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Greece vs Belgium (3 September 2017- World Cup Qualifier- Karaiskakis Stadium, Piraeus)

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J1078    302

@Torontoblue 

That's what I was confused about I thought the result against Gibraltar wouldn't matter. Does that mean all 8 teams the results don't count against the last place teams? In points and the amount of goals scored? So for example if Greece beat Gilbrator then we minus the 6 points from our two wins against them plus minus the goals we scored? Still a little confused about how that works.

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Torontoblue    14
20 minutes ago, J1078 said:

@Torontoblue 

That's what I was confused about I thought the result against Gibraltar wouldn't matter. Does that mean all 8 teams the results don't count against the last place teams? In points and the amount of goals scored? So for example if Greece beat Gilbrator then we minus the 6 points from our two wins against them plus minus the goals we scored? Still a little confused about how that works.

except the last group. Group I has only 5 teams so it won't affect them.

this system is in place because of groups with only 5 teams. Wouldn't be fair to them.  

The rest of the groups the results against the 6th place team won't count. 

Gilbraltar won't matter( but still have to win of coure😊)Cyprus is the one that counts especially on the goals scored. 

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Molon Lave    147

Disagree with you guys, all teams within the group play the same number of matches so even the result against the last place teams DOES COUNT. 

 

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J1078    302

Torontoblue is right I remember hearing the the same thing when FIFA announced the groups... I will try to find it and attach the link.. 

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J1078    302

Take a look the Gibraltar game is not counted.. I have copied and pasted below.It specifically says "2nd place team with the best record of teams finishing 1,3,4 and 5 in our case would mean Belgium 1 , Bosnia,3 , Cyprus 4, Estonia 5.

NOT GILBRATAR

 

Qualifying group stage
Matches take place between 4 September 2016 and 10 October 2017 with seven groups of six teams and two of five. The nine group winners qualify directly for the finals and the eight runners-up with the best record against the teams finishing first, third, fourth and fifth in their section go into the play-offs.

Edited by J1078

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Torontoblue    14
10 minutes ago, J1078 said:

Take a look the Gibraltar game is not counted.. I have copied and pasted below.It specifically says "2nd place team with the best record of teams finishing 1,3,4 and 5 in our case would mean Belgium 1 , Bosnia,3 , Cyprus 4, Estonia 5.

NOT GILBRATAR

i thought I remembered reading that. 

Thsnks for finding 

10 minutes ago, J1078 said:

 

Qualifying group stage
Matches take place between 4 September 2016 and 10 October 2017 with seven groups of six teams and two of five. The nine group winners qualify directly for the finals and the eight runners-up with the best record against the teams finishing first, third, fourth and fifth in their section go into the play-offs.

 

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Argy    157
4 hours ago, RED SHERIFF said:

If we had drawn today...we would have been 4  goals behind Bosnia..

If Bosnia beat Belgium by 1 and Estonia by 2.

 

A 2-0 win at Cyprus and a 6-0 win over Gibraltar gets us second spot...

Also the extra point would be handy....As I am feeling as if though either Bosnia or greece will miss out altogether by being the 9th best second team.

Greece now have 10 points in a playoff table while Bosnia has 8 (Bosnia is there because they played Gibraltar twice and have more points in group H). We have to beat Cyprus to have a chance so we will end up with 13 points in playoff group should we finish 2nd. Don't forget, not only are points vs last place teams disregarded, but also goals. As we stand, if Greece was in 2nd spot, they would have a +3 differential, same as Sweden and Ukraine, and better than Italy, Eire and Bosnia and Montenegro (all at +2).

Also, Montenegro (odd man out in playoff group) or Denmark (tied with Montenegro but 3rd in group E) both played last place Kazakhstan and are equal on point. Both have Romania to play, but Denmark has the edge as Montenegro still have Poland coming up. As they stand in the second table, they are +2 and +3 respectively.

Greece have to get the job done in Cyprus, hopefully by 2 or 3 goals. If that happens and they dispose of Gibraltar like they should, I don't see them having any trouble with goal diff in the playoff group standings at the end of the day. 

Edited by Argy

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J1078    302

So Greece have 10points and Bosnia have 8points right now. But Bosnia have the potential to get 6points in there two remaining games and we can get a max of 3 points since the Gibraltar games doesn't count. Am I understanding this right? So a draw and a win in there last 2 games will only give Bosnia a max points of 12. If we tie Cyprus we are out as we can only get a max 11points since Gibraltar does not count. Is that right?

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Dutch Eagle    615

All results in the group DO count to determine your rank an qualification or not.

The results against all the Gibraltars off the groups DO NOT count in the ranking of the runners-up.

See this wiki page for the current standings. Bosnia is just #8:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2018_FIFA_World_Cup_qualification_(UEFA)

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Argy    157
34 minutes ago, J1078 said:

So Greece have 10points and Bosnia have 8points right now. But Bosnia have the potential to get 6points in there two remaining games and we can get a max of 3 points since the Gibraltar games doesn't count. Am I understanding this right? So a draw and a win in there last 2 games will only give Bosnia a max points of 12. If we tie Cyprus we are out as we can only get a max 11points since Gibraltar does not count. Is that right?

Greece's head-to-head vs Bosnia in the playoff group is irrelevant as only one will make it. Bosnia max out points they lock 2nd place. The comparison I am making is in the event that Bosnia does not max out and Greece takes second. Greece will end up with 13 considering they beat cyprus and their goal differential will only improve from their current +3. 

There is still lots to consider seeing that the playoff group can and will likely completely change even after today's fixtures. There are so many teams battling for a playoff spot in almost every group and a number of 3rd and 4th place teams have a more favourable remaining schedule than the teams currently in 2nd, including Greece (Cyprus, Gibraltar) compared to Bosnia (Belgium, Estonia). Things will become clearer after today's games. 

Edited by Argy

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Ellada2004    21

What a week were we screwed up the campaign, 2 lost points vs lowly Estonia and a missed point vs Belgium. Everything under Skibbe started of fairly well we got wins in the first 3 matches and then the late tie with a beauty volley from Tzavellas vs BIH.

Since then we have been unlucky and given away a win with minutes to go in Belgium, mandalos missed a sitter vs Bosnia for a sure victory in the final minutes. If our luck was better we would have another 7 points and be going for top spot in the group.

lets hope the team can rebound, I believe they will come out strong vs Cyprus and should get a win. Bosnia will be lucky to tie in an empty stadium and they don't match up well at all vs Belgium. Second place is still there for us but hopefully we don't miss out due to accumulating the lowest amount of points for all 2nd place teams.

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georgelaz    381

think we're still more likely to finish second than bosnia too.

1. they have to beat Belgium in an empty stadium and the got smoked by them last game.

2. Estonia has picked up form and they have to face them as well.

3. Mitroglou and Karelis will most likely be back so we can score some goals.

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J1078    302

Based on today's FIFA results it's now looking more and more like Greece if they finish second will be the worst of the second place teams... Every second please team looks like they've won or winning.

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Boxou    27
46 minutes ago, J1078 said:

Based on today's FIFA results it's now looking more and more like Greece if they finish second will be the worst of the second place teams... Every second please team looks like they've won or winning.

περίμενε για το παιχνίδι των ιρλανδών αύριο..αν ΄φέρουν 2 χ με σερβία και ιρλανδία είναι έξω. η οποία είναι και η μόνη μας ρεαλιστική ελπίδα αυτή την στιγμή, μαζί με το γκρουπ τών σλοβάκων/σλοβένων/σκοτσέζων. παίζουν μεταξύ τους στα τελευταία 3 και θα χάσουν βαθμούς. 

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Ellada2004    21

Results really did not go our way except for overrated England beating Slovakia. Need the Serbs to win vs Ireland and hope Iceland and Ukraine drop points.

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Athens4    34

Ευτυχώς που δεν νίκησε η Σλοβακία απόψε. Τώρα παίζει με την Σκωτία εκτός. Ενα Χ εκεί θα ηταν οτι πρέπει.

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J1078    302

As it stands right now we are tied for last with IRL so even if they get a pint tomorrow we will be the last place team.. not looking good at all.

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7 hours ago, Argy said:

Greece now have 10 points in a playoff table while Bosnia has 8 (Bosnia is there because they played Gibraltar twice and have more points in group H). We have to beat Cyprus to have a chance so we will end up with 13 points in playoff group should we finish 2nd. Don't forget, not only are points vs last place teams disregarded, but also goals. As we stand, if Greece was in 2nd spot, they would have a +3 differential, same as Sweden and Ukraine, and better than Italy, Eire and Bosnia and Montenegro (all at +2).

Also, Montenegro (odd man out in playoff group) or Denmark (tied with Montenegro but 3rd in group E) both played last place Kazakhstan and are equal on point. Both have Romania to play, but Denmark has the edge as Montenegro still have Poland coming up. As they stand in the second table, they are +2 and +3 respectively.

Greece have to get the job done in Cyprus, hopefully by 2 or 3 goals. If that happens and they dispose of Gibraltar like they should, I don't see them having any trouble with goal diff in the playoff group standings at the end of the day. 

The time you posted this however Montenegro , Italy Sweden and Ukraine have not played their 8th match although we have.

I dont give  a f*ck about the qualification at this point just make sure to not finish behind such a bad team - as they proved to be - Bosnia.According to upcomming matches. Its either gonna be us/Bosnia or Group I and Group D the team who gets kicked from the playoffs. Many teams have harder programmes however, so I really expect this to be settled in literaly the last 10 minutes of the last match of the last group matchday.

Slovakia has to play the other play off spot contender Scotland away. If they lose they re stuck in 12 points with a Gd < 6. That is their last match counting for second spot rank.

Montenegro/Denmark both teams have matches to play that can only give them points(have played with the minnow already twice) so they seem to be in a good position to take a spot.

Italy have to play Israel / Fyrom / Albania they re guaranteed a spot 

Portugal and Northern Ireland are also Guaranteed a spot as the max points our NT can reach right now is 13 and they both have more than that.

5/8 teams have already qualified for the play offs. 

Ukraine/Iceland/Turkey vs Wales/Ireland vs Greece/Bosnia 

From these 3 match ups the Ukraine/Iceland/Turkey group is the most possible in my opinion because they re literally scoring too little, so I doubt that they ll open their defenses in the last matches where making sure your opponent loses points is probably more important than winning.

Wales I expect them to walk over anyone in the last matches and make good points and good goal difference, so Id rank us as the 2nd favorite to miss the play offs.

Bosnia seems already lost from the play offs. Cant see them scrapping more than 4 points.

We really have to start considering the fact that we might be left out because of this criteria.

 

Edited by Rockafeller Skank

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Megas    10

yeh I think we are done after montenegros win this morning! not going to even watch tv in them 4 weeks.

 

Estonia game cost us everything.

Edited by Megas

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J1078    302

That's why I'm so upset with Skibbes line up selection... he should have went hard with our best possible line against Estonia and guaranteed the win as first place was never really in the cards anyways.. he made a bad decision and it most likely cost us the world cup. He took the Estonia game for granted . We needed to beat Estonia, and Cyprus and a loss to Belgium still would have been okay but Skibbe choose to go with a weak line up and it literally F***ED US.

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Boxou    27

to cut it short, we'll need wales-ireland game in october to end as a draw, and serbia not to lose tomorrow in dublin. this way we're in.

Edited by Boxou

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Boxou    27

more or less, then our only hope is england's group with slovakia, slovenia and scotland battling for the 2nd place. table as it stands in this group

1.england 20 points (+13)

2.slovakia 15 points (+8)

3. slovenia 14 points (+6)

4.scotland 14 points (+4)

remaining fixtures

 

october 5th;

england-slovenia (english win)

scotland-slovakia (scottish win)

table;

england 23

scottland 17

slovakia 15

slovenia 14

 

october 8th;

lithuania-england (result doesn't matter)

slovakia-malta (slovakian victory)

slovenia-scotland (draw or slovenian win, both work)

 

table; 

england 26

slovakia 18

scottland 17 or 18 

slovenia 15 or 17

 

we're also in with this as we'll have 19 points.

 

that's the only group other than ireland's one where the things are more simplified..the next one is ukraine/iceland/turkey and for that there will be needed more difficult results.

Edited by Boxou

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