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Documentary Discussion Thread


Tzatziki

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Feel free to use this thread to post links to documentary films, discuss films or anything you think might be relevant or interesting.

The first documentary that really left an impression on me was Michael Moore's Bowling for Columbine. But my all time favourite and the best that I have seen so far in my opinion was the doc film The Corporation, really was eye opening to me at the time. If any fans of the genre have never seen it, I highly recommend you do so.

Anyone have a film or two they would care to share? @1789 spoke about the film Clinton Cash, really was a stomach turner and quite macabre.

 

THE CORPORATION is a Canadian documentary film written by Joel Bakan, and directed by Mark Achbar and Jennifer Abbott. The documentary examines the modern-day corporation, considering its legal status as a class of person and evaluating its behavior towards society and the world at large as a psychiatrist might evaluate an ordinary person. This is explored through specific examples. Bakan wrote the book, The Corporation: The Pathological Pursuit of Profit and Power, during the filming of the documentary.

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Cool, aviation is pretty awesome, a friend of mine has a pilot's license for small size aircraft, another who worked for a company that serviced inbound and outbound private jets at the airport, and I work personally with a few airlines from time to time it's a great field to be in. What are you pursuing in college?

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1 hour ago, aek66 said:

my favorite documentary is called 'yakub', produced by mixed-race hip-hopper kool mool johnnie.

 

in it, it is explained that 6,600 years ago, a black scientist (yakub, himself) created white people to be a race of devils...in his laboratory on the island of patmos.

 

In all seriousness, this is another good one I have seen that you may or may not enjoy aek66 about the beginnings of the clan, did you know their name has a Greek origin?

 

 

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On 05/09/2016 at 10:20 PM, aek66 said:

you are the canadian social justice warrior for african-americans. hope things don't turn out like they did for this american social justice warrior.

I would voice my support for any persons that I feel is being denied a fair shake.

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This is an episode from a pretty interesting series that Vice just started called Black market, hosted by the actor who played Omar in the Wire (if any of you have not seen the Wire check it out! One of the best crime dramas ever, the writing was so real, law enforcement actually had the network change their scripts, must watch).

 

Black Market Season 1, Episode 3 – “Iron Pipeline”
Gunrunners move weapons from American states with loose laws to states with stricter ones, in a neverending flow that law enforcement can’t seem to stop.

 

 

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History should be the first thing taught at school, after being able to read and write at a rudimentary level.  It's without a doubt in my mind the most important subject.  The problem is ... the teaching of it.

1) I've found that most people (myself included) aren't really interested in history until after you leave high school.  As we get older I think the appreciation for history increases by a large degree, but by that stage you're out of school.

2) What do you teach ?  Do you do as most countries do now and try to "teach" predominantly their own history, or do you teach world history to get a more holistic picture ?

3) Will it need to be sanitised so that children don't freak out ?  If so, how so ?

4) The politics of history.  Trying to come up with a version that everyone agrees with can be problematic, because well, there are people out their that aren't interested in the truth.

5) It's value vs say practical subjects like mathematics.  What can you do with history other than become a teacher of it ?  It's not "practical".  But to that I say, imagine if we took it to a hypothetical extreme and deliberately forgot all of our history, because it's not "practical".  What a tragedy that would be!

The important thing in my mind is to teach and make people understand (again, at what age do you begin and with what content) that the history of mankind has been one of struggle, wars, tyranny (man this is sounding bleak, get the children out of the room) but for the most part, with each "epoch" the standard of living and freedom overall, has been increasing.  To make people appreciate what is was like before, what it's like now, and to use that to inspire them to make tomorrow better.

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On 9/16/2016 at 10:44 AM, Tzatziki said:

Speaking of history and who is biased and who is not, has anyone here heard about or perhaps read the late Howard Zinn's "A People's History of the United States"? 

It is available for free online here:

apeopleshistory

I haven't, time being the enemy, but I remember reading a review somewhere on the best books to read regarding U.S. History and this was in the list and also highly praised.

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  • 1 year later...

 There's lots of debates about  economic theories and their outcomes. What surprises me is that we see the same arguments for economic  growth*  that have no evidence of their efficacy. Today, in the US, the conservatives are pushing a tax bill that would give further tax breaks to the super rich and the idea is that the rich & big corporations will generate more jobs and a bigger economy. There's no proof that such a policy works.

So, after 30+ years of conservative economics,  the gap between the super rich and everyone else has grown tremendously. This is a fact.

Same with health outcomes. You may hear how the US health care  model is good and how bad the Canadian, French or German are, but we can definitely see & measure  the health outcomes in all of  those countries..... with the US not doing so great!

* there might be growth but the lower classes don't benefit; in the US, the middle class has lost ground since the 1970s.

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  • 3 weeks later...

Though I wouldn't call this a documentary, but BBC has a new series, Troy: Fall of a City

I was reading some Greek news sites and saw that many people expressed their outrage because  Zeus, Achilles and Patroclus are portrayed by  black actors.  I don't have a problem with this, and I don't think it makes a difference to tell a story about events 2,000 4,000 years in the past. What do you think?

 

EDIT: Correction.... it wasn't 2,000 years ago the Trojan war happened. Homer is believed that he wrote the Iliad about 8th century BCE and he may have been writing about something that happened in the 13th c. BCE. So, the story of that war could be 3,300+ years ago.

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I dunno what the relevance is with skin color, like you said its 2000 years in the past, I would be more interested to see whether or not the acting was good vs the complexion of the actors, but of course in a country where the 3rd most popular political party is a group of dimwits who praise the SS and have wet dreams of AH, there will be some sandy vajayjays.

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Quote

I don't have a problem with this, and I don't think it makes a difference to tell a story about events 2,000 years in the past. What do you think?

I haven't seen the series and I do know that Greeks tend to be a 'racially purists' (which I don't agree with).

That being said, how can one tell a story that discusses the adventures and values of people that existed 2000 years ago without sticking to some parameters?

First, what was the context of black people in Greek literature in ancient times? According to Wikipedia "Homer's literature is said to have a black character included Eurybates, Odysseus's herald in the Odyssey, who is described as “black-skinned and woolly haired."Homer also wrote that Menelaus visited the Ethiopians first. "  (black people were referred to as “Aethiopian,” regardless of their actual ancestry in Africa). While black people were not seen as inferior in ancient times (even when it came to slavery - unlike modern European and American slavery), there is no reference to them as being an integral part of a culture - ancient Greek culture in this case ( Zeus was the top dog, do you think ancient Greeks saw him as a black person? )

And while the values of ancient Greek civilization are shared with the modern Western world, is it necessary to desecrate a people's mythology and rip off their cultural identity? In the name of what? Political correctness? Why can't they write a brand new story that discusses issues, values and presents people as equal to each other without race barriers?  Even if one wanted this to be a politically correct adaptation of the Iliad, where are the other races that represent humanity? Why isn't the Aphrodite character an oriental woman? Why isn't Odysseus a Native American? Why isn't Agamemnon a South American, somebody from Peru? Maybe because it's not much about being color blind either? And if Zeus is black, how come all of his offsprings (Aphrodite, Hermes, et.al.) don't include a single non-white person? So much for mythological accuracy.

J.K. Rowling successfully borrowed elements from many different cultures and civilizations and created the "Harry Potter" series. Never stepped on anybody's toes. J.R.R. Tolkien gave us the Hobbit and the Lord of the Rings. This is what modern mythology is.

While, I don't care much whether this series has a mixed-race consortium of actors, I do have to say that I don't agree with usurping other cultures in the name of a fast buck!  To tell (read 'butcher') a story that was written 2000 years ago - a masterful story at that. The Iliad belongs to the world  - no doubt on my part - but keep it in context with the times it was written. Consider it ancient Greece's gift to the world, but don't take it away from  the modern day inhabitants of that south-Eastern European region. Let Greeks, Bulgarians, Albanians, Turks all share thousands of years of wars and culture.


“The most effective way to destroy people is to deny and obliterate their own understanding of their history.” – George Orwell

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First, George Orwell is one of my favorite authors. But, I would take issue with that statement. What does "Own understanding" mean? Should such statement stand if people's understanding of their own history is based on myth?*  In the beginning, various groups and tribes felt "chosen" by God(s), and their "history" was based on this understanding.

Secondly, what kind of destruction are we talking here when myths eventually are replaced by scientific facts? Many advanced societies have given up believing their ancient history. I don't think the Norse today are destroyed because they don't believe in Thor and Odin.

Lastly, when it comes to artistic license, I don't think we have to stick to tradition, or history. Of course, this should not be presented as history or a documentary.

I'm trying to advocate for such artistic freedom here. I'm tired of being told that myth (something without any scientific or scholarly evidence to back a story telling) should be fed to us as history. We just ended a holiday season seeped in such myth. 

Happy new year** to all.

 

* I hear that there are some ..Macedonians who believe Alexander was a Slav. hmmm

**when the new year starts is another arbitrary notion; it would make more sense if it was on the solstice or equinox :christmas-204348::band:just sayin'....

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