easily the most overrated player because no one else of his ability could have played for teams like PAO and Werder.

Katsouranis, Torosidis are obviously better than him and I would actually rather have Basinas in there. Have you been watching him for Portsmouth in the last few games? He doesn't have the legs for 90 mins any more but it's unlikely that either Tziolis or Basinas would play for more than 20 mins and I'd rather have Basinas. I'd possibly also rather have G.Papadopoulos because he'll work his butt off to shut down the opposition and he's quick. If we're 1-0 up with 10 mins to go I'd rather have him come on to help protect the backline than Tziolis. A backline of Vintra, Kyrgiakos, Moras and a midfield of Karagounis, Kats and Tziolis is ridiculously slow.

Either way, it's a fair argument to say you'd have him in the squad, but if he's playing in Serie A Otto will probably start him, that's why it's bad for the ethniki. As for Atromitos, they have a chance of making Europe this year. What other Greek team would he get into? He wouldn't get into Olympiakos' team, we don't want him, AEK could def use him but that's just because they are abysmal this season. AEK of last year might also use him but he wouldn't be a key player. PAOK are pretty good in centre-mid and he wouldn't fit into Aris' style of play (and he wouldn't dislodge Nafti anyway), so where could he go? Atromitos? Xanthi? Kavala (probably not, Dobrasinovic has been class for them). He's limited in my opinion and I can't wait til he's sold and we can use the money elsewhere.

I find none of that true.

First off, I don't know who your friend is, but I'd disregard his statements pretty fast. I was a bit suprised of what I saw from Tziolis - granted I did not watch the bundesliga because I don't get the channels, but having German television I did have the channels and watched Werders UEFA Cup campaign and German Cup campaign, and

Tziolis was nowhere near that description in my view. That must of been where he played his best, because he was actually getting pretty regular time too. Especially in UEFA he was going 90 mins in Werders big playoff matches, and was playing well. Even other non-Greeks who watched Werder pointed out to me that he was looking good and were suprised PAO would bench him indefinitley...and of what i gathered from german perspective he was considered good, not to mention he looked fairly good at PAO that fall too.

Slow? He's only average on speed. He used to pretty slow, but he's definitley improved since the Tziolis that was fresh from Panionios.

Lazy?? Oh come on you arent serious. The guy can be sloppy but lazy? Hes a good worker. If Vyntra were a midfielder, he'd be Tziolis. Inconsistent, bad reputation, but puts in the hard work anyways, and does go through good spells to justify himself.

Speaking of Vyntra, there is talk he is close to signing with Siena.

We seriously could not afford to lose a defender right now....And besides, let his price go up after his WC appearances. Don't make the same dumb mistake Tzigger made selling Seitaridis before the Euro, when afterwards clubs were willing to pay way more.

Tziolis could definitley play at Olympiakos along Dudu, absolutley play for AEK, who despite being bad this year still have the better individual talent than the rest of Greek teams have to offer.

Aris are ridiculously overrated, Nafti is a good player but Tziolis could make a spot on that team for sure.

The guy was being just being looked at by Genoa, Chievo, Freiburg, Hertha, Nurnberg....come on man. He was not going to Atromitos, this is gross exageration. The only reason he's not making PAO is becuase PAO have by a longshot the most impressive spread of DM's of any country outside of the major 5 leagues.

I don't think he'll start unless he deserves it this summer. We are defintly going to need him on the bench. Giannis P isnt enough, neither is Makos. Pliatsikas on the other hand, Id take.

[Euro2004]

I find none of that true.

First off, I don't know who your friend is, but I'd disregard his statements pretty fast. I was a bit suprised of what I saw from Tziolis - granted I did not watch the bundesliga because I don't get the channels, but having German television I did have the channels and watched Werders UEFA Cup campaign and German Cup campaign, and

Tziolis was nowhere near that description in my view. That must of been where he played his best, because he was actually getting pretty regular time too. Especially in UEFA he was going 90 mins in Werders big playoff matches, and was playing well. Even other non-Greeks who watched Werder pointed out to me that he was looking good and were suprised PAO would bench him indefinitley...and of what i gathered from german perspective he was considered good, not to mention he looked fairly good at PAO that fall too.

Slow? He's only average on speed. He used to pretty slow, but he's definitley improved since the Tziolis that was fresh from Panionios.

Lazy?? Oh come on you arent serious. The guy can be sloppy but lazy? Hes a good worker. If Vyntra were a midfielder, he'd be Tziolis. Inconsistent, bad reputation, but puts in the hard work anyways, and does go through good spells to justify himself.

Speaking of Vyntra, there is talk he is close to signing with Siena.

We seriously could not afford to lose a defender right now....And besides, let his price go up after his WC appearances. Don't make the same dumb mistake Tzigger made selling Seitaridis before the Euro, when afterwards clubs were willing to pay way more.

Tziolis could definitley play at Olympiakos along Dudu, absolutley play for AEK, who despite being bad this year still have the better individual talent than the rest of Greek teams have to offer.

Aris are ridiculously overrated, Nafti is a good player but Tziolis could make a spot on that team for sure.

The guy was being just being looked at by Genoa, Chievo, Freiburg, Hertha, Nurnberg....come on man. He was not going to Atromitos, this is gross exageration. The only reason he's not making PAO is becuase PAO have by a longshot the most impressive spread of DM's of any country outside of the major 5 leagues.

I don't think he'll start unless he deserves it this summer. We are defintly going to need him on the bench. Giannis P isnt enough, neither is Makos. Pliatsikas on the other hand, Id take.

I don't blame you for not buying what my German work colleague said because you don't know him and for all you know he could have a limited grasp of football so I understand that. But you clearly watch Greek football and to say Tziolis would get into Olympiakos' team is just plain wrong. I can't think of any manager that would play him. If he was half decent at Werder why didn't they buy him?

Being looked at by a certain team doesn't make you a player. Let's not forget that if a proper team wanted him he'd be a dead cert to go because he's on the transfer list and is cheap! If you're a good player but expensive, Torosidis or Ninis for instance I can understand why a good foreign team wouldn't splash the cash to take the risk on you but Tziolis is available for next to nothing. If they rated him they'd sign him because he'd be risk free. The fact is though Tziolis is close to Siena if the latest reports are to be believed

http://www.sportdog.gr/v3/article.aspx?id=121431

Siena are already bottom of the league and 7 points off of safety so he will most probably be playing Serie B football next year. If he was half decent he'd have moved to a team that can at least guarantee him first division football next year.

All this is irrelevant though, we both agree he isn't good enough for us, whether because of a lack of ability as I think, or too much competition as you think, so it's best he goes asap.

[NikosVazelas]

Good Riddance...Lazy bum...

Tziolis s the laziest player Ive seen... alongside Mantzios of course..

Vyntra at midfield would have tor shorts and his lefgs woudl be dirty up to the thigh..

Have u ever seen Tziolis tackle anyone... He is crap..

The fact thathis previous team didnt keep him and is only going to a bottom 3 team in Serie A... lets us all know where he ranks in the scouts eyes...

As for NT

We have Kats, Toro and Kara that will play there.. and Id play Patsa before Tziolis...

[Euro2004]

Good Riddance...Lazy bum...

Tziolis s the laziest player Ive seen... alongside Mantzios of course..

Vyntra at midfield would have tor shorts and his lefgs woudl be dirty up to the thigh..

Have u ever seen Tziolis tackle anyone... He is crap..

The fact thathis previous team didnt keep him and is only going to a bottom 3 team in Serie A... lets us all know where he ranks in the scouts eyes...

As for NT

We have Kats, Toro and Kara that will play there.. and Id play Patsa before Tziolis...

:LOL: Great opening sentence!

As you know, i'm with you, but it's hilarious reading the contrasting views of you and Drakos. I don't think I've ever seen you 2 agree. At least I agree with a couple of things with Drakos, i.e. bringing back David, but you 2 are unbelievable! :D I don't even have to ask Drakos' opinion anymore, I'll just ask yours and know he believes the opposite and vice versa :P

[NikosVazelas]

Drakos and I both agree on who our fav team is :P

hahaha I dont care I love drakos...

I think David should be back here too...

In fact.. if u go back... U will see that drakos mentioned that David isnt good enough for pao. but that was because he was pissed off at the time. You cant judge a player on 2 appearances.

Thing with Drakos is.. he speaks from the heart... and I respect that.

As for Tziolis .. CIAO CAZZO!!!