Jump to content
Phantis Forums
Sign in to follow this  
OFI-mtl

Can this team go to South Africa ?

Recommended Posts

No better time than the present.

Our next meaningful game will be on the road vs the Swiss.

This group will have passed another summer and will have to be primed right off the bat.

Will this old team be able to turn it up for such a big game?

Will Otto carry Dellas Basinas Charisteas and even Soto is looking out of synch??

Will the EPO have the STONES to sack OTTO if this squad drops 3 pts to the Swiss???

or will Otto and his 9 lives qualify for 3 tournies in 4 tries????

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

no reason why they can't....here is the key: what do we do when we get there?

the points i think are unavoidable:

1. defense has to get tighter....we are nowhere near the 04 temas defensive ability....

2. we need the mids to play box to box and give supprt to the offense...

3. we need speed on the wings to create pressure and take advantage of open spaces....

4. we need to infuse young fresh legs into the lineup becuase 2010 everyone will be that much older......

5. we need otto to give the team confidence to play more attacking style....when you line up 18 guys across the goal against Israel, what message are u sending to your team?

6. we need to learn to play with the lead....or D cant withstand the barrage that it got in 04....remember? like a boxer that gets hit over and over and never goes down...

we r not brazil, or spain...but thats ok....2008 should be a valuable lesson in terms of tactical change and adjustment....

still anything can happen....and we have not qualified yet...but we r in 1st, and qualification is there for us to give away.......

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Good question:

1. Yes, they can qualify if Greece can take care of Switzerland

2. No, if they lose to Switzerland and fall no worse than second place (assuming if Greece does win all 3 remaining matches) and end up in the playoffs, where they have a 50/50 chance to qualify against good teams.

I personally do not like the playoffs and for Greece to fall into that path and face someone like France, Ireland, Sweden, Denmark, Poland. I don't like our chances.

:rolleyes:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

With players used in correct positions, Greece does have an ok, if not good, generation. It's high time replacing players like Basinas, Kyrgiakos, Karagounis with fresh talent -Avraam, Ninis, even Platsikas-..

Switzerland is just a very poor side with nothing to offer except the two young Turks they have. Behrami's gone backwards, Barnetta is half-a- Karagounis in my book and their keeper, Benailio or something, simply sucks at top level!

A draw in the worst scenario at Basel will set Greece perfectly for the top spot in the group. I'm sure the Swis will drop further points in the remaining matches.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

With players used in correct positions, Greece does have an ok, if not good, generation. It's high time replacing players like Basinas, Kyrgiakos, Karagounis with fresh talent -Avraam, Ninis, even Platsikas-..

Switzerland is just a very poor side with nothing to offer except the two young Turks they have. Behrami's gone backwards, Barnetta is half-a- Karagounis in my book and their keeper, Benailio or something, simply sucks at top level!

A draw in the worst scenario at Basel will set Greece perfectly for the top spot in the group. I'm sure the Swis will drop further points in the remaining matches.

I think Kyrgiakos still has a spot.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm confident that the NT will qualify for the World Cup in first place in the group. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised to see them pull out a 0-1 win against the Swiss and go on to win the rest of their games (eerily similar to Euro 08 qualifying). I have a feeling that the team would rise to the occasion despite the tactics (or lack thereof) the way they did against Turkey. The pressure will be on the Swiss as they know that they'll have to win while Greece could afford a tie.

Although I have a good feeling about our chances of qualifying for WC2010, what we do when we get there is an ENTIRELY different story...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Kara and Kyrgiakos absolutley stay. Kyrgiakos is basicaly a reserve striker mind you the guy is massive on the offensive free kicks, he outscores Xaristeas even as a CB.

He was really not that bad the last game, and has been find for us. We need him.

Kara is not washed up like Basinas, Charisteas.

Disregard age, Karagkounis is in great form with this return to PAO, and hes still fast, he still RUNS non stop. Age is a number.

You can be 32 and still have it like ever

Or you can be ~28 and have LOST it like Xaristeas who has completly finished and been horrible for club and country for the last 5 years. He has a great relationship with Otto, and thats the only reason hes still called up and played 90 mins. Lets be honest, the guy compared with Mantzios of the last 2 years holds absoltuley no comparison in every aspect of the game.

Basinas, Dellas and Xaristeas are the only ones who really need to go away.

Patsa, Avraam/Moras/Papastathopoulos, Mantzios in their places.

Edited by drakos13

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I fully agree Drakos13 that Basinas and Dellas are finished, but on the flip side of the coin, Charisteas is still needed on the national team for his header ability and defense. I think he can play certain number of minutes like 45 - 60 per game. Charisteas is an engima, one game he can be very good and next game he is bad.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

what header ability man. Its really nothing special.

He was horrific from his so called " specialty" headers vs Israel. He had 2 magnificent balls to him that were must scores and he blew them. Put a Mantzios or Gkekas in there and we take 6 points from the last 2 games.

Theres nothing in the air he can do that Mantzios cant do better. Its time to face the facts, weve seen Vagelis in the CL and the league, hes got SKILL and WORK ethic, hes well rounded, hes not washed up. Put him on the ethniki already.

for headers on free kicks, Xaristeas is still not even close to being as good as Sotiris Kyrgiakos. Who as a CB is outscoring that worthless peice of crap from free kicks on club, country for years now.

Face the facts. Xaristeas ADDS NOTHING to the team. He hasnt had a strong game in FIVE YEARS. He occasionally scores a goal - that Euro goal vs Spain is about the only thing he has done bar an odd goal vs Moldova or Albania in the last years. Hes still not good. He cant hold down club job (or any playing time), he doesnt perform for the ethniki, and theres positivley absolutley NO FUTURE left in Xaristeas on the national team.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The tall Greek strikers are quite bad at heading the ball.. Samaras, Charisteas, Mitroğlou... I'm starting to think it's not a coincidence but a sort of coaching problem in the youth ranks.

Anyway, an unnecessary detail stuck in my book... :LOL:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I haven't been involved in this conversation, mainly because some of the comments are ridiculous and I don't know where to start. So I'll address some general points:

1) This team can go to South Africa, but let's face it, we have the weakest group in qualifying, IF we make it there it's not exactly a stretch.

2) Kyrgiakos is the best Greek defender and the best defender in Greece. He's aerially superb, passionate, and deceptively sharp in the tackle. He's also not as slow as people make out. As for the Sweden game, which you guys are criticising him about, he was superb! It was the best centre-back performance I've seen for Greece since Euro 2004. He made 1 mistake for the 2nd goal, but he completely dominated Ibrahimovic. Ibra had to come away from his target-man position and drop deep (where Katsouranis should have picked him up) to hit a shot from distance in to the top corner. There's nothing Kyrgiakos could have done there. He's a top class defender and is capable of playing for a very good team in the Premiership, i.e. Aston Villa or Everton. So he's perfectly capable.

3) Haristeas deserves a place in the squad, I too believe that we should try Mantzios and Gekas up front together, but Haristeas could be an excellent impact player. Why? Because he's fantastic in the air, anyone that says he can't head the ball is either blinkered by their dislike of him or they simply haven't got a clue about football.

4) The player that need to be replaced are: Dellas (too slow), Avraam (simply crap), Basinas (too slow, but can be a useful squad player with his passing ability).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Charisteas is on the club not because of his relationship with Otto, but because he does the little things to make the team better. The things that go unnoticed by most. I'm not trying to convince you that he is the best thing since sliced bread, what I think is that Charisteas:

1-Makes great runs to open up space for his teammates

2-Comes back to assist when needed

3-Is well liked by his teammates

4-Doesn't score much but when he does they do count

5-Is a big target for his teammates to set up the attack

It is vital to team success to have a player that has these five points like Charisteas does. However, players like Charisteas are only effective when there is goalscorer or two playing along side of them. If the team is doing well and scoring, Charisteas is one of the catalysts. That being said, he cannot create for himself like many other strikers do.

AS I said at the start of this blog. Not trying to say Charisteas is the best Greek striker, just that there i no other striker that does the little things as well as he does. That is why he has a place on this squad.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Haristeas deserves a place in the squad, I too believe that we should try Mantzios and Gekas up front together, but Haristeas could be an excellent impact player. Why? Because he's fantastic in the air, anyone that says he can't head the ball is either blinkered by their dislike of him or they simply haven't got a clue about football.

Brilliant in the air????? no. Kyrgiakos, Mantzios, Gkekas, Gkoumas - THEY are brilliant in the air and with their headers. Xaristeas is plain decent at best. The only reason it stands out for him, is because the rest of his game is utter crap and his goals at the Euros were with his head. Nevermind the 4 years worth of qualifying football where hes been pure trash and cant even hold down a club spot.

Reason why Im not convinced Charisteas aerial ability got 2 brilliant balls right on the spot and he did nothing. He does nothing in every aspect of the pitch for years now. Some people just need to open their eyes. That does not convince me. The player takes up space. I was a big fan of him since before the Euro. THe player has very obviously struggled to make a career or decent performances after Euro 2004.

Your explanation for every arguement is "You dont know anything about football" nab come on seriously...... And yes of course Im not blind your comment was directed at me, you may as well adress it and quit trying to make it subtle.

As for rationale of Xaristeas starting position, no you are wrong. Watch the games. Xaristeas has a stinker virtually every game. Xaristeas will be kept on, even when hes horrible, cant pass, cant dribble and another striker is having a much much better game.

When he scores they count? As opposed a striker scoring when they dont count?

A big target? Yeah a big target that doesnt score is real helpful.

We DONT need a player who is :

1 - slow

2 - out of form for years at the club level (and NT)

3 - Poor ball control

4- Poor passer

5- His name is written in stone in the 11.

6 - mediocre finisher

Face it. Its time for Mantzios to make his way into this team. Hes shown he can play alone (something Xaristeas can absolutley NOT do) hes shown he can pass, he wins headers, he holds up, hes progressing and hes READY.

Mantzios is the opportunity cost of Xaristeas. Xari's name is written in stone on the team roster. That IS because of a great relationship with Rehagel since way before the Euro .

I dont hate the guy, hes a historic player of the ethniki, a decent singer, but his performances have been keeping us back from our full potential. We should have beaten the crap out of Israel in TA. We tied, because Xaristeas cant hold up an attack, cant finish, and couldnt head. This isnt the first time weve been goal deprived because of his inabiltieis either.

I have nothing more to say on Xaristeas. 2004 was 2004 its 2009, and we seen basically nothing from him and theres more promising players now. Time to move forward.

But, since hes an inevitable player under Rehagel, I hope he comes back to Aris, finds some old form and confidence again to be a better player closer to Greece. Germany has not really done him good.

Edited by drakos13

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Drakos you're right about Haristeas, mostly. I think the thing people are missing here though is the fact that the reason he's not doing as good as he should is because he's being played in the wrong position. He's a #9 but Otto is playing him like a #11 or a provider; he's not that type of player! You can't play the guy w/ Gekas, it doesn't work, but Otto the nut continues to do it. I would keep him on the team but my starting guys would be Mantzios and Gekas. I would use Haristeas in certain situations depending on who we're playing. DOWN THE MIDDLE, where he belongs. To keep using him the way Otto has is just stupid. As far as his club team career, he would be great in the Premiership but apparently doesn't want to go there.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

as always great points on haristeas from everyone...

i think:

- he does do the little things well...things that are subtle and dont get recognized...

- runs his *ss off and gets back on D

- is being played out of position

- should NOT impede Mantzios progress

- cant pass or dribble well at all

- is a mediocre finisher

- has had very ordinary performances since 04......if not down right atrocious in some spots (Isreal)

AND YES WE SHOULD HAVE CRUSHED THAT HIGH SCHOOL SOCCER TEAM (ISREAL) 5-0 EACH GAME I AGREE

conclusion: start mantzios and gekas.....bring him in for high energy substitute preferably to protect a lead since he is a two way player and kows the system....AND u have a bit of an offenseive threat as the other team comes in deep to try and equalize or is plaing from behind...

Edited by mangas21

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Re temratofilaka xriazomaste, Xaristeas pote den ytane kalos, akoma den to pistebo oti pezi akoma gia thn ethniki.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.



×
×
  • Create New...