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Euro 2020 Group J - Greece vs Armenia (11 June 2019, Olympic Stadium, Athens)

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My wife is Portuguese. My father in law explained to me what happened to portugal. 

They never qualified. In World Cup 66 they finally made it and finished 3rd. Then they never qualified till Euro 84 and world cup 86. In soccer mad country they knew they had to change. So they fired everyone in the federation, invested heavily in training facilities state of the art. Hired the best youth coaches.  Got a youth blueprint made up to follow. Also the teams improved their facilities because they new the only way to survive was to produce great young players and sell them. Win situation for them and also the national team. 

What it produced was youth under 20 World Cup winners in 89 and 91. Plus champions in all age groups. Since qualifying for Euro 96 they have only missed out on the world cup98. That's 11 tournaments qualified for. Well 10 because they were hosts in 04. 

They have gone to 3 finals winning 2, plus they were semifinalists 5 times in tournaments.  This from a country of 11 million people and financial problems like Greece. 

And they look like qualifying for 2020. 

 

This is what Greece need to do. But won't happen. And it's not just portugal. Many countries have done it and its paying off. But there's to much corruption in Greece. 

Edited by Torontoblue
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37 minutes ago, Ellada2004 said:

Comparison to one of the worst footballing countries. Very simple too understand 

Maybe 5 years ago.  This new core of youngster are at a different level.

Alphonso Davies 18,  Liam Millar 19,  Ballou Tabla 20,  Jonathon David 19,  Cyle Larin age 24,  Jonathan Osoro 26, Lucas Cavallini 26... the list goes on. 

Excluding Fortunis and Donis, I'd take the canadian kids from midfield to strikers any day of the week. Just my opinion though.  

Edited by Itcoco
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1 hour ago, georgelaz said:

I liked the fight at the end nearly tied it at 3-3 with sokratis cross bar header. We're not dark ages but we're a team that battles for that last qualifier spot. We also were missing two of our best attackers in Mitroglou and Donis. Torosidis out is also a loss. We can still do this. If we came back against Bosnia away then we can win every game. The Italy game is the only game on paper we should lose.

Bosnia took a massive blow by us and we still have to face Finland. Finland had our number in nations league though so that's the key match up.

I'm less optimistic about the NT though for sure finally. 

We absolutely are in the ark ages.. Just because we missed Mitro and Donis that does not give the team the excuse to concede 9 goals against in its last 4  games. Just sit back and take a look since the last world cup we made the teams we've lost to and the fact that this will now be our 3rd or 4th straight tournament we don't make it. We are getting worse we've never had an offence and now we have one of the worst defence as far as conceding goals.. I'm done getting my hopes up for this team...

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6 minutes ago, Torontoblue said:

My wife is Portuguese. My father in law explained to me what happened to portugal. 

They never qualified. In World Cup 66 they finally made it and finished 3rd. Then they never qualified till Euro 84 and world cup 86. In soccer mad country they knew they had to change. So they fired everyone in the federation, invested heavily in training facilities state of the art. Hired the best youth coaches.  Got a youth blueprint made up to follow. Also the teams improved their facilities because they new the only way to survive was to produce great young players and sell them. Win situation for them and also the national team. 

What it produced was youth under 20 World Cup winners in 89 and 91. Plus champions in all age groups. Since qualifying for Euro 96 they have only missed out on the world cup98. That's 11 tournaments qualified for. Well 10 because they were hosts in 04. 

They have gone to 3 finals winning 2, plus they were semifinalists 5 times in tournaments.  This from a country of 11 million people and financial problems like Greece. 

And they look like qualifying for 2020. 

 

This is what Greece need to do. But won't happen. And it's not just portugal. Many countries have done it and its paying off. But there's to much corruption in Greece. 

Greece never had money to invest in all those things you stated. We were never a superpower in football. Greece won a Euro in 2004 with a very good coach with average to good players. They were the underdogs.  What I’m saying is you can still achieve success. Now our players must be really bad, so bad that we dont realise it. I just don’t want to believe it because of the teams our players play for. Roma, Benfica. Arsenal, Leverkusen and so on. I think the tactics and player selections are all wrong. Why are we playing 2DMs and no real wingers. We lack real midfielders and you need speed as speed has become a real factor in winning games. To go even deeper our players don’t play well with each other and are limited in the first place. 

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Looks Like Socrates is done seems he had enough and now he will definitely have a falling out with the coach after this game.. I don't expect to see Socrates on the NT anymore..

Edited by J1078

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Wow... Finally Socrates comes out and says it how it is.. He pretty much is telling everyone he doesn't believe in this team.

 

 

 

 

Edited by J1078
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37 minutes ago, J1078 said:

Looks Like Socrates is done seems he had enough and now he will definitely have a falling out with the coach after this game.. I don't expect to see Socrates on the NT anymore..

This is the problem with most Greeks, they have huge ego’s... this man takes zero responsibility for the outcome of the last 3 games.  He sounds delusional.

At least the media covering the team are asking tough questions.

Edited by Itcoco
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If Socrates doesn’t wanna play then good riddance. Who cares. Get someone who wants to play. I’d rather see them lose with heart than watch a guy who doesn’t wanna be there. 

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And vlachodimos is garbage. I can play in net for Benfica in the Portuguese league and succeed 

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11 minutes ago, Jimmyp said:

If Socrates doesn’t wanna play then good riddance. Who cares. Get someone who wants to play. I’d rather see them lose with heart than watch a guy who doesn’t wanna be there. 

This might be my interpretation but I’m reading between the lines here. Something is very wrong internally and you can see it manifest in the game itself.  Socrates is actually being very brave, he seems to be calling out management from the top. I personally like his attitude after such a big loss.

I'd be more concerned if he was full of excuses post match interview. His dissatisfaction is encouraging. 

Edited by Itcoco
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You can't lay the blame on Angelo for today's fiasco....just as you couldn't blame Ranieri for the Faroes defeat. Come on, they're playing Armenia and you guys think that tactics and selections made the difference? I'm not saying he isn't an idiot but today's loss is due to the players lacking pride and self-respect. Italy was one thing....today something else entirely. He put Koutris in Staf's place, Zeca in the midfield, started Koulouris and Pelkas and benched Bakasetas and the [email protected]@kes still lost....do you think in 10 days training he's gonna teach them "balla" or do you think that Sokratis, Samaris, Siovas, Manolas, Zeca, etc need to be told how to mark and defend? The responsibility lays squarely on the players and if they have any pride they'll bust their a$$es and qualify....nothing less will do.

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It’s not just sokratis... manolas has made the same claim. The players aren’t off the hook but this coach has gotta go. We play Finland twice. Win both and we r back. We need a new coach who stops calling.....

kolovos, mavrias, bakasetas, mantalos, siopis,stafylidis....we need a influx of youth especially on the wings... back line with retsos as a rb will help when he’s healthy...with a fully healthy lineup our only real weak spot is CM...

mitroglou, fortounis, donis and one of the young wingers are a decent front set up. Koutris, manolas, sokratis and retsos seem to be a strong back line. Our 2 Cm r weak. Zeca is decent if he plays with a Cm partner who has skill and can distribute. We need that karagounis, katsouranis, or basinas to emerge

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What is surprising is how much faster the Armenians were than the greek defense.

It was scary. And the problem is than none of the young players (apart from limnios) have any speed.

 

Edited by PaoOle
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32 minutes ago, Itcoco said:

This might be my interpretation but I’m reading between the lines here. Something is very wrong internally and you can see it manifest in the game itself.  Socrates is actually being very brave, he seems to be calling out management from the top. I personally like his attitude after such a big loss.

I'd be more concerned if he was full of excuses post match interview. His dissatisfaction is encouraging. 

He was horrible today. So he has to call out himself too 

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39 minutes ago, Jimmyp said:

He was horrible today. So he has to call out himself too 

samaris was worse ...... enough of this mediocre crap

 

out

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I may be attacked for my unpopular opinion but having watched both interviews i think I’m starting to understand.

 

1st off I am positive sokratis will be there next game. In no way do I interpret what he said as “I’m not playing and we suck” he was using his name as a metaphor for other players/staff members who should be held accountable. And that management should look and hold ANYONE accountable. Sokratis was speaking in a way to avoid calling out people. He may be referring about other players. Personally I was thinking of samaris the entire time. Like sokratis highly rated at club level, he might not have a place with the ethnicity. He has been horrendous, and has directly cost us Several goals. Sokratis said with the way the team is playing CURRENTLY they don’t deserve. He did say there is time and Finland won’t be the final match to determine the outcome. I appreciate his honesty and lack of excuses.

 

2. I don’t mind the coach. I think he should stay. First and foremost, the fact that his Greek always was a plus for me because he truly cares about the team outside of the confines of his paycheck. I think the example he made with the goalies who have honestly performed decent in my opinion, was in reference that this team is building chemistry with one another, which is something that can’t be measured but it’s invaluable especially for a national team that does not meet on a daily basis the way club teams do.

Also the line up that was fielded today looked good to me, Manolas was a shock, But we also don’t know what happens off cameras. Maybe he needed a rest, or he was injured in training. 

Now I can’t blame the coach like he said for particular STUPID passes that happen during a game that cause dangerous counter attacks. Mistakes do happen but once it’s game time the coach has little influence on what happens on the field.

upsides I took from this game was fortounis performance, although I still feel he lacks a bit of vision and he takes too long to make decisions. Also I’m glad koulouris was finally given a shot at 90 min. Although he didn’t receive too much service. I would love to see a line up without samaris in it. Or at least maybe put him in as a sub (and see how that affects our first half performances)

 

also the lack of support from the Greek fans saddens me. Idc how bad your team is playing booing them off at the half isn’t going to help. BELIEVE ME I understand the frustration but as much s%$#! as I talk I will always follow the team.

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On a side note if anyone finds a clip of fortounis goal please send it on here lol 

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Apparently on agona they just said a few mins ago that manolas sokratis and torosidis just told epo that either they fire the coach or theyre all leaving. 

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Guys the common problem is EPO. They have always been corrupt that the root of this its money first football if its convenient. We are way better than Armenia we just dont have professional association and its cancerous to team...

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2 minutes ago, gsots said:

Apparently on agona they just said a few mins ago that manolas sokratis and torosidis just told epo that either they fire the coach or theyre all leaving. 

Then they should leave. Even if he’s the worst coach ever, inmates should never run the jail. Shut up and play. Are the little tiny millionaires feeling hurt. Awwww

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For me I think this started the minute the coach didn’t call up Toro I think this didn’t sit well with Manolas and Socrates.. I could be wrong but now reading both players want the coach fired makes sense to me..

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I'm with the players here, there's clearly something wrong when our 2 world class cb's are saying this. And we're seeing the coaching nonsense on the field every game. 

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