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15 day ban


Do you agree with the 15-day ban?  

13 members have voted

  1. 1. Do you agree with the 15-day ban?

    • Yes - and it's about time
      7
    • No - it doesn't really address the issue
      5
    • Not sure
      0


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Absolutely necessary.

There is high danger of a vendetta developing. There is no reason for large groups of people to have an excuse to move and congregate together (as in "just going to watch a game").

I hope they use the ban time to take some measures against those who hold an entire city hostage every time they want.

If the officials are serious about eradicating organized violence from team sports they should go further. We have the British example that worked.

Ban all teams from European play and withdraw the NT from competition until things improve.

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it is about time. imo we should stop all sport activities in greece and cancel the rest of the season.

like that "real fans" could wake up and report other fans causing troubles. there is no way that greek officials will be able to handle everything on their own. to get a good start also the fans have to be involved.

unfortunately too much money is involved and i doubt it that accurate measures will be taken. this is greece and not a country like britain, where people know to organise things and have the guts to ban their teams on international level.

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I dont agree with the ban if that is the only thing that they are going to do.How many times have we seen this stupid kind of behavior from many and different fan groups with many discussions but no change and no improvment.Where our the cameras in the stadiums,the control or punishment of people causing trouble,(in the fight they were over 400 people but they only arrested 13!!!)I hate to say it but after the ban is over and before this season ends we will have more tragedys or fights to talk about.Until someone decides to REALLY make a diference like they did in other countries(ENGLAND) protect the sports and the supporters attending them we will have the same stupid and blind violence in our country.

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I agree with my friend Crazy. The ban does not address the issue. In England I know a couple of people who belong to "firms" and I know Spurs and Millwall hate eachother, the different divisions they're in means they rarely play each other. Does this stop them "having a meet"? Stopping football merely punishes the real fans. Make all games behind closed doors like they did in Italy? Fine, but this has to be accompanied by other actions. The intro of CCTV in stadiums, harsher prison sentences, possibly even supervised community service were fans from rival clubs have to work together under the watchful eye of armed polics in the hope that somehow they connect with the human element, etc. However, banning sports totally doesnt make a difference.

I also disagree me ton filo mou ton Cyberfish. Banning Greece from NT football and clubs from EU competition won't help for a number of reasons:

1) We dont have a hooliganism problem with foreign clubs/nations. Even the Turkey game, where the Greeks fought among themselves was club connected. The fight started when a handful of Neo-Nazis attempted to take out swastikas and they were subsequently identified as Apoel and PAO fans and attacked by Oly fans. It's a domestic issue not an international one, and it should be treated as such.

2) It would harm the Greek economy if the revenue from sport was removed.

3) It punishes the genuine football fans.

4) It would irrevocably harm the league which again, economically, we can't afford.

5) Most hooligans don't give a s%$#! about the game itself and banning football from the EU and NT would not be a detterent.

So, therefore I dont think its a good move to ban football for 15 days. It would have been better to carry on playing behind closed doors for the rest of the season (for club games) in the short term. In the long term there should be (1) an improvement on the ticketing system e.g. tickets would no longer be sold from the box office, only through application and a valid ID would be needed to gain entrance. (2) Harsher prison sentences for organised hooliganism. (3) A deduction of points from the team of those responsible therefore Oly may lose the league, or PAO denied a CL spot, etc.

It's important to remember that these people are criminals not sports fans and therefore any actions should take this into account.

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What is the 15 day ban going to do?It won't stop the assholes from being assholes.I was watching the Greek news last night and they were interviewing these so-called "hooligans".It is interesting that their faces are completely covered and they have remorse for their actions.If they were real tough guys,then they should take off their masks.It's not the first time that violence has occurred and it won't be the last time.Where are the police?If that ever happened in New York,every single one of those "hooligans" would have been arrested or had their skulls busted open by the NYPD

FIFA should disqualify Greece from qualifying from Euro 2008

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Government officials have instituted a 15-day ban on all team sports throughout Greece after the melee in Paiania on 29/03/2007 which resulted in the death of one person.

Do you agree with the ban?

Well it's really not a 15 days pand if you consider that next week is Easter and there was no games anyways!!!!!I say stop the seson NOW!!!!!! NO MORE!!!!
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ban is RIDICULOUS and mislead.

THIS IS NOT TEAMS OR LEAGUES RESPONSIBILITY.

this ban is symbolic which I can appreciate, but it does nothing. Because athletics are not the problem. This has nothing to do with EPO or any ministry of athletics.

here is one parralel example......There is a LINE where teams can control fans. This was way outside it. If PAO fans (people in PAO jerseys) assault a bus of Olympiakos fans in Kallithea and 3 die - people turn at clubs, EPO. TELL me, please where the club PAE Panathinaikos would be responsible for any of this.

Give me an explanation how for how they are at fault in a legal and ethical point of view. You CANNOT.

These people are PAO fans. Ask What is a PAO fan? Somebody who has chosen to support PAO when they play matches and keep track of their events, maybe wears a cascol on matchdays. Its a personal beleif and choice, its not an institution, school of thought, its something they do in their personal life, a favourite if you will. Clubs cant have control over their fans in their personal lives - its illegal for one, and impossible for the second. But when they are in match grounds in secure zones there responsibility is protecting the event and security - PAE PAO has full responsibility and different story. Their job and the police's is to protect inside and and small perimeter outside on most cases. It is not their job to police the fans across the whole city, its not their responsibility, its not even possible for them.

Fanatics form gangs and essentially just use this teams as symbols and do dumb s%$#! in their personal lives. If you cant see the difference between personal choices and club responsibility well...to be childish- your an idiot. Everybody wearing PAO merchandise does not become responsibility (legal or moral) of the club. I honestly think some athletic organizations in Greece dont understand this (remember when OSFP fans burst into Panionios without tickets? OSFP got in trouble - whats OSFP's fault- whats Kokkalis to say - is he their spiritual leader? No!)

This was NOT stadium violence. All problems in matches are a completly separate category than this. Dont let the scarves fool you. This was a MURDER. This was GANG violence.

It was an ambush - how the hell can this be related to stadiums?

Because it happened AROUND a venue (where else is the best place to catch particular fans?) and people who did it were in colours means NOTHING. Assuming clubs and leagues responsibility because they wear jerseys and scarfs is plain ignorant.

These kids are in clubs, prepare and organize fights and ambushes, the medium they picked for justifying this is sport teams. If there were no PAO and OSFP this violence would still exist in another form. PAO and OSFP in this equation are just symbols. Like in LA gangs they have whatever a symbol, an eagle a scorpion whatever - and in france their skin colour acts as a symbol...all to do the same things- its all an excuse to be violent. End result is the same - organizaitons of kids who are looking for fights because glorifying of 'xyz' symbol (THERE IS NO CAUSE)

Sorry for the guy that died he didnt deserve it, but if he was jumped by these guys its likely he was involved in this lifestyle himself. You know these gangs they know rival members and opponents. Im sure they knew who he was as a member of fundamentalist OSFP club himself and his role and not a random innocent guy going to the the OSFP-PAO womens volley game - if youre bringing a knife and throw somebody in a car - thats got nothing to do with hooliganism even. This is murder with a PAO jersey on somebody with OSFP jersey. Now I read reports that theyre thinking maybe a murder charge? REALLY GUYS? SOMEBODY WAITS FOR A MAN, STABS HIM, THROWS HIM ONTO ONCOMING TRAFFIC AND NOW YOU HAVE THAT IDEA??? If this goes down as athletic violence rather than homicide and prosecution is as such --- we may as well bring back Papadopoulos to take over the country.

Take more extreme examples:

In USA 3000 people died because of "Muslims" ------ is it the appropriate action for USA to ban worship of Islam and fine them for months? No it isnt. Because those people do not represent Islam, had no connections with islamic activities but rather separated, formed this stuff on their own and did it in Islams colours and face. Isnt this PAO-OSFP thing the same example (on a much lesser scale obviously) of a group of people blatantly separating and going against the beleifs of their organization, and just commiting crimes with their name?

When 4 fanatic Greeks and fanatic Orthodox helped commit Srbenica massacre - is this the fault of the Hellenic Republic and Bartholomaios in Constantinople? NO, and for the EXACT same reasons Clubs are not responsible for this.

We are going to just hurt sports at the price of not solving the problem with these bans. In fact I would say keep everything going - this is a great opportunity for police to make some arrests. Especially since I guarantee you their will be some sort of retalitation upon that fan club. Its only delaying it. Put a few indisguise cops or something on corners around the nearby streets next derby, catch these assholes (of PAO, OSFP, AEK whoever theyre one and the same)

As for police - i think theres a way to solve this problem. Why not get some people inside these clubs undercover? Learn about them, culture, names, plans... and lock them up- maybe even find out about this murder. (However I think its illegal to go undercover in Greece) I mean once these gangs fall are they really going to get back up? Most arent intelligent enough to be leaders of them, and once theyre gone theres no way to indoctrinate new ones into them.......

These gangs are the problem. Not fans.

And if not undercover - go ask the OSFP club that got attacked who did this (and build up a database of names at the same time ;) ) I can almost guarantee you they know which syndesmous are their rivals and which people would have it out for them....

Edited by drakos13
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I think my Q from the PAO page was answered here, OSFP fan died.

Few comments,

who ever said ban the ntional team from the eu08 is an idiot concidering that it was a volleyball game (unless he/she meant volley NT)

F*** the NEO-NAZIS at the gipedo, im PAO but im not racist thats one fight i would have been osfp.

I also beleive that this violence will never stop, and that a vendetta will go out for the heads of PAO fans. Its all male agression, pride, testosterone (basically one big penis mesuring contest)

the clubs cannot be held responsible for psychos!!!

enjoy easter and the break

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turns out it was a PAO fan and the evidence suggests that only OSFP fans were organised in their numbers and wanted to fight......what did i say.

The most tragic thing is that this was a woman's volley game thats pretty low on all parties just looking for a OSFP-PAO derby in any league or sport to start a fight.

kalo pasxa

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That's a disgrace for a young kid like that to go out because of a ###### sports rivalry. Not even a disgrace, just a travesty. These people should all be ashamed of themselves. Ama pethane ena apo ous filous tous h oikogenia tous tha stamatagan. F*** these idiots. They are ruining Greek soccer so much and the government is not doing much to stop them. The 15-day ban doesn't really do much. More police with dogs should be patroling stadiums and harsher jail sentences should be given out for hooliganism. endangering the welfare of another human being is a very serious offense in any country and it should be even more in Greece.

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That's a disgrace for a young kid like that to go out because of a ###### sports rivalry. Not even a disgrace, just a travesty. These people should all be ashamed of themselves. Ama pethane ena apo ous filous tous h oikogenia tous tha stamatagan. F*** these idiots. They are ruining Greek soccer so much and the government is not doing much to stop them. The 15-day ban doesn't really do much. More police with dogs should be patroling stadiums and harsher jail sentences should be given out for hooliganism. endangering the welfare of another human being is a very serious offense in any country and it should be even more in Greece.

the point is this was blocks away from the stadium. Its not the police's fault theyre not assigned to those areas. Its not their job to seek out every zone where people where PAO and OSFP areas in the city and monitor them...Which is why this is NOT via sta ghpeda this is PLAIN MURDER. It should be treated and pursued like murder that means police, press, attidude, EPO.

Filopoulos is going to get the image of a good PAO fan on his way to the game....lets be honest what are the chances of that....OSFP idiots were waiting for the first PAO fans they saw, attacked them with chains, clubs and stabbed somebody 15 times and throw them into oncoming traffic. Dont mean any disrespect because this death was sad, untimley and unjustified - but he HAD to have been one of those hooligan types himself to get this.....He had to be a leader of one of those fanatic syndesmous or a member who did something in their gang world....15 stabbings does not go for a random person from the heat of the upcoming womens volleyball match. That has to be personal come on....

Its not a matter of putting dogs and screens in matches- its going out and getting these select, organized people who do the extreme stuff (incite fights with police, try to get in without tickets, attack buses, kill, fight in alleyways and ambushes) - Bottle throwing and such is just a crowd/emotional reaction thing.....this other stuff is the REAL problem and it can be stopped if they go and raid these stupid clubs, tap them, monitor them, get on the inside and everytime they meet up for fights put them in jail. THATS what has to happen, everything else is pure logia polla, m*****es. Bans? Fines? Suspensions - actions from any Athletic ministry will do ABSOLUTLEY NOTHING. BECAUSE THIS IS NOT THEIR AREA and most of the time not even their responsibility.

Only police, and mayor have ability to solve this issue. THATS IT. And putting more guards at the gates is not solving anything at all - its wasting resources our city needs.

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I believe that after the security people get a hold of the troublemakers they should turn them in to the custody of police like in England.That way the ball is in the clubs hands and they have to act properly otherwise with no houligans with free tickrets and without lawfull paying tickets familys of normal fans the stadiums will be empty.I believe is a big step as long as it does not stay in worlds only but action and LAW.It is sad that something like(death of a fan) needed to happen for all this idiots to do something about it.Shame....

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When England did that(did not allow any teams in European Competition)there was no CL or country points and 2-3 teams participating with all that money involved.If that actually happened with our clubs NOW we would go back like a decade behind everyone else as far as foreign players coming to greek clubs or improving the soccer level that we would like to enjoy from our clubs.That is a statement that not even Nikolaidis really meant.The last time i checked he enjoyed this years CL money to pay his players and make transfers so who is really makes fun of who?The worse trouble that we have seen are in domestic games and not in Europe.That is what i believe.

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i dont think punishing the soccer clubs is the answer here...putting the hooligans behind bars for long time may make the next batch of hooligans think twice.... also getting rid of the major hooligan himself Cockkalis is a great answer to this problem

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Guys is it true that the fan associations have been disbanded?? (in other words the Thyres in Greece will no longer exist!) :o If this is the case then the Thyres will not be allocated tickets which they themselves will control in which case Gates 7, 13, 21, 3, 4, etc will end as we know them!!! If so this is the death of the atmospheres in Greece.

Is this true???

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It is not the end of Atmosfere but after what happen some measures needed to be taken for the remaining of the season.What will happen next year is up in the air....the only thing is that if anyone needs tickets he needs to go and buy them in person and can not get them anymore from Fan clubs.

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Guys is it true that the fan associations have been disbanded?? (in other words the Thyres in Greece will no longer exist!) :o If this is the case then the Thyres will not be allocated tickets which they themselves will control in which case Gates 7, 13, 21, 3, 4, etc will end as we know them!!! If so this is the death of the atmospheres in Greece.

Is this true???

If that's the case, it's for the best.
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