pash Posted January 25, 2018 Author Share Posted January 25, 2018 We'll know the details soon. Might be better than we fear. I hope this guy has a great career ahead of him, he's an excellent player with tons of potential. I'll be cheering for Cimirot. The sale, btw, is all but confirmed...he gave a (very short) statement to inPAOK just now as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bananas Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 1 hour ago, pash said: The sale, btw, is all but confirmed...he gave a (very short) statement to inPAOK just now as well. Ha ha ha. Just after I posted saying we'd be crazy to sell him, I saw the article at inpaok. Go figure. I hope the money is very good. Canas and Shakhov both different players to Cimirot. Canas more defensive and Shakhov more attacking. I wonder what this means for Kace ? Personally, I wouldn't be loaning him to PAO and I'm not interested in getting a new player into the squad that needs time to gel with the boys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pash Posted January 25, 2018 Author Share Posted January 25, 2018 Kace is the closest we have to his "type" of player that I can think of. Maybe Mauricio. Judging by what Lucescu said at the press conference today (which I notice wasn't really translated for the reporters) is that he doesn't want to play with dedicated defensive midfielders, which could explain why Canas is on the outs (and why Mauricio/Cimirot get so much time). Notice that this new guy is also a CM, as well. I think at this point, Kace has hit a wall and is unlikely to progress in a team as stacked as we have. I think he should still go to PAO, at least for a loan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bananas Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 I guess I just disagree with Lucescu. Always been a fan of having a 6/kofti who provides cover for the defence and who can also sweep in the middle. If he can take and give hits as well for say derbies, that's a bonus. I get what Lucescu is saying though. In the GSL it's overkill but in Europe, especially as you play tougher teams, I consider a quality kofti essential. In truth, it's not easy to find a top quality one. In recent times we had Garcia and more recently Milivojevic from Olympiakos. Olympiakos have not been the same team since he left. Top player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athens4 Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 I'm happy with the Belgians' offer as long as there is a sell-on clause in there too. Personally I think we should give Kace another chance in that position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bananas Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 And now there are articles appearing of our interest in Kourbelis. Time will tell if this is for real or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pash Posted January 25, 2018 Author Share Posted January 25, 2018 I saw a reference to that on twitter as well, but also saw a post about our interest in Madson from Atromitos as well: https://www.transfermarkt.com/madson/profil/spieler/244832 I've never followed Kourbelis or Madson so I don't know who the better player is. Madson is clearly cheaper, but I don't think we'd be buying Kourbelis at full market value. Personally, if two players are equal in skill, I'd rather we get the Greek one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bananas Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 I’m still kind of surprised we’re selling Cimirot for “only” 2.5 million. I mean it’s good business. Bought him for 1.4 million so a nice profit I suppose. But nothing staggering. If he was not in the starting 11then all good but the thing is he is. I don’t like the idea of selling starting players for such an amount and worse during the winter transfer period. Why mess with an 11that is finally clicking ? This means one of Shakhov or Canas (assuming we don’t sign another player) have to become starters. I like Canas when he’s in form but he’s hardly played this season. What is also surprising is Cimirot wanting to leave. It’s not like he’s going to a super team. If it was Anderlecht or Brugge I’d get it but Standard Liège ? Add to that we’re a real chance of winning the league you’d think he’d want to at the very least hang around until the summer. I can only assume it’s a stepping stone in his eyes. Could be the case he’s thinking take the opportunity now to go to a better league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bananas Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 2 hours ago, pash said: Personally, if two players are equal in skill, I'd rather we get the Greek one. Should this also apply in matters of love ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pash Posted January 25, 2018 Author Share Posted January 25, 2018 All players are mercenaries, Cimirot would have seen PAOK as a stepping stone to a better league, which will draw even more eyes to his performances. 2.5mm does seem low to me, especially for such a key player. I still believe we have the quality internally to replace him, but Michel has Ivan's checkbook available, so there's no way he won't buy someone. If he gets a standard CM (vs DM) as I think he will, it will accelerate Lucescu's plans to move us to a 4-4-2, I think. I saw an article on inPAOK just now saying that Stuttgart's coach was specifically asked about his interest in Pelkas, and just gave a li'l knowing smile. Couldn't watch the video as it was blocked in the US though. C'est la vie. As for the love question - love is a lie that was made up by greeting cards companies, to sell more product. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackhawk Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 Cimirot considered PAOK a stepping stone since he joined the team. Most of the players from Croatia/Bosnia/Serbia do that. That's why ever since players such as Cimirot, Leovac, Prijovic came to PAOK there are reports that their agents are shopping them around. In Cimirot we found a buyer. Leovac's case was a disaster. Time will tell about Prijovic. PAOK made approximatelly 700K by selling Cimirot. 2.5 mil - 400K (15% resale we owe Sarajevo) - 100K (to the team he started at) - 1.3 mil (purchase) As for Pelkas it's obvious that Koutsioliakos is trying to sell the player to the German team. Probably was an agreement between Koutsioliakos and PAOK as part of him helping bring Vierinha back to the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pash Posted January 25, 2018 Author Share Posted January 25, 2018 Caktas, the free agent out of Rubin Kazan signed with Hadjuk Split (I believe that's Tudor's old club, right?). If he's good enough for that team, then he's not good enough for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athens4 Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 Is there a sell-on clause in the Cimirot deal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pash Posted January 25, 2018 Author Share Posted January 25, 2018 Doesn't sound like it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackhawk Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 There is not re-sale option in the deal with Standard Liege. Cimirot's new salary is 800K per season. Almost double from what he was making at PAOK. BTW the buyout clause was 6 mil, so we settled for less than half of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athens4 Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 Hmm disappointing to hear about no sell-on clause. Also, why do we insist on trying to do business with PAO? They are demanding over €2m now for Kourbelis who is nowhere near worth that. With all due respect to Michel I still think we made a huge mistake letting Arnesen go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pash Posted January 26, 2018 Author Share Posted January 26, 2018 Michel had built a far better team than Arnesen. None of us are privy to what's going on behind the scenes. The PAO thing is likely a directive from on high. I believe Savvidis wants to extend them a lifeline, for some reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brklyngrk Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 Savidis probably knows that a PAO in the league is better than them not in it. Bayern did the same thing with Dortmund years ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackhawk Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 PAOK is not tied to the league's TV revenue from NOVA. PAOK has their own exclusive deal with NOVA. Of course the league is better with PAO in it, but we should not bend backwards helping them out. They would be the first team to stab you in the back if they could. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pash Posted January 26, 2018 Author Share Posted January 26, 2018 Numbers based on....? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dutch Eagle Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 (edited) jvc, desperate times call for desperate measures. PAO has only 8K on average (a fanbase does not pay your bills, sold tickets do). And you had your homegames against Oly (13,7K) and AEK (8,7K) already. Can we go lower or is a forced stay of PAO in SL the solution? Schotland may be a good example for the league. Rangers had gone bankrupt. The league asked the other clubs to permit them to re-enter, with another legal entity with the word Rangers in it, on the same/highest tier but they refused dispite the fact they would loose money (= no fanbase of Rangers, but 20 diehard-fans from Partick Thisle or whatever minor club). Those left behind survived! AEK is the other example. They went down and returned all freshened up. AEK as a club/brand survived! It took then some years, but OK. The sacrifice had to be made. PAOK will survive with only 2 from the 3 other big clubs. See the AEK-less years. It is the likes of Kerkyra, Panetolikos, Veria (not in SL now though) and Xanthi that need the big 4. Not only for TV-revenues, but also for tickets. In Kerkyra they sold 1,641 tickets. 1,000 to PAOKtzides (pou kanane chiliometra pali). Agrinio will be like a funural of a dead person without friends and just a few relatives this week as no PAOKtzides are allowed. Edited January 26, 2018 by Dutch Eagle 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bananas Posted January 27, 2018 Share Posted January 27, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, jvc said: It's not the attendance in games that pay most of the bills....the t.v. revenues do the talking. I'll ask you a question. AEK was bankrupt and virtually disappeared from the league for 4 seasons. PAO has been in a crisis for 7 years....what has PAOK accomplishment? A cup. Maybe a championship in the horizon. At the end of the day, PAOK can't carry the SUPA league. It's PAOK who needs the big clubs to leverage off of. The 7 million around Athens, will not tune in to watch PAOK. Ha ha, what are you talking about megale ? Are you saying because AEK and PAO don't have the same resources as they used to, that PAOK should automatically be winning trophies ? The big fish is still Olympiakos and their budget is still significantly bigger than everyone else. Now if Olympiakos had big financial problems also, and we weren't winning trophies then I'd agree with you. Guess who spent the most on transfers this season, last season, the season before that ? It's not PAOK. Given our budget, we have the ... "right" to be contenders but we don't have the right to say we should be winning everything automatically. Regarding the effect on the league if PAO drops it obviously won't be good. But I'd prefer they drop or do whatever it is they need to do to fix their finances up even if that means playing just kids and getting relegated. Better to do that, be in the crapper for 3-5 years but come back STRONG (like AEK) rather than having PAO the way they are now indefinitely. It's my belief that fans are put off when they can't see light at the end of the tunnel. When fans know (or think they know) this is the bottom, things will only get better from here, they come back. Just like happened to AEK when they dropped. I believe the same would happen with PAO and the days ahead will be better. But they need to find that bottom first, and we're not sure if we're there yet. Edited January 27, 2018 by Bananas 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dutch Eagle Posted January 27, 2018 Share Posted January 27, 2018 I think that it all starts with attendance. Our youngsters need to see full stadiums to get excited and start to play and watch football. Empty stadiums are awful. I do not enjoy watching a game when the stands are empty and as a PAOKtzi I’m used to see keklismenon thiron. Players perform better with than without a crowd. Of course TV-revenues are important but Greece (like The Netherlands) is a small fish. They are not England or Spain, the big fishes. Every club in England in the Premier League has about 80 million euro TV-revenues a year. In Greece all SL-clubs together do not make those figures. So the League will not grow. Fanbase or not. As for the trophys. A lousy cup indeed. We were not good enough. No club should carry or dominate a league. They all (a bunch of 5 will do) should. Every year another champion is better for a league. Including a surprise like Leicester City recent in England or far far back Larisa in Greece. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dutch Eagle Posted January 27, 2018 Share Posted January 27, 2018 Back to topic now: PAOK is interested in Carlos Sanchez from Fiorentina. Can not rate him. Played at WC 2014, including the game against Greece. 73 caps. But he turns 32 next week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tahma Posted January 28, 2018 Share Posted January 28, 2018 Too old IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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