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Suggested Call Ups, Starting 11

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13 hours ago, Dean97 said:

Yeah I guess your right. Especially about Vellios. He didn't play at all but gets picked. I don't understand him. Hopefully things change. 

The only thing that I'm crossing my fingers on is that this coach will learn from his mistakes and see what everyone else sees. I'm very skeptical and worried that he will think to himself that they were close to making the World Cup so he wont change to many things. I'm not sure if he's thick headed or he just trusts older slower guys but if he continues with his Tziolis and s%$#! call ups I fear we will miss our 3rd tournament in a row. 

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Tziolis gets respect from coaches because he is even tempered, professional, and experienced. He seems like a nice guy, which is a BIG difference to players like Tzavellas and Maniatis. However, he eventually gets found out when clubs realize they can afford real players (note that Ivic's first order of business at PAOK once he had a say over transfers was to remove Tziolis). Sadly, he lacks both the skill and the speed to be useful in today's game. I'm told that he isn't even a starter at his current club; it should be a no brainer for him to be watching the games from home going forward.

As for Skibbe, all we can do at this point is hope that he does learn from his mistakes. I'm just hoping that player managers are not making the decisions on who gets called up.

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looks like they do because from what i've heard skibbe is called 'χαρτάκιας' but even in the case they don't it would be even more embarassing for him.

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hatzidiakos of alkmaar who are 2nd in the dutch league said he feels more greek than dutch when asked about the nt. he has a greek father and a dutch mother however says he would like to play for us which are great news. i really hope nikopolidis finally calls him up in the u-21, he's been a starter almost all season long yet he's getting ignored. 

you may think there's no chance he'd ever play for the netherlands but in fact we just lost a cb to swedish nt. it's papagiannopoulos of ostersunds. 

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If Hatzidiakos gets the impression he'll have a chance with the Dutch NT, he'll take them in a heartbeat. Sotiri is decent, but would not get a chance with our depth in that position.

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I wouldn't be like to see retsos at rb and call up sotiri just to get some experience. We do have depth, but injuries happen. 

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I am watching Stuggart Vs Leverkusen and Donis and Retsos are on the same side. Donis beat Retsos are few times one on one. Retsos is playing leftback. He looks very fit and in shape. Donis looks dangerous on the right. But Retsos needs to be stronger in tackles because Donis shrugged him off a couple times. Also Donis really needs to work on his crosses. Anyway it's good to see 2 young Greeks playing at a high level against each other. Proud moment.

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gianniotas' team is 4 points off the relegation battle in spain's SECOND*** division and gianniotas himself is a benchwarmer :)

and some of you, want him to be a regular in a side that wants to qualify for the world cup and the euros. 

think about that. 

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2 hours ago, Boxou said:

gianniotas' team is 4 points off the relegation battle in spain's SECOND*** division and gianniotas himself is a benchwarmer :)

and some of you, want him to be a regular in a side that wants to qualify for the world cup and the euros. 

think about that. 

Well if he comes on as a sub and Is our best player then we have problems. Donis and Lazaros should be our starting wingers. Do you actually believe Gianniotas should be playing in the Spanish second division? 

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21 hours ago, Dean97 said:

Well if he comes on as a sub and Is our best player then we have problems. Donis and Lazaros should be our starting wingers. Do you actually believe Gianniotas should be playing in the Spanish second division? 

the fact that he doesn't get playing time there leads me to the conclusion he does deserve to play in such a league. 

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What We Are To Do Now

Enough of the pusillanimous cowardice of the Mykonos generation and our current coach. We should rehire Rehhagel (he is a free agent while Santos isnt). We would have a team of fighters again. Not the sorry group of the first leg of the playoff games. Imagine a XI like this starting:

Anestis

Galitsios - Malezas - Avraam - Zaradoukas

Kafes - Prittas - Patsatzoglou

Kapetanos - Gekas - Salpi

(I know Salpingidis and Kafes retired, therefore they would have much free time and would be always available for the Ethniki. Same goes for Galitsios, Gekas, Prittas, and Kapetanos, who are free agents.) I bet such a team under Rehhagel would have gotten a better result against the Croatians.

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OK lets be realistic, only players who are active and have a team and are getting game time should be called up.

Anestis could be the keeper he has had 6 shootouts so far current season, Torosidis the captain and right back, Avraam plays for Brisbane Roar and Malezas is a sub for PAOK. Giannis Papadopoulos, Tatos, Maniatis, Hussein Mumin (Aris Thessaloniki) could be midfielders.

Patsatzoglou, Fotakis and Taralidis play for third tier teams in Greece... that isnt enough to warrant call ups. Lagos would be a vital member in my NT... unfortunately he doesnt have a club for the moment.

As for our attackers... Gekas, Salpingidis, Kapetanos, Mantzios, players with the right mentality and fighting spirit are free agents. We could employ Mitroglou and Fortounis, however that would mean we need players who can play really well on the wing like Salpi did...

This would mean a starting XI like this: Anestis - Torosidis, Malezas, Avraam, Zaradoukas - Maniatis, Fortounis, Zeca - Tatos, Mitroglou, Klonaridis. Surely I am right if I state we have better material than this... or not?

Unfortunately our NT members of today do not have seemingly the same fighting spirit as Super League players a decade ago... perhaps they have more skill and raw talent but I am afraid we lost some part of that toughness that led us to success between 2003-2014. There are those like Kolovetsios who are tenacious but not good enough and those like Samaris who have plenty of talent but less perseverance. Maybe we should adapt a new playing style that suits our mentality. The only problem is that even now our center backs are our greatest asset and this is the sole position where we have real depth.

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1 hour ago, La Mendel said:

OK lets be realistic, only players who are active and have a team and are getting game time should be called up.

Anestis could be the keeper he has had 6 shootouts so far current season, Torosidis the captain and right back, Avraam plays for Brisbane Roar and Malezas is a sub for PAOK. Giannis Papadopoulos, Tatos, Maniatis, Hussein Mumin (Aris Thessaloniki) could be midfielders.

Patsatzoglou, Fotakis and Taralidis play for third tier teams in Greece... that isnt enough to warrant call ups. Lagos would be a vital member in my NT... unfortunately he doesnt have a club for the moment.

As for our attackers... Gekas, Salpingidis, Kapetanos, Mantzios, players with the right mentality and fighting spirit are free agents. We could employ Mitroglou and Fortounis, however that would mean we need players who can play really well on the wing like Salpi did...

This would mean a starting XI like this: Anestis - Torosidis, Malezas, Avraam, Zaradoukas - Maniatis, Fortounis, Zeca - Tatos, Mitroglou, Klonaridis. Surely I am right if I state we have better material than this... or not?

Unfortunately our NT members of today do not have seemingly the same fighting spirit as Super League players a decade ago... perhaps they have more skill and raw talent but I am afraid we lost some part of that toughness that led us to success between 2003-2014. There are those like Kolovetsios who are tenacious but not good enough and those like Samaris who have plenty of talent but less perseverance. Maybe we should adapt a new playing style that suits our mentality. The only problem is that even now our center backs are our greatest asset and this is the sole position where we have real depth.

I like the way you think La Mendel but realistically we can't field those players. Fighting spirit is what we lacked and that's why we didn't qualify. Im surprised you didn't mention Karagounis. Karagounis had the most fighting spirit in the team. As well as Salpingidis. Tatos and Fotakis are good players who should have had more chances in the team. They had skill and grit. 

We need to play fast players though. In today's era you need to have players who have skill and speed. We can't to play slow players like Tziolis. Maniatis has the fighting spirit also. That's what I like about him. 

Zeca is the most hardworking in the team currently. We need players like him. Fortounis, Samaris, Stafylidis and so on need to toughen up and look at the players from the past. Sokratis and Kyriakos show the fighting spirit. That's why I like seeing them play side by side. Manolas is very good also. 

I have high hopes for Donis because you can see that he likes to keep working and never give up. Plus he has speed and skill. We need to take care of him. Younger players like Manthatis, Androutsos, Limnios, Galanopoulos and Kourbelis show glimpses of that fighting spirit which is good to see.

By the way Pelkas scored 2 very good goals against Panathinaikos. Fortounis scored 2 aswell but Pelkas goals were better and harder to score. If Pelkas keeps this form going he should no doubt be in the team or starting 11 in the next games. 

I believe if we can combine players with skill, speed and spirit then we will go far. 

Players like, Pelkas, Kourbelis, Sokratis Papadopoulos, Donis, Anestis, Gianniotis, Manthatis, Galanopoulos, Manolas and Zeca. 

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Karagounis had the best spirit in the Ethniki until his retire. He was the Greek fighter par excellence. His absence was always much felt (as versus Germany, Euro 2012 quarter final).

With the bunch of players of today we should really play more attacking football. Like they did against Belgium (away game, until the red card of Taxi). The defensive robotic style did not suit them because players like Samaris, Tachtsidis, Tziolis etc. cannot fight. As a defensive midfielder, one should have much more tenacity than e. g. Samaris has. He was arguably our worst performer versus Croatia in the first half  - and there were several players who were s%$#!.

I wonder if Santos realized this at the end of his era. Against Colombia we played in the old defensive way but went down rather easily (of course Holebas made faults, and others too). Against Ivory Coast in the crucial game he didnt employ the trusted method he had used against Russia at Euro 2012 in another crucial game (defense first and counterattacks). We played in a kamikaze way (sort of), scored twice, hit the bar three times, had a couple of chances that went wide (Salpingidis' effort in the 85th minute). Against Costa Rica, we did not just sit at the back like Rehhagel's team did sometimes. Eventually we lost, but Navas had a great role in that, and we had plenty of opportunities (Salpi chance in the first half, Mitroglou's header during extra time, another chance when Mitro and Gekas hindered each other etc.). With players like Manolas, Sokratis, Stafylidis, Samaris, Tachtsidis, Fortounis, Donis, Mitroglou etc. we cannot play in an extra-defensive way because we wont get results. Where are the days of the Karagounises, Zagorakises, Dellas, Charisteas, Salpingidis etc. Now we have Mantalos, Donis (who scored 1 goals in 9 games this year for Stuttgart), Gianniotas (a great talent who does not play for a Spanish second division team) and other nice guys.

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@La Mendel You are very harsh on Donis. I have been watching Stuttgart's games and it's safe to say he's their most active player on the pitch. The fact that he has not netted more goals yet in only a mattaer of luck. He's a great player that can break well-organized defensive lines, technical and fast paced. Ideally I'd have him playing next to Mitroglou in a 3-4-1-2 but I don't think Skibbe will ever get rid of his boring 4-2-3-1. 

 

Talking about Skibbe, yesterday he said that the fact we do play the next official game in 9 months gives us te advantage to organize some friendlies and try out new players. He said he doesn't need to call up Sokratis, Manolas, Mitroglou etc cause he knows he can lean on them, but we'll try to integrate Karelis back in the squad as well as try out other Greeks who play abroad. I hope Charisis, Hatzidiakos and ofc Siovas are amongst them, as well as Mpakakis, Koutris, Kone, Pelkas and Kourmpelis (who have been around but not starting). I'd like to see Limnios there, he's getting more and more starts in PAOK and I'd rather have him over the bust Gianniotas. 

 

He also said that we'll have to replace some guys who got older which was great news. I hope he's talking about Tziolis, Tzavellas and Maniatis. It has to be said that he was nervous about some players that don't play in their clubs (hopefully he's talking about Vellios, Gianniotas and Diamantakos) that will have to earn their spot. Good news but with him around I don't see it happening. 

 

Another thing he pointed out is that we need to start producing attacking players but claimed the results will be obvious in 6-8 years..

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46 minutes ago, Boxou said:

@La Mendel You are very harsh on Donis. I have been watching Stuttgart's games and it's safe to say he's their most active player on the pitch. The fact that he has not netted more goals yet in only a mattaer of luck. He's a great player that can break well-organized defensive lines, technical and fast paced. Ideally I'd have him playing next to Mitroglou in a 3-4-1-2 but I don't think Skibbe will ever get rid of his boring 4-2-3-1. 

 

Talking about Skibbe, yesterday he said that the fact we do play the next official game in 9 months gives us te advantage to organize some friendlies and try out new players. He said he doesn't need to call up Sokratis, Manolas, Mitroglou etc cause he knows he can lean on them, but we'll try to integrate Karelis back in the squad as well as try out other Greeks who play abroad. I hope Charisis, Hatzidiakos and ofc Siovas are amongst them, as well as Mpakakis, Koutris, Kone, Pelkas and Kourmpelis (who have been around but not starting). I'd like to see Limnios there, he's getting more and more starts in PAOK and I'd rather have him over the bust Gianniotas. 

 

He also said that we'll have to replace some guys who got older which was great news. I hope he's talking about Tziolis, Tzavellas and Maniatis. It has to be said that he was nervous about some players that don't play in their clubs (hopefully he's talking about Vellios, Gianniotas and Diamantakos) that will have to earn their spot. Good news but with him around I don't see it happening. 

 

Another thing he pointed out is that we need to start producing attacking players but claimed the results will be obvious in 6-8 years..

I agree with you on Donis.. This kid looks like the real deal for us and his production will come if he keeps up what he's doing. He has skill and speed which will always allow him to be productive. As far as Skibbes comments I really hope he is being truthful because those are very encouraging words but once again with Skibbe i will take the wait and see approach as I don't have to much trust in him at the moment. If in fact he is serious and we do see friendlies organized with new faces then i will start to believe it and have faith again. I'm sure he cant be that blind and he must understand the Tziolis,Tzavellas and maniatis have no business on this team.

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On 10/12/2017 at 7:32 AM, Boxou said:

gianniotas' team is 4 points off the relegation battle in spain's SECOND*** division and gianniotas himself is a benchwarmer :)

and some of you, want him to be a regular in a side that wants to qualify for the world cup and the euros. 

think about that. 

Spanish second division is much better than Greek super league...yet no one has a problem with Pelkas being called

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1 hour ago, Limnos77 said:

Spanish second division is much better than Greek super league...yet no one has a problem with Pelkas being called

That's what I have been saying. Although Pelkas has been playing more often and scoring more goals. 

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7 hours ago, Limnos77 said:

Spanish second division is much better than Greek super league...yet no one has a problem with Pelkas being called

amazing argument. so you're telling me for example that olympiakos who manages ties with barca at home, arguably the best team on planet, would struggle against second division sides. or aek against milan and so on. sorry we don't believe you.

you and the rest of gianniotas' fans should realise that this little bust offers nothing at the first place but for some weird reason have been hyping him like tomorrow doesn't exist. you'll be delighted to learn that he's playing in his career, so far, he has played in germany's second division, asteras tripolis, apoel and spanish second divison.

while on the meantime nobody out of 4-5 olympiakos coaches have ever kept him in the squad. that's for people who are crying claiming he deserves to be in the roster. LOL. he can't make the starting 11 in some mid table spanish second division club, but hey, he has all the tools to be a starter in a national team that wants to be a world cup and euro's regulars, or in a club which participates in the champions league every year.

 

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these are just some facts for his fanboys and people like you who are biased against our league. wanna hear something? greek league has plenty of serbian, swedish and even iranian internationals, 3 teams that are going to take part in the next world cup. while greece with its english/germany/spain second division bench warmers is not going to do so. 

and yes pelkas proves he deserves to be around. he's playing in a MUCH MUCH better team than gianniotas, is creative and the fact that besiktas and club brugge are after him says a lot. 

btw even limnios who is a regular in paok would do far better than this wanna be nt material. 10 months is an ok period for a player like him to blossom and i think he will do this sooner than later, kicking gianniotas out of the squad, where he should be, considering his career in club level.

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How can Gianniotas off nothing? We all said what a difference he was when he came on. His enthusiasm and speed proved to be vital. Yes he plays in the second division. Big deal. As Limnos 77 said the Spanish second division is better than the Greek League. Only the 4 big teams in Greece are better than most of the teams in the Spanish second division. Tripolis, Xanthi, Levadiakos and even Atromitos would struggle against these Spanish teams. Same can be said for France, Germany and English second divisions. We should just be choosing players who play week in and week out who are inform. Gianniotas gets picked because of his age and experience. Unlike Limnios, Manthatis and so on. But there is no excuse to not play Pelkas from the beginning. 

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Also Skibbe is more focused on integrating Karelis back in the team which is good because he is talented but he should be focusing on our midfielders and wingers. He needs to find the right combination. If the wingers or midfielders are not supplying Karelis or Mitroglou then what's the point of having a striker. We need players who can create and work with the strikers. Fortounis hasn't been doing this enough. I can't wait to see Karelis, Donis and Kourbelis on the same field together. Add Pelkas and Zeca and you have a hard working attacking team. 

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I don't think Karelis is a starter unless he replaces Mitro. There is more chance of Karagounis coming back. As a winger, Karelis would spear them left, right but not centre. like Korth Korean test missiles. Donis is the future on that LW side, unless he takes over as CF or as our AM.

Wonder why Mantalos is never in as a CM? That is hard to work out, rather than on the RW?

 

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Yeah I agree, Mantalos should play central. Karelis is striker. He can't play on the wing. We saw that against Estonia and we all felt frustrated. 

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