Panos13
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Posts posted by Panos13
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Pano, can you please tell what those cd's are like. Do they have the full games? For some reason every time psortime comes with a cd they never bring it here to the us.
Yianiotis:
The CDs are good. My only criticism is that they are dragging it over so many weeks by featuring only 1 game in 1 CD, or 1 game 1 week. This will go on for weeks. But from a commercial point you can understand why Sportime are doing it this way.
As for the CDs content, each has extended highlights from a Euro match in a particular year. Last week was the mates in UEFA against Auxerre in 86/87 season which we won. It's part of that great run that beat Juve. There is also interviews with the players like Antoniou, Livathinos, Dimopoulos, Rotsa, etc. wgo describe the game and comment on it.
I reccommend you ask a family member to buy it and send you it like I do because they are worth having. Next Tuesday it's the games against Juve when we kicked their asses. :)
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(Btw, this has not got alot to do with the stadiums, and alot of people may find this a little pointless... but do you realise if we had defeated liverpool in the 84-85 semi-final, the tragedy of heysel may never have happened, and all the laws of seating in stadiums may not even exist today, and our attendance would still be in the 40,000's??? a little something to think about)
I had the same thoughts many times. I remember thinking that at the time Hysel happened. I recently watched that evropaiki poreia again of 84/85 again through the cds I get from Sportime. That was such a magnificant occasion. I was at OAKA when we beat Gotenborg to go to the semis against Liverpool and I will never forget the silence on the 88th minute when Saravakos was behind the ball waiting to take the penalty. The silence was deafening...it was the loudest most tense silence ever !!!!!
But of course o mikros scored and sent us to 7th heaven :nw:
Will we ever see another Saravakos at PAO?
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Protathlitis:
English stadiums don't have athletics tracks around them. That has never been the English style. In fact it was the English who have always had the stadiums built for football only.
I don't particularly like the stadiums with ccurving roofs either but places like Wigan and Reading and Hull City are very similar to Karaiskaki style as are Sunderland and Middlesboro's new grounds. If you have time have a search on the internet for them, you will see what I mean.
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Its one of the best football stadiums in the world!!
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Like these:
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It looks a bit too closed, suffocating. It reminds me of Centre Court at Wimbledon although that's far smaller because it's a tennis court.
I like to see something more open and spacious.
And who cares about Kokaliskaki? It's nothing special as I have said before. In England even small clubs like Hull City, Wigan, Reading and Leicester have better looking and bigger stadiums that were built recently. Kokaliskaki is new to the Greek standards but it's bettered exists almost everywhere in Europe.
I want something that stands one level above the rest. Like everything else with PAO,I want us to be the place people talk about when they think of stadia in Greece. Just like they think PANATHINAIKOS when you mention Greek football.
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That's good news about Votanikou but if the stadium ends up looking anything like the one on the picture from Sportday then it's the ugliest ###### stadium in Europe. Noway that's the final sketch because they haven't even made the final decision yet and judging by how long things take to complete in Greece..... :P
But the good news is that there is now opportunity for all tomies tou PAO to go in the same area, there will be a kolimvitirio and a kleisto of about 10000/15000.
AT LAST. Let's hope there won't be any blocks. But dimos will want a share of the profits and so will the company that builds it. The club will have to plan for an extensive commercial and emporiki excercise if they are to make any money from it.
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That is funny :LOL: but also tragic :( because every time we wanted to build somewhere some problem came up.
Let's hope the same will not happen with Votaniko. But something tells me that it will. We will see.
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:LOL:listen i really want Pao to get a new stadio b/c its good for the Greek league and creates even a greater rivalry between the two teams
but wuts the big deal here that Pao wants to build a bigger and better stadio
if it wasn't for Olympiakos building Karaiskaki would Pao be building a stadio??
the point is we are the first to build a modern stadio for a club from Greek clubs
and we happen to build it right on top of the old Kariakskai which still contains the history and past
your stadio may look better on the outside but thats artificial if the fans don't show up and create an atmosphere
Olympiakos as done that something u can't deny
This post shows you know nothing about the recent history of this issue.
A few years ago and well before Kokalis grabbed Karaiskaki, even well before he had plans of rebuilding it, Vardinnogiannis approached the PASOK government with the plans to rebuild Leoforos into a modern stadium which can be used for the Olympics. This was originally our plan and idea, not OSFP.
When this plan and other variations were refused and ignored by PASOK, the same government gave this permission to Kokalis to rebuild Karaiskaki. The idea that it would be used for the Olympics was not new, it was taken from the suggestion first made by Vardinnogianis to the government.
So when you say "if it wasn't for Olympiakos building Karaiskaki would Pao be building a stadio??" the answer is YES. If it wasn't for PAO proposing this to the government, Kokalis would not have built PASOKOGIPEDO aka Kokaliskaki. So please get your facts right before you post here.
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athinaios:i'm fascinated by all this talk.... i live in NY and the jets are now playing in NJ and want to build a stadium in Manhattan with no space for parking... Anyway, my point is that all this what if, maybe, we'll see, you're wrong, i'm right, etc.etc.... Any serious business knows EXACTLY who goes where, buys what, for what reasons, who attends, under what conditions, level of fan commitment, where they come from, whether someone would travel an extra 20 minutes to save $20 (on ticket price), and so forth....
I mean, com'on, it's not a rush decision... we've been talking about a new stadium for many, many years! If we don't know by now, we'll never know, and we're just playing roulette!
Geesh men, sorry, but isn't PAO a modern company with professional people to market the team, do research into its "customer base"?
Amazing, f^^king amazing!
There is a big difference between the American mentality and the Europen mentality. For the sake of argument let's consider Greek way of thinking about such things the same as the rest of Europe because when compared to America there is a clear distinction.
No offence intended, but your American example is a little irrelevant. For starters American sports teams are frenchises, nothing more nothing less. They can uproot from one city and relocate in another and like everything else American there is no history and tradition or any understanding of such things. Like everything else, Americans have little understanding of heritage or history or sentimentality. Again I don't mean any offence here sp please don’t take any.
Your point about PAO being 'a modern company with professional people' is all well and good but one thing these professional modern businessmen can not ignore is the opinion and the feelings of fans. You can't run a successful business by pissing off your main customer base. As Malcome Glazer has proven in his attempt to buy Manchester United Americans maybe successful businessmen in sports but one thing they don't understand is how things are done in Europe and have no respect for wishes of the fans. Sentimentality runs far deeper than any business or profit.
PAO fans want the club in Athens. Most of them will follow a bankrupt PAO in fourth division playing at Leoforos than a rich PAO that plays outside its traditions in a 60000 modern stadium and doesn't represent them or their history and ideals.
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Well, I am a kifissiotis and although I don;t live in athens now I had no problems going to Leoforos. If I had to go to Elliniko the trip itself wouldn't be a problem either. I would go as far as Voula and Vari and even further. the distance is not a problem.
The problem is history. PAO is an Athens club and all PAO fans from wherever they are must accept that. I love PAO because of its history and because its an Athens club. Nevermind that I am an Athenian and am proud of the team from my city because i understand that there are thousands of PAO fans who are not from athens and don;t feel the same pride about athens but still they love PAO regardless. We are proud of PAO fans like that.
PAO is an Athens club and must stay within the municipality.
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the STADIOUM is a LIFETIME investment it will route PAO's history from now onwards and we won't have another opportunity to build one...
and this very good point is at the heart pf it all. Ask yourselves gents, wehere do we want our history to continue to be written? do we want it to be where it began and where it has always beeen or do we want to uproot it and go somewhere where there is no relation? In football as in life, if you lose your identity and roots you lose your very purpose for existence. Do we want PAO to make history in its birthplace, or not? If not, then let's take the show on the road. I say we go to Patras :P
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athinaios:
No bets from me because I fear you maybe right :(
But one point to make about what you said. If we go to Elliniko, the other tmimata tis omadas will not be in the same place as you say because they have been given a place at Goudi.
I would like PAO to stay at Leoforos but it's not realistic as the space is far to limited. Goudilooks a distant possibility now and Votaniko the same, which leaves..... :(
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Even with a million trams and trains and buses, NO TO ELLINIKO
PAO IS AN ATHENS CLUB AND MUST STAY AN ATHENS CLUB. THIS WILL MOVE NOT ONLY PAO FOOTBALL TEAM BUT PAO ITS HISTORY TO AN ASXETO AREA.
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epoidi pername diskoles meres me to gipediko here are some links you might find useful ;)
http://www.gate13.gr/start.htm
Click on LETTERS on the left hand menu.
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drakos:
UEFA take parking seriously probably because of the issue of access by fans. I don't know. But what I do know is that it is included in the Champions League booklet which you can download from uefa.com
Pappou:
All I have to go by is the performance of the Basketball team over the last few years and compare that to the performances of the football team. I am sure that you will also admit that KAE has been far more successfull under Giannakopouli than ever before.
I am also not sure what exactly the contracts are worth in the basketball team but I doubt players like Wilkins and Radja cost less than the football players. Konstantinou is an exception where veryone was surprised Vardnnogianis paid so much for him.
I am sure that the Giannakopouli would make a more successful business out of PAE than Tzigger is doing or could ever do. I am not talking about Giorgos Vardinnogianis here because he showed alot of balls and he was in the frame with the team all the time. But Tzigger has never done anything for himself. The Giannakopouli brothers are proven business brains and they have made their own fortunes and I am sure they will do that with PAE given the chance. But Tzigger??? Don't make me laugh. The guys hasn't made a penny, he inheritted everything.
Anyway, are you sure that the Vardinnogianides have used the full potential ofPAE Panathinaikos? I am sure there is a lot more room or improvement and I am sure the Giannakopouli would prove to be more astute in that department than Tzigger and his team anyday.
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drakos:
Parking? It is a very important problem. According to UEFA's rules, the criteria for grounds receiving Champions League approval include "adequate parking". This is one of the bases on which they refused Leoforos a further extension last month and it is a criteria that all clubs in Champions League must take seriously.
Pappou:
Whatever you say about the Giannakopouli brothers they are definitely more PAO than the Vardinnogiannis family. Pavlo and Thanasi are first "opadi" and then businssmen. They have proved this with the way they have run the basketball team (I say this because you point a finger of blame towards the KAE). They often put their own money into the team and have noway got that money returned through the business of KAE. On the other hand, Vardinnogiannis always put the business side first and being a fan comes second. I doubt they have lost any money on PAO. They always get more than they have invested through Champions League. It's simple maths.
I would much rather have Giannakopouloi buy the PAE. I guarantee you that we will see a European trophy at PAO with them because they would bring good rather than adequate players that only go to the quarters of Europe to cover the costs of signings and some extra for the pocket. Also the team will dominate the elliniko protathlima. I say this because I know what strong fans they are and how they will bring the best talents they can. And I am sure that with Pavlo and Thanasi the gipediko problem would be solved alot more in favour of PAO at Goudi than it is now. Do you really think that Tzigger holds more power and influence than the Giannakopouli brothers?
Anyway, I am sure the Vardinnogianides will go where the money is. That's Elliniko. They look at the business first and then the history, origins and all the other sentimental stuff that matter to the real PAO fans.
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Pappou:
I sent you a message with address to another site. Did you receive it? ;)
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Don't be too optimistic. Apparently the "etoimi lysi" pou exei i kyvernisi einai.........TO ELLINIKO!!!!!! :angry:
I prefer to play in Crete and Patras, even Thessaloniki.
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Panathinaikos is an ATHENS CLUB. The Elliniko does NOT symbolise the traditions and the history of the club. END OF STORY.
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I don't want to have to travel all the way down past delta faliro and kalamaki.
I don't want PAO to be based at a F***ing AIRPORT.
Come on guys, lend your voice of support. I trust the Giannakopoulos brothers far more than the Vardinnogiannides.
PAO IS AN ATHENS CLUB AND MUST STAY IN ATHENS
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NOOOOO. I don't like this. If this is true we are going away from Athens itself for the first time. PAO is the only big Athens club and we should look to stay there. I wish the Goudi option would come true.
New Stadium
in Panathinaikos FC
Posted
Tickets will inevitably come down to encourage people to go. I remember 100drx in 1985 and 500drx in 1992 Champions League and even in 1996.