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AEK - PAO


PAO_OR_DEATH

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Karagkounis, the Euro 2004 winner, Benfica player and guy who scored yet another goal vs AEK yesterday?

Ninis? Does make a difference man quite so. And hell be getting better. Ivan is great, Ruka is out, and Gilberto does hold together the midfield.

Since when is DUDU a difference maker? Hes crap. Leto? Yeah he had that one good friendly game....lene oti 8a ginei o neos Maradonna !

How can you seriously come and open your mouth about how great OSFP is when they beat Ast Tripolis coming off a garbage result in Cyprus?

Thats why your Olympiakos I guess. Just that kind of person tends to be that team .

The kind that reads headlines and goes ooohhh such as:

Diogo : Den Einai Ronaldinho

EINAI KALYTEROS.

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Karagkounis, the Euro 2004 winner, Benfica player and guy who scored yet another goal vs AEK yesterday?

Ninis? Does make a difference man quite so. And hell be getting better. Ivan is great, Ruka is out, and Gilberto does hold together the midfield.

Since when is DUDU a difference maker? Hes crap. Leto? Yeah he had that one good friendly game....lene oti 8a ginei o neos Maradonna !

How can you seriously come and open your mouth about how great OSFP is when they beat Ast Tripolis coming off a garbage result in Cyprus?

Thats why your Olympiakos I guess. Just that kind of person tends to be that team .

The kind that reads headlines and goes ooohhh such as:

Diogo : Den Einai Ronaldinho

EINAI KALYTEROS.

its not the results my man its the standard of play. osfp was playing ugly to watch garbage up to trioplis game but in the 2nd half they lit it up and played beautiful. Probably one of the best halves ive seen in years in greece from a team. your telling me pao played well in the cl? they got the result but they did not play well at all. Gilberto. I dont know why people say he was the best player. GARBAGE! in my eyes for a 3m a year salary. Everyone thought hes gona turn out to be a Rivaldo. Rivaldo was a gamble and he turned out to bethe best player in the league Cleyton helps more than gilberto in myeyes. Yesterdays game both teams played bad

Dudu is crap? Funniest thing ive heard. Obviously u havnt watched any of the other games. I watch all the games I can and if not I watch the highlights. Do you watch other games or just pao but then turn around and trash talk other teams. Do not call Karagounis a difference maker. Hes probably the worst person to pick up the team and lead them to a win. Always wining and falling on the floor starting fights. Ninis tried his heart out yesterday hes a good player but what do you expect him to do? Look how old he is. You think hes gona win a game on his own?

please dont tell me the crap that gilberto makes a differnce in every game. You guys are just looking at the back of his shirt. He makes no diference. Whats matos' salary? Cuz comparing last years matos to this years gilberto Ill take matos anyday. Gilberto's salary mean he must be one hell of a player right now and should be able to double what rivaldo did but despite everyone hating rivaldo hes uncatchable in this league. He won titls at olympiacos on his own. Its also the position that he plays he can score goals.

Id rather have the players who perform on the feild play not the ones with the name on their back that more people know play. Gilberto was to please the fans. I dont care if he played for brazil or was at Arsenal. He didnt play regularly for a LONG time. And its not causehe was injured. Arsenal needed a DM this year after the loss of practicaly their whole midfeild. If Wegner thought he was good enough to play you thin he would sell him for pennies.

Id rather see players like ninis and cleyton play who came from the bottom and had to play to get to the top then players like gilberto who get a free ride on the feild cuz of what they did in 2002

and btw cleyton on one side ninis on the other would be killer. Dont knwo why ppl dont like cleyton.

Yes your right ivan is great. One of the best players like year and he was by a huge margin pao's best player. But what is m#$%! ten cate thinking to keep him on the bench for so long. Your losing 2-0 put him in early not with 3 minutes to spare.

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OK, back to the game. I have a few points:

1) HTK did not read the game well and, prima facie, he didn't coach the team very well either. I will never be another internet manager (we 've got plenty already) and, therefore, I won't say whether Mattos or Iv should start because I 'm not in training and, even if I was, I 'm not an expert - HTK is. However, to bring a player in 4 mins before time when you need to change sthing in order to score defies logic. And logic is essential no matter what you do.

2) On the other hand, there were two things that Ten Kate could not have predicted. Firstly, the very poor game practically every PAO player had: even those who expected Vintra and Sarriegi to screw up could not imagine that Spiro would be even worse and Salpi/Ninis wouldn't even show up. And it's foolish to put all the blame on Vintra and Josu. You can't really tell from TV but I think that when Vintra gave the ball away just before the 'penalty' there was no DM to be found for support and this is why he kept the ball longer than necessary. Nobody seemed ready to meet the challenge I say. Secondly, AEK played like Xanthi would: 9 players behind the ball from the 1st minute. They showed absolutely no intention to hold the ball and dictate the game or even apply pressure of any kind. As a result, PAO had no space to move in and, with everybody asleep on the pitch, there was no way they would ever score. Then, our CBs gave away a goal - a goal for which AEK did not have to do any work- and things got even worse.

3) Of course it wasn't a penalty and there is no doubt that it would have been a different game if it had not been given. However, this was not Vassaras' crime - it was the assistant who 'saw' it. Vassaras' crime was that, since the OSFP/AEK propaganda convinced everybody that he always favours PAO his only goal is to show the world that this is not the case. He played AEK's game, which was all about hard tackles and delaying the game. Of course, he is also a bad ref who wants to be on camera all the time and thought that interrupting the game for a little chat with the players would do the trick: every free kick needed 3-4 mins to be taken. The result: believe it or not, the real playing time was 40:18! Good for a team that doesn't want to play, bad for a team that does. In my opinion, this game is bad news for both teams: PAO seemed like a bunch of players who know the basics but can't play well and AEK like another bunch who don't even try to play football.

4) Pateras, my friend, Greek footbal is not about cigars and parties on the deck. What was all that euphoria about? OK, we beat Sparta and made it to the group stage - is this a good enough reason to throw a party 4 days before a big derby? Do you think that by saying big words like "I 'm ready to for them, are they ready for me?" the current regime will run away in fear? I know many of my friends on this board won't like this but the whole thing seems like a big party to me. And the worse part is that it's a party with other peoples' money, which is something that nobody seems to realise. I 'm listening to the radio right now and the typical chubby OSFP sympathisers who claim to be serious journalists are informing me that OSFP is great and will kick everybody's ass. This is Greek footbal, Pateras and Co, and you need to start trying to learn more about it because these guys will eat you for breakfast.

5) It's a good thing that PAO spent all that money in the summer but did they spend it wisely? Let's take a look:

--Mattos, Iv: more than 5 mil to keep them both. Good move, I say, but HTK was still considering his future when they made it. Now, he doesn't seem to like these guys all that much. Especially Mattos. Now what?

--Cleyton, Lazaros: I always thought, and still do, that these guys are not first team material. Both of them lack the skills and the personality to play an important role for PAO. Benchers at best. Four million we could have spent differently.

--Ruka: looks good, so far, haven't seen enough to form an opinion.

--Gilberto: he was called up for the Brazil qualifying games and, for this reason alone, I have faith that he will bring it at some point. He is not 32 yet and played for Arsenal and Brasil last year - who can blame the management for such a move?

--Melissis: if he really cost 2 mil, I only have one question: really? Then, how come he hasn't played at all yet if he 's so good? We need at least one CB, there can be no question about that.

-- Souza: I like him a lot but he is all alone in the dark. Now they say that we need another striker and a good left-footed CB and we 'll sign them in January. What kind of director of football says that? If you see the need for players you buy them now! Try to find them, man, this is your job! And you say we have the money so just go out there and sign the players.

--Gabriel, Moon: are they SBs? Are they wingers? Nobody knows... Not even HTK.

--Tzorvas: I like him and I trust him - let's hope he plays.

--Petropoulos: too heavy for my taste and certainly unable to play alongside Souza. Unless HTK finds an active role for him he will be loaned out very soon.

Overall, I see a lot of money thrown away. It's a new management and now is the time to smoke a cigar on the deck and think...

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4) Pateras, my friend, Greek footbal is not about cigars and parties on the deck. What was all that euphoria about? OK, we beat Sparta and made it to the group stage - is this a good enough reason to throw a party 4 days before a big derby? Do you think that by saying big words like "I 'm ready to for them, are they ready for me?" the current regime will run away in fear? I know many of my friends on this board won't like this but the whole thing seems like a big party to me. And the worse part is that it's a party with other peoples' money, which is something that nobody seems to realise. I 'm listening to the radio right now and the typical chubby OSFP sympathisers who claim to be serious journalists are informing me that OSFP is great and will kick everybody's ass. This is Greek footbal, Pateras and Co, and you need to start trying to learn more about it because these guys will eat you for breakfast.

5--Gilberto: he was called up for the Brazil qualifying games and, for this reason alone, I have faith that he will bring it at some point. He is not 32 yet and played for Arsenal and Brasil last year - who can blame the management for such a move?

I agree with you about pateras

I disagree with you on Gilberto. He was at arsenal but never played recently. If he was so good arsenal would have kept him as they needed a dm. Gilberto so far has only been here to show his name on the back of his shirt. Your telling me hes playing like an arsenal star (even though he hasnt played regularly for over 1.5 seasons) and a brazil star where i havnt seen him play recently

So far you could get matos to play better and not for 3m a year salary.

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I disagree with you on Gilberto. He was at arsenal but never played recently. If he was so good arsenal would have kept him as they needed a dm. Gilberto so far has only been here to show his name on the back of his shirt. Your telling me hes playing like an arsenal star (even though he hasnt played regularly for over 1.5 seasons) and a brazil star where i havnt seen him play recently

First of all, I 'm not telling you that. Secondly, Gilberto was not a first team regular but did play for Arsenal last season - it's easy to check it out. Finally, those of us who live in the UK know whether Wenger had a good opinion for Gilberto or not - even a few days before letting him go. In any case, this is not a crucial point in my comment. For some reason you feel the need to discredit Gilberto - I respect your need but won't go down that path.

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As much as I hate to flip-flop for the second time, I saw the play many many times since last time. There was on shot on TV that showed Spyro pulling Endinio's right shoulder down so I thought it was an infraction.

However, watching the play in its entirety (without frozen frames) it seems that there is no infraction. Both Endinio and Spyro are using their arms to keep each other away and there is no infraction. I think the assistant might have been influenced by the ball boys behind the goal that jumped up and down showing there was a hand ball. Of course there is no hand ball.

Even though I still feel the silly mistake by Vintra was the cause of the trouble, there is no penalty, and I doubt Vasaras would have called it against, say, the "team with all the players who make the difference".

http://www.sport.gr/default.asp?pid=4&aid=20530#

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The kind that reads headlines and goes ooohhh such as:

Diogo : Den Einai Ronaldinho

EINAI KALYTEROS.

:LOL: :LOL:

That is funny, you gotta love the greek press

As for the game... Bad loss by Pao. This game will cost them late in the year. From an Olympiakos point of view I think this is a great result because I think PAO wont lose to many points this year. I think the title will come down to OLympiakos-PAO (aek are still not at that level) and all lost points will add up. A draw vs Aek away for Olympiakos would be really legit. Its going to be another good year in the superleague.

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Hmm, I don't know about a good year. I was just thinking how horrible the two games I watched were. Olympiakos - Asteras was a bad game in the first half I watched, and only Oly fans think it was good because they dominated the second half. In my mind, this is bad for the league when a first division team can't even pass midfield. Then came the AEK-PAO game and it was really depressing to watch. Horrible, horrible play from all teams.

I agree with you Paxioti, I think PAO will come to regret this loss. I think this is what happens when you change coaches every year. HTC learned a lesson yesterday and if he stays another year he will never do such funky tricks with the lineup, and he will never underestimate another Greek team the way he seemed to have underestimated AEK (I hope).

Regarding Vintra gifting the ball in 45+, really there is no excuse for such goofy play. If there is no DM or CB nearby you supposed to give it to the GK (hence the importance of the GK being able to play with his feet). If he is not available, you kick the ball out the sideline so your defense forms properly for the threat. A last defender should never do what he did. I think they teach this in kindergarden football.

I don't understand why both our CBs did the same error. Sariegi in the first goal could have headed the ball high towards midfield. Instead he decided on a short, high-risk pass to nearby Gilberto who was blanketed by Endinio. One third of the blame goes to Gilberto for not reacting to the ball. Initially I thought he did not expect it, but Endinio was able to react to it, and so should have Gilberto.

Athinaios is right. It's not the end of the world. I hope my earlier post did not come through as if I was fuming. I will be fuming if we lose to Oly in a few weeks though :P

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Our weakness is the CB position, and they gifted both goals to AEK.

The AEK CBs were fantastic. Kyrgiakos was the man of the match. Thanks to Tzigger he is at AEK.

I disagree with the Vintra-Sariegui CB lineup. They are both mistake prone. I would feel much "safer" not having both in at the same time, but rather replacing one with Goumas. His experience might make the other player better. Just a thought. Melissis would not have played worse, I do not think.

Better luck next time HTC... ;)

Not being able to score earlier was very disappointing.

Terrible performance :tdown:

PEACE

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Do not call Karagounis a difference maker. Hes probably the worst person to pick up the team and lead them to a win. Always wining and falling on the floor starting fights.

Everyone has their own opinion and rightly so....but that comment just takes the cake.

Of the current crop of greek players... he would be very high if not the highest player in terms of lifting a team with his passion even if it is from diving and gettin freekicks. Hes probably the only player ive seen celebrate his own teamates goals as much as his own. Hes one of the few players who would chase down an attack in the 95th minute even though already down 4-0.

Lifting the team morale, confidence, passion, never giving up, winning free kicks is inspirational.

If that alone doesnt make a difference, then for F***sake nothing does.

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