Croatia - Greece ( Round 2, 1st Leg, 9 Nov. 2017, Stadion Maksimir, Zagreb )

[J1078]

We desperately need these boys back to have a legitimate shot on Thursday..  

 

http://www.agonasport.com/agonasport-allnews/papastathopoulos-availability-more-hopeful-than-torosidis

[Boxou]

if we get a scoreless draw we're not favorites. because in case we concede a goal at home we'd need 2 and basically we'd have little chance of achieving that. if it's an 1-1 draw then i'd gladly take it. but for god's sake let's avoid the score less draw, it's a double edged sword in such games..

Edited November 7, 2017 by Boxou

[J1078]

I would just want to avoid the lose.. 0-0 isn't ideal because it forces us to win if Croatia scores in Athens  but considering we will be with out Manolas and maybe either Socratis or Toro id take it. other then us winning witch I don't see because we will have very limited chances a 0-0 draw is what the team will be playing for.

Edited November 7, 2017 by J1078

[kbxk508]

Bet365 has a Croatia win at 1.36, then 4.60 for a draw and a Greece win at 13.00. So what. Not long ago we came through with a lot worse odds than that. Greece has been written off before. That's good. Good thing is we still have a fit, Karnezis, Tzavellas, K Pap, Retsos,  Stafylidis, Tziolis, Zeca, Samaris, Tachtsides, Laz, Bakasetas, Fortounis, Gianniotas and Mitroglou.

K Pap and Tziolis experience are going to be key. In the absence of Toro, Soc (maybe) and Manolas, they will need to play smart, and show as leaders on the field. Backs, are firmly against the wall.

Yes. It would be awesome if we could catch them by surprise, and counter with an away goal or two.

[Rockafeller Skank]

I'd bet all my money on Sokratis playing injury or not with a painkiller syringe. No way he gonna miss the game. At least not all.

As for the Croats their only true creative defensive midfielder is Badelj so I d say it;s a good sign for us.

Idk what the previous poster wrote but an article published at 19:30 today (http://www.gazzetta.gr/prokrimatika-mundial-2018/article/1158606/den-proponithike-o-mantzoykits-trelathike-o-soyker) sais he did not train at all today. Kalinic is good as well but he is not Mandzukic.

Torosidis is not as good as Retsos defensively right now. He is old and slow. Offensively Retsos is probably very poor. Can't cross and doesn;t have any high rated vision. But defensively I believe he is on form with lots of playtime and doing fine at Bayer. When I mentioned Manolas suspension in international forum they said "don't worry you got Retsos lol". So I guess the foreigners respect our players more than we do. 

I ve heard Zeka will be played on the flank with Mantalos abscence. Hoping that's during offence. In defence I suppose he will be locking Modric. It is a known position to him since he came to Panathinaikos to be a Right Back/Right mid.

Hoping for something like this:

Karnezis

Retsos - K. Papadopoulos - Sokratis - Stafylidis 

Zeka  - Samaris - Tziolis - Lazaros

Fortounis

Mitroglou

 

**By the way. Mostly to Olympiakos fans. You guys do know that Skibbe created a trend right? Lemonis adopted the Skibbe scheme and fielded a side against Barcelona with 2 defensively orientated players on the Right Wing. I suppose with the results both Skibbe and Lemonis are justified.
 

[Boxou]

probably stafylidis will play as a winger and tzavellas as a right back. 

tziolis will get abused so id start kourmpelis any time, and probably lykogiannis for retsos to have a proper back.

[Rockafeller Skank]

How will Tziolis get abused in a possible 2 man midfield at which we have fielded 4 , while Kourbelis who s like 15 cm under will not? You don't get Tziolis for his dribble and his vision. Which neither Kourbelis does. You get him for his height and his weight in set pieces.

Badelj missing means Croatia will probably chnage their 4-3-3 because they have no true replacement of a defensive mid who knows how to protec his defenders from flaws. a 2 man midfield with Modric and Rakitic surely sounds great but 2 against 4 doesn't tell me they re gonna make much. Rakitic doesn't produce for his NT anyways and Modric despite still showing is way different with 10 players who are not the ones of Real Madrid.

 

+ Their NT has been having some political/ethical issues and fights with fans. Players doing like nothing's happening but Im pretty sure they can't keep pretending forever. Under such pressure when u know you don't have your people behind you Im not sure skill is the only thing u need.

2 days ago with Sokratis/Manolas possibly gone I'd say the tie was over.

Today with Mandzu and Badelj I'd say it's back to where it was. Their big power which is the midfield got a big fat hit and we gotta see if they can recover from it. Weather might be ours as well. 

Im expecting a 0-0 match there. Unless some defender slips and fouls for a penalty,which in a muddy stadium is probably 3 times harder to utilize again.

The match at athens is the problem. Sokratis I suppose will be matchfit by then same as Torosidis. We might see a totally different game.

Edited November 7, 2017 by Rockafeller Skank

[Megas]

we need sokratis for the first leg. We need some form of leader ship on the field. Im worried about a wipe wash in Zagreb. lets be realistic a new back line is not going to do us any favours in this match. this is not a friendly where you can try new tactics.

 

Edited November 8, 2017 by Megas

[trotsk13]

If Sokratis can't go, I could see Croatia wiping us out, 3-0. Things could unravel. We need to park the bus and hope for a dogfight

[J1078]

54 minutes ago, trotsk13 said:

If Sokratis can't go, I could see Croatia wiping us out, 3-0. Things could unravel. We need to park the bus and hope for a dogfight

I'm trying to stay as positive as possible but in the back of mind that is my fear that Croatia pop in a few.. Just the way everything has gone from injuries to made up suspensions luck hasn't been on our side so far..

[Megas]

we just need a 0-0 all in Zagreb and a 1-0 in Athens may god help our ethnos. ive got a feeling if we do get the 0-0 in Zagreb this manolas suspension will be a blessing in disguise. He will be fresh in Athens.

[georgelaz]

I can't imagine sokratis being out. he's built like a truck and usually quickly recovers from knocks.

Siovas should have been selected though. Dude has NT experience and was playing in our playoff win vs Romania.

With Sokratis and Kpaps at the back we should be okay.

[Antaeus7]

I think the match in Zagreb will end 0-0 at best unless Greece can find a goal in the fewest of chances to capitalize. 

[Ellada2004]

2 hours ago, georgelaz said:

I can't imagine sokratis being out. he's built like a truck and usually quickly recovers from knocks.

Siovas should have been selected though. Dude has NT experience and was playing in our playoff win vs Romania.

With Sokratis and Kpaps at the back we should be okay.

Me too can’t see Sokratis missing a game of this magnitude. He was training today and should be ready. Also Toro has a fifty fifty chance of playing according to Agona sport. I can’t wait for Thursday. Go ELLAS!

 

[HellasLEAF]

I think we do an admirable job of trying to hold them but will ultimately concede a goal. I also feel we have a goal in us.  

1 - 1 Pame!

[paokarag4]

No official word but apparently its looking increasingly unlikely Toro will make the first leg, they are going to give Sokrati until the last minute to prove his fitness. I tend to agree with everyone here, my instincts are he'll play. 

http://www.novasports.gr/podosfairo/diethneis/world-championship-qualifications/article/356062/anahorisi-me-aisiodoxia-kai-agonia-video/

Edited November 8, 2017 by paokarag4

[Boxou]

we need to take into account that croatia out of their 10 games, scored 2+ goals only twice (against kosovo and ukraine). and that happened against opposition with far worse defense than ours (turkey, iceland, ukraine, finland). 

most probably line up as i just read;

karnezis

retsos sokratis papadopoulos tzavellas

tziolis zeca/samaris

zeca/mpakasetas fortounis stafylidis

mitroglou

[Kroates]

The problem with Rakitic was that the former coach used to make him play in a position that he doesn't usually play in at Barcelona. Also, his motivation to play for the NT is questionable. T

The system played by the former coach (Cacic) was hilarious, almost no player was in his natural position, so Mandzukic was very often cut-off, and as a result we scored only through set pieces and opposition team's mistakes. Also, this guy (Cacic) was a symbol of the corruption in Croatian football, because he didn't deserve to be coaching the NT because of his past honors (his coaching history is even below average), but because he was a servant for the big guys in the FA. The atmosphere around the team was depressive. With the new coach (Dalic), the situation has changed. At least for now; he seems to be (more) independent, and as a result, the stadium in Zagreb will most probably be packed tomorrow. Last time it happened in March 2013 vs. Serbia.

To get the idea of how Croatia will look like, focus on the last game (vs. Ukraine in Kiev). There are two new players on the roster who might come in as a surprise.

Btw, Greek journalist Panagiotis Dalatariof said today for Croatian press that Skibbe would be happiest if both games could end 0:0, and then Greece wins on penalties. :)

[Ellada2004]

Welcome to the forum Kroates, thanks for the insight from your side. Croatia play attractive football as they did last Euro when they beat Turkey with Modric stunner of a goal and just dominated that match. The game vs Portugal i was pulling for you guys but they seem to be out of sorts though Portugal was prepared to defend, but I believe they had no shots on goal for the first 90 minutes and then Portugal ended up winning. I watch Rakitic with Croatia and he seems to not put a mark on the game as when compared to watching him at Barca. You guys have your issues where this anger between a contingent of fans with Suker and the Croatian FA and many coaches have come and gone recently like Bilic, Kovac, and Kacic.Anyways it should be an interesting tie.

[Rockafeller Skank]

3 hours ago, Kroates said:

The problem with Rakitic was that the former coach used to make him play in a position that he doesn't usually play in at Barcelona. Also, his motivation to play for the NT is questionable. T

The system played by the former coach (Cacic) was hilarious, almost no player was in his natural position, so Mandzukic was very often cut-off, and as a result we scored only through set pieces and opposition team's mistakes. Also, this guy (Cacic) was a symbol of the corruption in Croatian football, because he didn't deserve to be coaching the NT because of his past honors (his coaching history is even below average), but because he was a servant for the big guys in the FA. The atmosphere around the team was depressive. With the new coach (Dalic), the situation has changed. At least for now; he seems to be (more) independent, and as a result, the stadium in Zagreb will most probably be packed tomorrow. Last time it happened in March 2013 vs. Serbia.

To get the idea of how Croatia will look like, focus on the last game (vs. Ukraine in Kiev). There are two new players on the roster who might come in as a surprise.

Btw, Greek journalist Panagiotis Dalatariof said today for Croatian press that Skibbe would be happiest if both games could end 0:0, and then Greece wins on penalties. :)

The new coach was appointed 3 days before the Ukraine match. The win was not his making and I do not believe he is anything good either on tactics. Skibbe has proven quite a few times that he is a tactical coach who knows how to get the best from his players. He picks disciplined and focused players who might lack some talent but in the end they do exactly what he wants them to do. 

In the Ukraine match the superior team just showed and I was not expecting anything less from Croatia. To win, although Ukraine did have their fair amount of chances.

The new coach has not been tested yet and these play offs will probably be the first ones he does.

Also a weird statistic, with Mandzukic possibly not playing is that your National team has won less than half their games with Mario being abscent. Im still into considering that the first match will be a 0-0 or a weird goal. And we re masters at weird out of nowhere goals. If I had to put my ife on it I'd go for the 0-0. If I used my heart a little bit too 0-1 to 1-1.

[J1078]

I'm hearing on the radio that Socratis is less and less likely to play. Apparently he's dong everything in his power but the ankle still doesn't feel right.. 

[Argy]

«Είμαι λίγο καλύτερα. Πονάω ακόμη, αλλά θέλω πάρα πολύ να παίξω κι αυτό είναι που μετρά παραπάνω για μένα. Θα δούμε και στην προπόνηση, θα μιλήσουμε με τον προπονητή και θα πάρουμε μια απόφαση μαζί. Δεν μπορώ να πω με σιγουριά ότι θα παίξω. Θέλω να αγωνιστώ και πιστεύω πως θα μπορέσω να είμαι μέσα στο γήπεδο». - Sokratis

«Είναι πολύ σημαντικό για μας ότι τα παιδιά που ήταν σε όλη αυτή τη διαδρομή δεν μπορούν να αγωνιστούν αύριο και θα παίξουμε και γι’ αυτούς. Στο θέμα του Μανωλά αναφέρθηκε και ο προπονητής. Δεν θα ήθελα να πω κάτι πριν από τα παιχνίδια, αλλά μετά τα παιχνίδια, όποιο κι αν είναι το αποτέλεσμα, κάτι θα πω». - Sokratis

Edited November 8, 2017 by Argy

[Rockafeller Skank]

I believe the Centerback role when our lines are that close and we re there to play defence has minimal role.

A good centerback with attributes such as pace and height which bothSokratis and Manolas have can minimalize a counter thread but I honestly doubt we ll see any form of counterattack against us in Croatia. We will possibly be fine with Retsos or Kyriakos in Manolas stead.

Sokratis will play man. that's the mentality around here and that's what people who know that our players fight for the NT would do. I doubt the Croats are as self sacrificing as our players. I ve heard one too many times the only one interested is Modric.

[bbaw]

the manolas decision is without a shadow of a doubt motivated by every dark, negative, underhanded, corrupt and anti-greece sentiment that exists in this governing body called FIFA. 

the guy got the yellow  AND sat out the next game - like everyone else who does the same thing he did - even it was motivated by the need to kill the clock. E V E R Y B O D Y does it, gets banned one game and thats that....

I cant believe FIFA chose NOW to make this decision, and make an example -  especially with the other injuries. They take the game out of the hands of the players, and into the hands of kleptokrtats. 

Can there be ANY other message than "WE DONT WANY GREECE TO ADVANCE"......

I hope the boys take this as more motivation, and stick theor collective middle fingers at FIFA and everyone else...

We play good in tight games, no matter who we play..lets hope they dig down deep and pull this off. 

Edited November 8, 2017 by bbaw

[Argy]

4 minutes ago, Rockafeller Skank said:

 

Sokratis will play man. that's the mentality around here and that's what people who know that our players fight for the NT would do. I doubt the Croats are as self sacrificing as our players. I ve heard one too many times the only one interested is Modric.

He practice fully with his teammates today I was just watching footage. I cannot see him sitting this one out either.